Cruwear Military Questions...

I sharpened my Cruwear millie to 30 degrees inclusive and a 400 grit finish on the edge pro. I've found this to have a pretty aggressive edge with lots of bite. I've used it doing some pruning and landscaping chores around the house the past couple of weeks and so far it has performed well and the edge has held up very nicely. Still too early in the game for definitive statements, but I like it a lot.
 
Got a question:

On Zknives.com Cruwear is on the same breath as Vascowear/Z-wear/Carpenter PD#1;

The last two are the closest thing with 3V in terms of toughness (not to forget V4E), can someone shed some light on this?

Nobbish me but can Cruwear be tougher than 3v per say at the same hardness?:confused:
 
Got a question:

On Zknives.com Cruwear is on the same breath as Vascowear/Z-wear/Carpenter PD#1;

The last two are the closest thing with 3V in terms of toughness (not to forget V4E), can someone shed some light on this?

Nobbish me but can Cruwear be tougher than 3v per say at the same hardness?
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Jay, as I understand it 3V was developed from Vascowear/Cruwear originally. It was designed to get a tougher steel with as much wear resistance ( or close to it) by lowering the carbon and increasing the vanadium . Vanadium carbides have more wear resistance than tungsten or Moly, so this gave a better ( smaller) grain structure. Without the tungsten it doesn't have the secondary hardening so it doesn't go as high hardness as Cruwear ( which can be worked at up to rc 64). 3V doesn't need to though. It has almost as much wear at rc 58 with much, much more toughness. 3V does lose toughness pretty rapidly over rc 60 so if you did want to run it at rc 62 or so Cruwear catches up in toughness. There is no real gain in wear for 3V in doing so, so it would be pretty much out of it's element and design niche in doing it. Clear as mud right?

Hopefully someone can explain it better. I did leave a few things out. :)


So....
can Cruwear be tougher than 3v per say at the same hardness?
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yes, but I doubt you would ever see circumstances like that.
 
The Mastiff said:
Jay, as I understand it 3V was developed from Vascowear/Cruwear originally. It was designed to get a tougher steel with as much wear resistance ( or close to it) by lowering the carbon and increasing the vanadium . Vanadium carbides have more wear resistance than tungsten or Moly, so this gave a better ( smaller) grain structure. Without the tungsten it doesn't have the secondary hardening so it doesn't go as high hardness as Cruwear ( which can be worked at up to rc 64). 3V doesn't need to though. It has almost as much wear at rc 58 with much, much more toughness. 3V does lose toughness pretty rapidly over rc 60 so if you did want to run it at rc 62 or so Cruwear catches up in toughness. There is no real gain in wear for 3V in doing so, so it would be pretty much out of it's element and design niche in doing it. Clear as mud right?

Hopefully someone can explain it better. I did leave a few things out. :)


So.... yes, but I doubt you would ever see circumstances like that.
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Made sense to me. Instead of comparing this steel to that at the same hardness, forget the hardness number and say at "optimal hardness" for customs, and "production optimal hardness" for production blades. Then if you want, you can get into why 3V should not be taken to the same level of hardness as CPM CRUWEAR.
 
nccole said:
Made sense to me. Instead of comparing this steel to that at the same hardness, forget the hardness number and say at "optimal hardness" for customs, and "production optimal hardness" for production blades. Then if you want, you can get into why 3V should not be taken to the same level of hardness as CPM CRUWEAR.
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nccole,

Pardon my aging.
Say on the optimal hardness for both custom and production blades, what would it be? Let's take a folder in this case, Millie and maybe get one done in 3V, same grind, profile, dimension but a different hardness, what would be the performance already?

I try to think what are you thinking but i still couldn't quite figure it out what you thought:p

j
 
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JayGoliath said:
nccole,

Pardon my aging.
Say on the optimal hardness for both custom and production blades, what would it be? Let's take a folder in this case, Millie and maybe one done in 3V, same grind, profile, dimension but a different hardness, what would be the performance already?

I try to think what are you thinking but i still couldn't quite figure it out what you thought:p
Click to expand...

I made a distinction between optimal hardness for production and custom makers because they are typically different. I did that because in general custom makers will run the hardness a little higher to squeeze more performance out where as a production company will run it lower to avoid potential chipping/rolling in most cases. That and custom makers might only heat treat one or a few blades at a time where production companies have to keep mass production in mind.

"Optimal" would be different for every steel, and is still subjective to one's opinion of what attribute they were after vs. what they are willing to give up.


The main point is to not compare 3V to CRUWEAR at the same hardness, that does not actually compare "apples to apples" Comparing 3V to CRUWEAR properly would be 3V around 59 and CRUWEAR around 64. This way you have each alloy represented optimally.
 
Yay, my Cruwear Military should be here tomorrow! Glad I was able to finally score one from a dealer for a good/normal price. Thanks Spyderco, keeping making awesome blades and I'll keep buying them!
 
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