Discussion-Production vs. Custom

Cpl Punishment said:
I'm pretty much looking for a custom skinning/game prep blade. .
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If your still looking, and you like a more traditional looking knife; Koyote has a couple for sale on the knifemaker for sale threads. I will certainly vouch for the quality and his blades are sharp and easily maintained:thumbup:
 
I agree with hollowdweller, most of my knives would be considered "semi custom", because even though they are ground out one at a time, unlike the large production companies that stamp out their blades, they are basically variations of a certain model. The most enjoyable part of being a knifemaker is making a knife to a customer`s drawing, hashing out the specifics, then creating exactly what the customer wants, and can`t find in a production blade.

John
 
tonym said:
If your still looking, and you like a more traditional looking knife; Koyote has a couple for sale on the knifemaker for sale threads. I will certainly vouch for the quality and his blades are sharp and easily maintained:thumbup:
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Thanks for the heads-up, I'll take a look-see.
 
Great thread, lots of good opinions here:thumbup:

Im not anti-production I consider Busse to be semi custom, as well as Bark River, and I have love for both these makers. I just prefer custom knives from small makers.

RAT, Busse, and Koster, and Bark River are great companies with impecable customer service, and are built on that small customer orientated approach that I love. Their is soul in their product. I just dont get that as much in SOG, Buck, Kabar, etc....

I also am a people person, and I like meeting the guy who is doin the grindin, and finish work on my pieces, makes it a personal experiance, and I feel like my money is goin a long way.:thumbup:
 
I have always purchased production knives until just the last few months. I always wanted a custom or semi-custom but always thought that they would be to expensive for me but boy was I wrong, Most of the guy's on here have great prices on their blades ( no more than a good quality production ) But I to would much rather send my $$$ to one of you guys as to one of the Large corp. companys. SO I'm going to lean towards the custom knife makers !
 
I would take a custom over a production anytime. I own a few production knives, used to own a lot more. After I bought my first custom I never looked at a production knife in the same way. I love the idea that (and this is especially true in forged blades) my knife, even if one has been made like it before, it is unique. For a little more cash I can get a knife just how I would like it, and know it is one of a kind. When my casual buying a "cool" knife once and a while unknowingly turned into a small collection, I realized I would much rather have a collection of one of a kind handmade knives, than a collection that could easily be duplicated by anyone. Plus I like knowing that if I maybe work a knife a bit too hard I can contact the maker and get it repaired and/or replaced my the person who made it. Most of all, I like supporting the small knifemakers out there. I don't think I have met one that hasn't been overly willing to answer questions and help me out to learn the craft.

-CB
 
coaldigger said:
Most of the guy's on here have great prices on their blades ( no more than a good quality production ) But I to would much rather send my $$$ to one of you guys as to one of the Large corp. companys. SO I'm going to lean towards the custom knife makers !
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Right. Plus while Spyderco seems set to come out with one no large production company is marketing a scandi full tang. None really covered the Nessmuk. I think Buck came the closest but it was STAINLESS.
 
Thats true HD. Wonder why nobody has went down a nessie road. They have gained alot of report with users in the past few years.

With customs, I also kinda like the anticipation of the wait time. Rather than an instant gratification.
 
great thread... there sure are a lot of valid opinions here...:thumbup:

i agree with a lot of folks.. there is a fine line between customs and productions... they both have their place in the collectors/users realm..
i own a lot of both... of course like a lot of people here on the forums, i started out with productions and have long since moved into customs... a lot of them too..:D

i am also a people person..i enjoy speaking to the makers when ordering a knife or when i have a question... the vast majority of the custom knife makers out there, especially the onese here on BF WS, are all top notch folks..:thumbup: that makes a big difference for me... i hate being told to talk to customer service or the warranty dept...:thumbdn:
 
As a knifemaker what I enjoy most is designing a knife that interests me and that I would enjoy using. I spend a lot of time considering ergonomics of the knife. I'm not a custom maker at all, but I don't consider myself a production company onto myself. I do the occasional one off just for fun. But its really no fun for me to follow someone elses creative ideas and try to make for them a knife that they've designed. Isn't that what a factory worker does?
 
Fiddleback said:
As a knifemaker what I enjoy most is designing a knife that interests me and that I would enjoy using. I spend a lot of time considering ergonomics of the knife. I'm not a custom maker at all, but I don't consider myself a production company onto myself. I do the occasional one off just for fun. But its really no fun for me to follow someone elses creative ideas and try to make for them a knife that they've designed. Isn't that what a factory worker does?
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I agree to a point. I also enjoy making what I would like to own, and use, but, I get a lot of satisfaction out of creating a customer`s "dream knife", one that they feel they need.

John
 
Stomper said:
I agree to a point. I also enjoy making what I would like to own, and use, but, I get a lot of satisfaction out of creating a customer`s "dream knife", one that they feel they need.

John
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John, I totaly respect you and your knives. We just get our satisfaction from the hobby differently. Get your satisfaction the way you do and don't listen to me. I'm not an expert at anything except agreeing with my wife. LOL. Your Kepharts are sweet as snot, btw.
 
This is a question that has burned in my mind since I started making knives! Good thread, Reuben....

I don't think there is a universally correct response for this one, really. It is an individual preference... but I'll give you my experiences...

Before I started making knives.... you wouldn't catch me dead with a custom. They were knives I wished for but WHY would I want to pay double, triple, quadruple the price when I could just buy a Cold Steel product and get a strong knife backed by customer service second to none? Production knives are (for the most part) cost effective, consistant, available.... did I say cost effective? I wouldn't be heartbroken snapping off a CS Bushman in a log when they cost $25 to replace. This is how I thought for many, many years and there is absolutely nothing wrong with this line of thinking.

After I started making knives I began to see things differently. I felt there was more of a "soul" in a knife I made with my own hands. My first knives were rudimentary and not heat treated very well, but I carried them for the feeling they gave me. As I gained more knowledge, I also gained an understanding of just how much the performance of a knife can be enhanced through proper heat treat. Then I began to see that ALL aspects of the knife could be improved with a little working knowledge. There are many production knives out there with HIGH QUALITY performance properties (don't get me wrong)... but there is only so much some companies are willing to invest into a $50 knife. If you choose to get a custom knife... realize that you are getting something that ONE person carved out of raw materials... poured their attention upon, concentrated their energy into and ultimately held up and said "This is ready to leave my shop." Each knife will be unique, which even holds true for those custom guys who get their blanks laser/water jet cut. Grind lines, handles, heat treat, assembly, etc... are for the most part, done by the maker, himself.

Most folks have no idea the amount of work that goes into making a custom knife.... Some understand this and appreciate it, but will never buy a custom knife simply because of the cost. That's cool with me..... BUT there are others who badmouth makers and complain of "outrageous" pricing for a knife that you can buy for $25 at Wallyworld.... spend a day with JK, Fiddleback, Koyote, or any of the other fine custom makers out there and then tell me you aren't getting what you pay for.... infact, I believe most of these guys are not charging enough for their products.

In the end, there are good arguements for both sides of the fence and I don't think people should be judged for which side they happen to be on.

What saddens me is how convenient production goods are (why sad?).... add to that the fact that you can ship anything anywhere.... or walk into ONE HUGE STORE and buy anything from groceries and video games, to underwear. It may appear to be an improvement to the consumer.... but we are killing our small businesses and closenit communities.....

The times when very few had freezers because you could walk to the corner for meat, bread and milk are practically gone... When every community had artisans like blacksmiths, carpenters, etc... where you could go to the local knife maker and say I need a knife for this... and he would make it for you... and do a darn good job of it because he saw you on the way to work everyday... and he cared enough to make sure you were happy.

We complicate things in the attempt of making them simple... and disconnect ourselves from the people behind those material things we take for granted. Sometimes the shorter path isn't always the better route.... especially when you gotta knock some people off the trail to move ahead.

Rick
 
My opinion stems from the soul of the knife. Since carbon steels are used on most of my knives I take pride in knowing that I am assisting a maker by receiving a wonderful product. the hours put into forging out weigh those of simple stock removal. It is the effort put into making every custom knife I own that makes them so enjoyable.

I guess I find it silly to say that a knifemaker makes production knives solely because helshe has many offerings. To me it is like saying a family owned restaurante is essentially the same as McDonalds JUST because they serve similar foods.

As said before, my reasons for liking customs more are almost entirely pyschogenic.

Rick, in talking about the soul of a knife and the work it takes to make you sum up my ideas better than I could.
 
I own both production knives and custom knives, and have nothing against either. To me, knives are tools, and therefore performance is the most important quality in a knife, to me. When it comes to performance, I find no great difference between the best production knives and the best custom knives. I don't care how much "soul" a tool, like a knife, has, but I can appreciate a good craftsman. All in all, I don't care much either way: a knife is a knife is a knife.
 
I personally don't think there is a lot of difference between a custom and production.

If the custom is truly a custom, meaning made to your specs then it can be a way better knife, personalized to your hand and needs.

If it is a "model" that a maker makes then IMO it's no different than a production. How good it is depends on how well the makers specs fit yours.
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Being a custom maker (of anything) doesn't mean you only do pieces by customer specifications.....

EDIT I take that back and apologize to the person I quoted..... by definition.....
production - regularly manufactured; not custom-made, specially produced, or experimental: a production model.

custom - dealing in things so made, or doing work to order: a custom tailor.
 
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I don't think I own any true "Custom" knives. I mean... this may piss some of you off, but if you really think about, how radically new is the design you had a custom maker make for you? Most of the "custom" knives I've seen are slight variations on a standard production model.

Let's see. I took a Ranger Shiv and:
Reprofiled the blade to have the tip inline with the spine for lots of belly
Had it scandi ground
Added micarta scales
Add thumb grooves on the spine

Is that a custom? I altered the blade shape, after all. I don't think it is, because when it comes down to it, it's not a custom knife, it's an altered Shiv.

Some of you do have some custom knives, and that's cool, but it's not what I value.

Now, what I really value is quality control. That's what I pay for. I like the idea that my knife passed through a maker's hands, instead of being stamped off an assembly line at 100 knives a minute. Even the semi-production makers like Koster, who have their knives water jet cut, still grind each knife by hand.

So rather than say Custom vs. Production. Ask me if I prefer small shops where the maker touches each knife to large production companies. I can answer that. Small shop. Everytime.
 
I would say that "altered shiv" is a custom.... you have taken a production design(made for the masses) and "customized" it to fit your specific needs.... sounds good to me...

Rick
 
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