Current Military and Law Enforcement Knives

I know of no PD that issues any type of knife. If the department issues it, that department would also have to train its officers in its use. And in this day and age of massive anti-LE sentiment, amongst other things, I highly doubt any department would risk an issued knife.
 
dano said:
I know of no PD that issues any type of knife. If the department issues it, that department would also have to train its officers in its use. And in this day and age of massive anti-LE sentiment, amongst other things, I highly doubt any department would risk an issued knife.
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Not to mention that in this day and age of municipal budget shortfalls, if the PD issues it the PD has to pay for it. That's our city, anyways.

If I was the chief I wouldn't issue one to my department either. There's enough to train on as it is.
 
The Whip said:
Wow, a lot of drivel has been spewed in this thread already! I'll start by verifying some assertions about Cold Steel and SOG.

U.S. Navy SEALs (along with many other U.S. special operations and other frontline soldiers, as well as some allied troops) are issued and privately purchase Cold Steel knives, as evidenced in my thread here:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/cold-steel-knives-in-combat.1365808/


U.S. Navy SEALs (along with many other U.S. special operations and other frontline soldiers, as well as some allied troops) are issued and privately purchase SOG knives, as evidenced in my thread here:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/soldiers-and-their-sog-knives.1616050/


Pinemoon, I find this topic very interesting, as well. The problem is, your questions get asked fairly frequently, with the same smattering of answers, half-answers, anecdotal answers, and non-answers. The people with a lot of knowledge on the topic have stopped bothering to respond. Plus, entire books have been written about the subject, with a lot more facts, details, and verifications than you're going to find here.

From my own studies, I can tell you that just about every major U.S. knife manufacturer has had a military procurement contract for some of its knives at one point or another, including:

Cold Steel
SOG Knives
Benchmade
Mission
Spyderco
Emerson Knives
Gerber
Buck
Case
Camillus
Ontario
Ka-Bar
Colonial
Strider
Hogue
CRKT
United (Smith & Wesson)


There have also been plenty of unit procurements made with these companies. Individual unit procurements also occur with lots of smaller suppliers. A few examples include:

Winkler Knives
Mad Dog Knives
Ox Forge
Ernest Emerson (customs)
Chris Reeve
Microtech


As for law enforcement, the answers are almost as varied, though contracts are almost never used. Small-batch procurements with most of the major companies tend to dominate. And it's often specialty and tactical teams doing the buying.


-Steve
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Thanks for the information.
I've already learned a lot from this thread and appreciate the replies.
As is probably apparent, I've not served, thus I come at this topic with almost no prior knowledge. I assumed the military issued knives to enlisted personnel, as a knife is certainly something I'd want to have as a soldier. But enough of you have confirmed that this isn't the case, which leads me to ponder why.
I suppose warfare, like many fields, has changed a lot since the Ka-bar of WWIi days.
I suppose many in uniform are disconnected from actual combat today, thus a combat knife is irrelevant to them.
And, since we no longer operate on a "draft system" the whole concept of "issued equipment" might have radically changed as well.

Law Enforcement do not appear to have anything issued either. As I said above regarding the military, I'd want a blade on me as an LEO as well. Maybe that's just because I'm a knife-knut.
But, like the military, times have changed. Tasers and other non-lethal methods of subduing a threat are probably more encouraged than whipping out a blade. We are also at a point in time where departments have to consider liability and lawsuits more than ever before. This last point has me thinking that a department's policy might then dictate that no knives be carried, or that only THIS particular knife be carried. With no guidelines, it appears an officer might bring anything from a SAK to a CS SRK.

At any rate, and not wanting to have this post go on too-too long, I'd like to focus more on military knives.
It appears, based on the above quoted post, that many deployed soldiers carry a blade. A smart idea if there ever was one. And, like a LEO, it seems they're free to carry anything from a SAK to a CS SRK.

Looks like it's the more elite units I should be focusing on. The SEALS and Rangers of the field, and I have a query in to Strider Knives for some insight.

@The Whip , what are these books you alluded to in your post above?
 
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When I served in the Canadian Armed Forces in the '90s, the only knives we were issued were a fixed blade bayonet and some kind of crappy demo type knife. Didn't use either much. I carried a SAK (Vic Recruit) that I used all the time, but if I had to do it all over again today, I'd opt for a good multi-tool.

I know a lot of Police Officers and the vast majority are not knife enthusiasts. Most have a decent multi-tool (lots of Leatherman tools) and a cheap one-hander that would make a mall ninja blush. I don't think anyone abuses a folding knife more than a cop; most would be better off carrying a small pry bar instead.

To any LEOs looking for a good duty folder, I'd recommend a full SE Spyderco Endura (for raw cutting power) or a Cold Steel Tri-Ad something-or-other (in case you're attacked by a cowboy boot full of meat.) Reasonably affordable and easily replaceable.
 
In 2008/2009, the Malaysian Armed Forces issued the Victorinox Outrider (camo scales), here's the link to an old Facebook posting where you can see the picture : https://www.facebook.com/notes/vict...ier-knife-of-the-malaysian-army/429283992918/

Here's a link to another write-up on the 2008/2009 version : https://leaf-vics.com/2017/06/544-atm-outrider-for-malaysian-armed-forces.html

The current version, since 2015 or so, is still the Vic Outrider but in digital camo scales with all black blades & hardware : https://leaf-vics.com/2018/10/688-atm-2-outrider-for-malaysian-armed-forces.html
 
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Victorinox also supplied a camo version of the Skipper model to the Malaysian VAT69 Police Commandos and a camo version of the Skipper Pro (with Marlin spike) to the Malaysian Navy. Here's a link to a YouTube video (it's in Malay language with English subtitles) :
 
Plus, a blackout camo version of the Victorinox Trekker was also supplied to the Royal Malaysian Police forces. Here's a link to a YouTube video (in Malay language only, but you can see the pictures) :
 
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There was a southern California Law Enforcement Agency that issued Emerson P-SARK knives to their officers. Darryl Bolke organized it and has written about it I believe.
 
tusk212 said:
There was a southern California Law Enforcement Agency that issued Emerson P-SARK knives to their officers. Darryl Bolke organized it and has written about it I believe.
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Thanks for the lead.
Looks like this was in 2002. I found an excellent article where some of my earlier questions about LEO agencies and the general lack of knife-related policy are addressed.

Some passages:

"Training outweighs restrictive policy when it comes to liability," says Bolke. "A perfect example is that our officers are allowed to hit people with their flashlights. Our department policy treats flashlights as impact weapons, and our officers are trained to use them. So we also wanted to train our officers to use their knives as weapons when a situation gets horrible enough that they have to do it."

Use-of-force specialists say departments who have acknowledged that officers may have to defend themselves with their "pocket knives" have taken a critical step toward a realistic knife policy that gives officers some limited coverage should they ever have to use a knife in a fight. But much work remains. And as seen in the examples of Ontario and Fountain Valley, smaller departments are much more likely to draft knife policies than larger departments.


The Knife, (the police version was modified a bit from this picture)

200px-EKISark by D P, on Flickr

From the article:

Emerson's P-SARK folding knife is the police version of an Emerson knife that was designed for the U.S. Navy's Search and Rescue teams, the SARK, or Search and Rescue Knife.

The SARK has a distinctive, rounded tip hawkbill blade designed to permit rescuers to slide the 3.6-inch blade under seatbelts and cut them with its serrated edge without stabbing the crash victim. Emerson modified the knife for police use by bringing the blade to a point, but still giving the blade's tip a curve that makes it a poor stabbing weapon but well suited to rescue duties.


Article:
https://www.policemag.com/338938/on-the-cutting-edge
 
I was issued a Gerber Multi-tool and immediately gave that POS away. Once I’d picked up a SwissTool I never looked back.
As for folders/fixed blades, I carried a variety over my military career including CRK(Sebenza, Project I and Shadow IV), REKAT Carnivore/Sifu, Spyderco Military, Emerson Conmander, Buck Strider solution 888, Benchmade Nimravus, Fehrman Last Chance/Peacemaker and a variety of Cold Steel Voyagers. I never really had a problem with my unit commands or theft but then I was discreet, responsible, respectful of others and guarded my shit like a jealous lover.
I carried a small Voyager clip point solely as a lender as I would never let anyone use my good knives. Someone made a point about theft and privates and they were not wrong.
 
One unit issued me a wristwatch so why not a a knife?

Bottom line probably is cost. Let’s say you have a battalion of 600 soldiers. If every service member is issued a Griptilian at at $100 per knife, it would cost the Army 60K to outfit just one battalion. Imagine the cost to outfit a brigade or a division. These figures completely ignore the logistics cost of getting the item to the service member or to maintain
the item in the supply system to begin with.

When you look at it from a logistic standpoint, suppling a knife to every soldier becomes an unrealistic and costly nightmare.

Just think what budget the Swiss have for knives.
 
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sabre cat said:
One unit issued me a wristwatch so why not a a knife?

Bottom line probably is cost. Let’s say you have a battalion of 600 soldiers. If every service member is issued a Griptilian at at $100 per knife, it would cost the Army 60K to outfit just one battalion. Imagine the cost to outfit a brigade or a division.

These figures completely ignore the logistics cost of getting the item to the service member or maintaining the item in the supply system to begin with.

When you look at it from a logistic standpoint, suppling a knife to every soldier becomes an unrealistic and costly nightmare.

Just think what budget the Swiss have for knives.
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Yeah, fair points my friend, esp during peace-time.
Upon writing that however, I wonder if peace-time even exists anymore.
 
Lots of knives get a CAGE or NSN but that does not mean you'll get handed one in Boot Camp.

If you turn up at Boot Camp with a pig sticker they'll take it away from you. They give you a list of what to bring and what not to bring.

If the goal is to join up with a unit that gets issued cool knives so you can get one for free that's definitely one way of doing it but an another probably easier way is to just be good at your job military or civilian and buy what you like.

If you do sign up and get issued some sort of blade to keep (some of them you have to turn back in) don't throw it out, trade it away etc. Decades later when you're going through an old foot locker it will be priceless.
 
The Whip said:
Wow, a lot of drivel has been spewed in this thread already! I'll start by verifying some assertions about Cold Steel and SOG.

U.S. Navy SEALs (along with many other U.S. special operations and other frontline soldiers, as well as some allied troops) are issued and privately purchase Cold Steel knives, as evidenced in my thread here:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/cold-steel-knives-in-combat.1365808/


U.S. Navy SEALs (along with many other U.S. special operations and other frontline soldiers, as well as some allied troops) are issued and privately purchase SOG knives, as evidenced in my thread here:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/soldiers-and-their-sog-knives.1616050/


Pinemoon, I find this topic very interesting, as well. The problem is, your questions get asked fairly frequently, with the same smattering of answers, half-answers, anecdotal answers, and non-answers. The people with a lot of knowledge on the topic have stopped bothering to respond. Plus, entire books have been written about the subject, with a lot more facts, details, and verifications than you're going to find here.

From my own studies, I can tell you that just about every major U.S. knife manufacturer has had a military procurement contract for some of its knives at one point or another, including:

Cold Steel
SOG Knives
Benchmade
Mission
Spyderco
Emerson Knives
Gerber
Buck
Case
Camillus
Ontario
Ka-Bar
Colonial
Strider
Hogue
CRKT
United (Smith & Wesson)


There have also been plenty of unit procurements made with these companies. Individual unit procurements also occur with lots of smaller suppliers. A few examples include:

Winkler Knives
Mad Dog Knives
Ox Forge
Ernest Emerson (customs)
Chris Reeve
Microtech


As for law enforcement, the answers are almost as varied, though contracts are almost never used. Small-batch procurements with most of the major companies tend to dominate. And it's often specialty and tactical teams doing the buying.


-Steve
Click to expand...

"I'm going to make fun of everyone else's answers, then respond with my own anecdotal answers. THAT'S SMART."

:rolleyes:
 
Danke42 said:
My father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate knows a commando.
Click to expand...

Those commandos all get big hollow handled sawbacks to kill wild boars and make shirts out of burlap sacks.

I saw a documentary about that once.
 
The Whip said:
Wow, a lot of drivel has been spewed in this thread already! I'll start by verifying some assertions about Cold Steel and SOG.

U.S. Navy SEALs (along with many other U.S. special operations and other frontline soldiers, as well as some allied troops) are issued and privately purchase Cold Steel knives, as evidenced in my thread here:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/cold-steel-knives-in-combat.1365808/


U.S. Navy SEALs (along with many other U.S. special operations and other frontline soldiers, as well as some allied troops) are issued and privately purchase SOG knives, as evidenced in my thread here:

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/soldiers-and-their-sog-knives.1616050/


Pinemoon, I find this topic very interesting, as well. The problem is, your questions get asked fairly frequently, with the same smattering of answers, half-answers, anecdotal answers, and non-answers. The people with a lot of knowledge on the topic have stopped bothering to respond. Plus, entire books have been written about the subject, with a lot more facts, details, and verifications than you're going to find here.

From my own studies, I can tell you that just about every major U.S. knife manufacturer has had a military procurement contract for some of its knives at one point or another, including:

Cold Steel
SOG Knives
Benchmade
Mission
Spyderco
Emerson Knives
Gerber
Buck
Case
Camillus
Ontario
Ka-Bar
Colonial
Strider
Hogue
CRKT
United (Smith & Wesson)


There have also been plenty of unit procurements made with these companies. Individual unit procurements also occur with lots of smaller suppliers. A few examples include:

Winkler Knives
Mad Dog Knives
Ox Forge
Ernest Emerson (customs)
Chris Reeve
Microtech


As for law enforcement, the answers are almost as varied, though contracts are almost never used. Small-batch procurements with most of the major companies tend to dominate. And it's often specialty and tactical teams doing the buying.


-Steve
Click to expand...

So in your linked thread in your own post, #77, that's a young A1C Security Forces trooper in the bottom picture with the crossed knives. That's what I did for eleven and half years but I guess my experience is just anecdotal. Or maybe it's a non answer? Or well, I guess I just don't count...

Also, there is nothing in that thread that contradicts anything that was said by me or the other vets in this thread. The point being, our experiences are there's no universally issued knives. It's unit and individually based.

Good grief. :rolleyes:
 
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