Ed Fowler

Would they be relegated to natural gas forges Craig, or would they have to go with cold forging??? ;) :D


I started making my first knife at 12. Bought both Blade and KI at the age of 14 and was in love with daggers. There were many beautiful daggers in those particular issues, and some of them were by Ms makers.

I did stock removal until I was 23... knowing SOMEDAY I wanted to learn to forge. Not because I thought it would allow me to maker better knives... but because I thought it would make me a better knifemaker. That is more versatile and with a broader understanding of what is possible.



Is that too "boxy" of thinking??? LOL



I joined the ABS after I'd been forging for about a year. I saw the level of work that many of the Ms makers were putting out, and I wanted to be putting out work of that level as well. EDIT to say, I felt that by joining the organization and working through the levels of Js and Ms it would push me to work harder, and learn more in order to get to those levels... plus I'd have even more support by being part of something much larger than myself alone. Being only part way there now, I STILL FEEL THAT WAY.



The thing I really don't get about all this, is how there are some makers that somehow think you are less of a knifemaker if you're an ABS member.

Or the part about all the knives looking alike. I don't care if you're a stock removal guy or a forging guy.... unless you're somebody like Tai, Larry Fuegan, Wolfe Loerchner, or Stefan Albert (this is a small list of folks who have a very distinct and unusual style, FYI) Your work probably resembles somebody's in some fashion. Whether it be the guard styling, the handle shape, the blade profile, whatever.

Even if you do stuff like kitchen knives or straight razors, there's other guys making those and they are gonna have similar characteristics.

But all the talk about "ABS style knives" seems to be painting with an unfairly broad brush of generalization in my opinion. :)
 
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Does anyone know who authored the current ABS mission statement,… or did it just randomly evolve?
 
As far as I remember Bill & Margaret Moran, Bill Bagwell, Don Hastings, Paul Burke, Joe Cordova, Gordon Bloomquest, Handford Miller and possibly Ken Warner. Tai - you live near Joe Cordova, he is a good hand, you ought to call him.

This was the start, some changes along the way.
 
"advancing the art and science of the forged blade" from the ABS mission statement

There might be an "art OF the forged blade", and there is "science TO the forged blade",... but is there or has there ever been a "science OF the forged blade"?... bladesmythology?
 
Ed Fowler said:
As far as I remember Bill & Margaret Moran, Bill Bagwell, Don Hastings, Paul Burke, Joe Cordova, Gordon Bloomquest, Handford Miller and possibly Ken Warner. Tai - you live near Joe Cordova, he is a good hand, you ought to call him.

This was the start, some changes along the way.
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Thanks Ed, Joe and I are old friends, although I haven't been in contact for a while. Last time I saw him was at my old shop in Tucson. He came down for a lesson on forging iron meteorites.
 
Tai Goo said:
"advancing the art and science of the forged blade" from the ABS mission statement

There might be an "art of the forged blade", and there is "science TO the forged blade",... but is there or has there ever been a "science OF the forged blade"?... bladesmythology?
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Interesting.

Perhaps this is because the science of forging in industry has been well documented and occurs in a much more controlled environment than a bladesmith can manage in most workshops. There is little motivation for a serious scientific study to be done on forged blades. After all, we know that stock removal is a perfectly adequite way to make a knife for virtually any purpose. The forging process only adds variables. The reason I forge is because it is a part of metalworking heritage, design flexability and it is a much more intamate experience. I don't feel the need to justify forging with anything more than those reasons. Is that not enough?

-Nick
 
Rossi Knives said:
Interesting.

Perhaps this is because the science of forging in industry has been well documented and occurs in a much more controlled environment than a bladesmith can manage in most workshops. There is little motivation for a serious scientific study to be done on forged blades. After all, we know that stock removal is a perfectly adequite way to make a knife for virtually any purpose. The forging process only adds variables. The reason I forge is because it is a part of metalworking heritage, design flexability and it is a much more intamate experience. I don't feel the need to justify forging with anything more than those reasons. Is that not enough?

-Nick
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The only science “OF” the forged blade (in this context),… is "pseudoscience".

There is science "TO" the forged blade, but not "OF" the forged blade.

There is a big difference...
 
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Is it really necessary to hang on one word? You are right Tai... they should have used "to" rather than "of"... but it is safe to say they are refering to metallurgy, physics, chemistry... and whatever other sciences relate to forging. With all respect, I think you are reaching on that one.:p

"Your feeble attempt to be clever has been DENIED!" Dieter, Sprockets, SNL


Rick:D
 
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Rossi Knives said:
Interesting.

... There is little motivation for a serious scientific study to be done on forged blades ...
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I propose the ABS change it's mission statement to:

To advance the resurgence of blade forging, the historic decline of which coincides with (and is therefore responsible for) the onset of global warming.

That aught to be worth a couple $$$billion$$$ in grant money right there!:D
 
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Anyone who thinks we have learned all there is to know about the forged blade has a lot to learn!
 
This almost sounds like a new mission statement contest for the ABS!

How about it, a "NMSCFTABS"? :)

"To forge where no man has forged before."
 
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As for B.R. Hughes. He is one of the four founding members of the ABS. He is also a very well known writer on the subject of knives and has used many knives both custom and manufactured for hunting, etc. Because of his years of experience and familiarity with custom knives and forged knives in particular, I consider him very well qualified. I guess I cannot say I am impartial as I consider him a good friend and he has taught me a lot about knives plus being a great help. I cannot speak for Mr. Perry as I have not had the chance to be around him that much.
 
When I saw Sid Varney Damascus steel I realized it was pretty. I asked if you could make a knife out of damascus steel. He said yes you could, but it would not be much of a knife. There was better steel available that would produce a higher quality knife.

Since I was only interested in working knives I did not take any further interest in it.
 
Damascus? Ed your view is a bit incomplete. It depends on what steels are used, how it's weld, thermal cycled and heat treated. It can be a very good performer or not so good.
 
2knife said:
I dont mean to start a fight. But, while on ABS, I'd like to hear the qualifications of BR Hughes and Johnny Perry, non-knifemakers who are ABS Board members. Are they involved in making decisions such as judging?
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What is it you are questioning David? Why exactly would you "like to hear" their qualifications? Is there something about either individual that suggests to you they may be less than qualified for the positions they hold? Why are these the only two board members in whose qualifications and conduct you hold an "interest"?

Roger
 
Don Hanson III said:
Damascus? Ed your view is a bit incomplete. It depends on what steels are used, how it's weld, thermal cycled and heat treated. It can be a very good performer or not so good.
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Don, I believe Ed was answering David's question in post 153 above, not necessarily his current view on damascus.
 
David,

The reference to Ed being singled out and somewhat outcast by the ABS as an organization was in this thread by Ed. I have never heard anyone on the ABS Board of Directors speak of Ed in any regard other than normal comment made during a conversation at a knife show. Nothing like we need to get rid of that Ed Fowler. The only other ABS Bladesmiths I have heard say anything negative were comments about his style, (some people just don't care for it, or mine for that matter), and that in his articles sometimes he comes across as self serving and some of the information is BS. This is just what I have heard not necessarily my opinion. My personal opinion is that I think Ed is fine Bladesmith with a lot of knowledge he shares freely. While I don't agree with everything he teaches I feel he is sincere and does more testing than most.

Based on my tests with multiple quench I think it is hype used to add more magic to the knife making process. There may be steels that improve with the use of more than one heating cycle above the critical temperature but I have not found this to be the case. It's just another opportunity to over heat your steel and screw it up. There have been a few occasions where I used a multiple quench but that was because I did it wrong the first time and tried again. Testing a blade done this way showed it to be inferior to another done with a single quench and multiple draws. Knifemaking is not magic, it's science. Marketing is magic.

Daniel
 
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