Edge Hits Back Spring on Boker Stockman Knife Shaped Object

[shecky]

Don't file, don't dremel, don't punch. These things might work... if you know what you are doing... if you are lucky. The simplest, foolproof fix is to cut some soft-ish material (I prefer synthetic wine cork), thick enough to wedge between the scales, and place it where the blade will impact against it rather than the spring. Messing with the kick just invites other problems. Grinding on the backspring... yeah, not a good solution. The wine cork is cheap, easy, works, and doesn't alter the knife in any way. Do it once, you forget it's ever there, and your knife acts like a folding knife should.

I have Case, GEC, etc knives that do this. I even have one Case with an edge that rests on the back spring (now this kind of workmanship pisses me off). Sadly there are no brands that are immune. Some design configurations may be, but not brands. Can happen to slipjoints, can happen to lockbacks. Breaks your heart. There are a very few traditional designs out there that employ a some kind of a stop pin, independent of the back spring, that will prevent this from happening. As far as I know, this is a relatively recent innovation seen here and there. I've only seen this on some A.G.Russell knives and some that would not qualify as traditionals here, but would suffer the same problem for the same reasons were it not for the stop pin.

 

[Railsplitter]

I don't have my LionSteel Euro Barlow out right now but I believe it has a stop pin. I also have an A.G. Russell Pen knife with stop pins. I like the stop pin design. It takes all the worry out of blade rap and doesn't hamper the overall design of the knife.

Here's the Pen knife that I mentioned. Joints are nearly sunken despite the stop pin design.

 

[Wowbagger]

No really I LIKE having a flat spot in the edge . . . I do . . . I like it . . .
Nope, self hypnoses isn't working.
Today, day off, I decided to go for it. I mean it has been doing great shutting it carefully with a little snap right at the end.
So I just shut it like I do my other knives when I need to close it one handed :





Results ? Big ding.
Back to "filing" the kick. This time with the Dremal.
My first thought when I saw that big shiny spot on the blade edge, besides throwing the knife into the next block, was; what do I have to loose by grinding the spring at the pin ? I am about to put the knife in the drawer as a nonuser anyway so what if the spring cracks . . .
after shoveling the drive and "getting it out" I think I will try grinding the kick first.
Good thing it snowed.

 

[Wowbagger]

Do it once, you forget it's ever there, and your knife acts like a folding knife should.

I envision it collecting grit, dulling the edge (I only like polished and extremely sharp in a knife like this) . . . and just about the time I relax my puckered puckerer the cork gets cut in two and the edge hits again. I mean I am going to USE this thing not carry it around . . .
I've heard mixed views on the cork or leather thing.

 

[r8shell]

So I just shut it like I do my other knives when I need to close it one handed :
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That knife doesn't have a half-stop, does it? I'm a little confused by the first two pictures.

I've heard mixed views on the cork or leather thing.

The idea is to put the cork or leather under the kick, not where the blade hits the backspring, so it shouldn't cut through.

 

[sitflyer]

No really I LIKE having a flat spot in the edge . . . I do . . . I like it . . .
Nope, self hypnoses isn't working.
Today, day off, I decided to go for it. I mean it has been doing great shutting it carefully with a little snap right at the end.
So I just shut it like I do my other knives when I need to close it one handed :
View attachment 852877
View attachment 852878
View attachment 852879
View attachment 852880
View attachment 852881
Results ? Big ding.
Back to "filing" the kick. This time with the Dremal.
My first thought when I saw that big shiny spot on the blade edge, besides throwing the knife into the next block, was; what do I have to loose by grinding the spring at the pin ? I am about to put the knife in the drawer as a nonuser anyway so what if the spring cracks . . .
after shoveling the drive and "getting it out" I think I will try grinding the kick first.
Good thing it snowed.

How close are you to the ocean or a large lake? If a knife cost me that much angst, I'd probably toss it as far as I could into the salty depths. Just kidding but since you insist on letting this particular knife clack shut, knowing that the blade bounces past the stop and strikes the back spring, maybe a try at tightening the action at the blade pivot could be of some help. Not going to go into detail about how it's done, it's easy enough to look up. It's also very easy to over do it, and wind up with a knife that you have to push the blade closed.

 

[Wowbagger]

How close are you to the ocean or a large lake?

I think I can just hit one if I employ my catapult.
You know how the catapult got it's name right ? Well there are animal lovers in the forum so I probably shouldn't cause angst by going there . . .

That knife doesn't have a half-stop, does it? I'm a little confused by the first two pictures.

Well take about any slip joint, push the blade to 90° to the handle and it will just stay there, half stop or no half stop (it doesn't have a quarter stop either but it will stop there to . . . but boy oh boy give it another degree and whamO !

Well throwing caution to the wind I busssed out the Dremal, chucked up two, count 'em TWO ! new abrasive discs and got in there for a little brain surgery. First I put a flat spot just about where the spring pushes on the kick to start the blade on its mad launch toward the back spring . . . this flat spot acts as a damper, it goes over the lobe but then runs into a ramp that takes it slower to the large radius where it was free to fly around it's arc in the past.

Once I rounded the transition between the flat and the large radius and the other part of the flat which is what the spring pushes against to hold the knife close . . . we are now in the land of blissful, controlled, marvalicious blade closing ( and opening). It is a little easier to open.
There is a bit of an odd feeling about 45° to the handle where it stalls out a little more than expected but this is partly because I left the grit from the abrasive disc in there and it is grinding away and the grit size is breaking down finer and finer. The reason I did this was to help polish the surfaces. After a day or two or three I will wash out the knife and re oil it and it should be even smoother.

So to recap; I didn't grind on the bump of the spring at the rivet, I gave up on the diamond file because I couldn't get all the way over to the sides of the blade kick with it but with the abrasive discs I could get so close as what was left on the blade didn't last long. In addition the diamond file, though quite coarse for it's size, was just too slow for the amount of steel I ended up taking off the corner of the kick.

I have resharpened the blade completely, AGAIN, on the Edge Pro beginning with 220 (which I have used 220 from the beginning). It would have taken some major, major material removal from the edge to stop this problem and I am convinced that in this particular case this was not the solution.

The blade was being catapulted close by the large bulge (kick) driving the spring quite high out of the back of the knife, a fairly stout spring and a lobe on the kick that was extreme in how quickly the blade launched after passing it.

So really people who said grinding the spring is a stupid thing to do were right.
The people who said to add damping to the blade via cork (or leather) were right I just chose to do it by retiming the cam lobe shape and hight . . . maybe not as high a performance (closing speed and snappy sound) but more longevity (for the blade edge).

I have closed the knife twice as shown in the photos and the edge is still perfect. My constitution won't bear another test tonight.
GOD I AM TIRED OF RESHARPENING THIS BRAND NEW KNIFE ! ! ! !
(truth is I enjoyed using the Edge Pro once I resigned my self to the task)

Again time will tell but could it be . . . ? . . . ? ?
I'm afraid to jinx it (again) by saying.

 

[Will Power]

How about breaking the backspring? That ought to fix your blade-rap problems and over powerful snap...

 

[Reitwagen]

I've tossed a few flawed knives in the drawer, then later find that the flaw isn't so bad after all.

 

[Wowbagger]

OK . . .
er . . . I don't want to say it incase the gremlins are listening . . . but . . .


It's nice to look down the entire length of the apex under a bright light and see NOTHING.
You wouldn't think nothing is so nice to behold until you view nothing in the right context.
Then nothing is really something.

 

[Wowbagger]

I've tossed a few flawed knives in the drawer, then later find that the flaw isn't so bad after all.

WhatAYaHIGH ?

I'm kidding around.
What kind of flaws seemed worse than they actually turned out to be ?
Pics ?

 

[Wowbagger]

How about breaking the backspring? That ought to fix your blade-rap problems and over powerful snap...

Ummmmm . . . I'll file that under subtleties and high tec solutions.

 

[Carboniferous]

This is how I've come to close my Queen #06L one-handed to prevent blade rap (the rubber strip will hold up to a few full snaps, but I still try to avoid it):

 

[Wowbagger]

Carboniferous,
That's great; thanks for the mini vid !

I wanted to correct a stupid thing I said.
I didn't file the "kick" I filed and Dremaled a corner on the "tang".
I just saw BF member Waynorth's diagram of a Lambfoot blade and got educated.
Yes I thought part of the blade was the kick but since it never left a mark on the spring or was marked by the spring, even when I put chalk on the kick I figured mine must be designed to be inside on the tang.
Anyway I worked the tang over where it rubs on the spring.

PS: your knife is beautiful. Looks like it is the real deal.