Disappointing Customer Service Refusal Due to Mod

[Josh K]

I guess what I hoped to happen is that they would service it and I would pay for the service (I was never expecting it to be "covered warranty" service), but again I understand they have the right to refuse to do that. That's why I'm not angry/indignant etc., just disappointed that they exercised that prerogative.

I'm tempted by the idea of sending in another 21 and asking for sets of spares - has anyone had success in doing that before?

Anytime I send a knife into CRK I ask for a spare set of washers to be fitted. If the knife has a bushing I also ask for a spare bushing. These are two hand fit pieces, and for ~$3 it's worth having them even if I never have to use them. If I muck up a washer I can swap the already fitted ones into place and not have to send the knife out for 6-8 weeks.

If a knife can't leave the shop up to CRK spec, it won't be serviced. A big hole in the blade is not CRK spec.

This is a solid underlying point.

There has to an exact or same size washer available elsewhere . Don’t own a CRK so I have no idea of material, size etc..

I'm sure you could commission a custom order of washers to similar specifications, but it would be cheaper to buy another 21 and send it in for some spare sets.

To be crystal clear, I'm not recommending you use washers fitted on one knife for another, or that you could somehow retain the same dependable action and characteristics by swapping fitted parts around. The knife is modified, it's your knife, you should expect to keep that knife forever. Buying another 21 is one way to obtain similar washers.

 

[toocool006]

Anytime I send a knife into CRK I ask for a spare set of washers to be fitted. If the knife has a bushing I also ask for a spare bushing. These are two hand fit pieces, and for ~$3 it's worth having them even if I never have to use them. If I muck up a washer I can swap the already fitted ones into place and not have to send the knife out for 6-8 weeks.

To be crystal clear, I'm not recommending you use washers fitted on one knife for another, or that you could somehow retain the same dependable action and characteristics by swapping fitted parts around. The knife is modified, it's your knife, you should expect to keep that knife forever. Buying another 21 is one way to obtain similar washers.

This is very helpful, thank you. I do expect to keep this knife forever - it's still functional, it's just lost that 100% sebenza smoothness which I would like to get back if possible. I appreciate all the advice

 

[Josh K]

This is very helpful, thank you. I do expect to keep this knife forever - it's still functional, it's just lost that 100% sebenza smoothness which I would like to get back if possible. I appreciate all the advice

As some say, one is none, two is one, must have three. If you like it you'll probably have another in the near future, and can continue to service it.

The lack of replacement blades now I feel acutely sucks, but I understand all things do change. The 21 profile existed back to the Classic era, so there are ~20 years of knives that you can't swap a new blade into. I expect the 31 to be long lived though, and I love the improvements they've made in the model.

 

[Rhinoknives1]

Anytime I send a knife into CRK I ask for a spare set of washers to be fitted. If the knife has a bushing I also ask for a spare bushing. These are two hand fit pieces, and for ~$3 it's worth having them even if I never have to use them. If I muck up a washer I can swap the already fitted ones into place and not have to send the knife out for 6-8 weeks.



This is a solid underlying point.



I'm sure you could commission a custom order of washers to similar specifications, but it would be cheaper to buy another 21 and send it in for some spare sets.

To be crystal clear, I'm not recommending you use washers fitted on one knife for another, or that you could somehow retain the same dependable action and characteristics by swapping fitted parts around. The knife is modified, it's your knife, you should expect to keep that knife forever. Buying another 21 is one way to obtain similar washers.

Can you kindly post a pic of these extra washers you have so I can see how intricate they are..

 

[Josh K]

Can you kindly post a pic of these extra washers you have so I can see how intricate they are..

Not like it's a secret. And no they aren't complicated. But I stand by what I said before

 

[mqqn]

hole in the blade has nothing to do with washers , if he needs replacement part he should be able to purchase it regardless warranty status, this is not warranty repair .
unless parts no longer made or impossible to make .
looks like corporate bs to me.

I agree with this 100%. In my experience, with other companies like ZT/Kershaw and Spyderco, if you ask for something they are quick to send it out and most times for no charge at all, although now some are charging for pocket clips due to apparent abuse of the policy.

Are the CRK washers so finely fitted that they can't risk sending out washers? I thought their knives are made to such high tolerances....

I applaud the OP for being so tactful as to not rankle the CRK fans with the inquiry. I would be disappointed too.

And, why in the world did you want a Spydie-hole in your CRK?

best

mqqn

 

[BD_01]

That's a great idea - unfortunately I just looked into that option and the website says "Outside of WARRANTY purposes, blade replacements are no longer available for the Sebenza 21"

OOF!

I do have another seb - but curious how you would get a spare set of washers - just send in the seb without "lost" washers?

Take your other 21 apart and see if the washers without (and/or with) the bushing will cure your spydiebenza. If so, send your “good” sebenza in for spa service and request a new bushing and two sets of replacement washers.

They will return the old parts and you can make your invalidated sebenza whole again.

I’ve played with the washers & bushings on the 21’s I have. In my experience, sometimes swapping will work, sometimes it won’t.

if the swapped parts are two stiff, you could always try fitting them yourself.

 

[Rhinoknives1]

No, they aren’t complicated, I don’t make folders, still nothing special I can see? There are most likely some in that size available. Perhaps not in Bronze, but ones that would work without having a machinist do a special run of them.

 

[Josh K]

Are the CRK washers so finely fitted that they can't risk sending out washers? I thought their knives are made to such high tolerances....

I applaud the OP for being so tactful as to not rankle the CRK fans with the inquiry. I would be disappointed too.

Well, in short, yes. The washers and bushing are fitted to each Sebenza.

 

[kniferbro]

I agree with this 100%. In my experience, with other companies like ZT/Kershaw and Spyderco, if you ask for something they are quick to send it out and most times for no charge at all, although now some are charging for pocket clips due to apparent abuse of the policy.

Are the CRK washers so finely fitted that they can't risk sending out washers? I thought their knives are made to such high tolerances....

I applaud the OP for being so tactful as to not rankle the CRK fans with the inquiry. I would be disappointed too.

And, why in the world did you want a Spydie-hole in your CRK?

best

mqqn

They are made to high tolerances but the washers and bushings are hand fit to each knife at least for the Sebenza which is a, as they call it, "fit knife". The Inkosi on the other hand is what they call an "assembled knife" and there is no hand fitting done. I think a maker/company is within their right to say "you know what any knife that leaves this shop is going to up to our spec, no ands, ifs, or buts". If they can work around a mod and still put out an up-to-their-specs knife, they will. If not, you have this situation. ZT sending out stamped generic washers is not the same as CRK fitting a pivot bushing and washers IMO.

 

[The Aflac Duck]

No, they aren’t complicated, I don’t make folders, still nothing special I can see? There are most likely some in that size available. Perhaps not in Bronze, but ones that would work without having a machinist do a special run of them.

They are a different size on each side, and good luck finding a washer that looks like this. I’m also curious why you’re giving advice on CRK’s if you don’t even own one?

 

[Rhinoknives1]

They are a different size on each side, and good luck finding a washer that looks like this. I’m also curious why you’re giving advice on CRK’s if you don’t even own one?

I can see they are different sizes. Just cause I don’t make folders or own this brand doesn’t mean I haven’t been to folder makers shops & taken a few apart of other brands... Just letting the op known if he mics them and looks around. He may be able to find some that will work. They are many sizes available at supply houses, since he says CRK won’t sell him any.

 

[mqqn]

They are a different size on each side, and good luck finding a washer that looks like this. I’m also curious why you’re giving advice on CRK’s if you don’t even own one?

This reminded me of a Milton Friedman quote. "If you had brain cancer, would you insist that your surgeon had also had brain cancer before he was qualified to operate on you?"

That is one complex washer, and while I understand the washers are "hand fit" to each knife, a washer with a little bigger center hole is not going to put play into the operation of the knife, would it?

Anyway - I would also be disappointed. For the record, I have owned a Sebenza.

best

mqqn

 

[South paw draw]

This reminded me of a Milton Friedman quote. "If you had brain cancer, would you insist that your surgeon had also had brain cancer before he was qualified to operate on you?"

That is one complex washer, and while I understand the washers are "hand fit" to each knife, a washer with a little bigger center hole is not going to put play into the operation of the knife, would it?

Anyway - I would also be disappointed. For the record, I have owned a Sebenza.

best

mqqn

Well seems you also don't own a CRK and have flaw logic. I happen to own a few. Even have one that's modded. And I know the one that's modded had just about zero chance of being warranted. It states as much in the paperwork. So if OP had read the paperwork he also knew going in that he was voiding the warranty. First thing he should have done was sent it in for spa treatment and got a second set of washers and a pivot bushing. Or wing it and pick up a second one and use the parts off of it. It's not rocket science. Even though you're trying to make it out like it is.

 

[Quiet]

This reminded me of a Milton Friedman quote. "If you had brain cancer, would you insist that your surgeon had also had brain cancer before he was qualified to operate on you?"

That is one complex washer, and while I understand the washers are "hand fit" to each knife, a washer with a little bigger center hole is not going to put play into the operation of the knife, would it?

Anyway - I would also be disappointed. For the record, I have owned a Sebenza.

best

mqqn

So, you put hand-fit into quotation marks as though you question the benefit of it, at the same suggesting that washers that don't actually fit would be fine?

Huh, ok then. Carry on.

 

[Peter Hartwig]

As far as I know the washers don't have to be perforated or slotted to work. For many years they were solid. I wonder if you could use Teflon? From what I understand they allow for a bit more variance and could be stamped out. Obviously even if it worked not a perfect answer,

 

[Cowboyfromhell666]

I'm curious as to why the op gave his blade a spydie hole?!!? Just buy a spyderco....leave the $450+ custom hand fit CRK ALONE....unbelievable.

 

[BD_01]

I'm curious as to why the op gave his blade a spydie hole?!!? Just buy a spyderco....leave the $450+ custom hand fit CRK ALONE....unbelievable.

The Spydie hole mod seems kinda popular right now. And I have to admit, large tantos with the Spydie mod look kinda awesome to me.

 

[WValtakis]

Ok, so the deal is this...the washers are hand lapped so they leave 0.0005" clearance with the pivot screw tight (according to Chris Reeve). This is the whole point of the bushing pivot system, suggestions to "make do" with aftermarket parts by people who don't understand how the system works just defeats the whole point of owning a Sebenza.

 

[Peter Hartwig]

Ok, so the deal is this...the washers are hand lapped so they leave 0.0005" clearance with the pivot screw tight (according to Chris Reeve). This is the whole point of the bushing pivot system, suggestions to "make do" with aftermarket parts by people who don't understand how the system works just defeats the whole point of owning a Sebenza.

Agreed, but if he can't get the correct parts, what other choice does he have than aftermarket ? Undoubtedly not a good position to be in.