Ellis Knifeworks

Hi Mitch (Angrymob),

I'm not sure how to even go about responding to this message...I'm a bit baffled that you even posted this. ...I'm not sure how to even react to the skewed (in your favor) details above or the fact that you called me a liar. That's not a very nice thing to do, especially considering that we have never even completed any business together....and the fact that it is simply not true. Mitch, the date wasn't changed because of your phone call, it was changed because I made a mistake in looking at the calendar. As soon as I realized this, I updated the voice mail and the website, there was no correlation at all to your phone call. Mitch, I don't think you're stupid, and if I somehow implied that in the voice mail message that I left on your machine, it was certainly not intentional and I apologize.

Do you remember back in May of this year when we corresponded through email (when you placed an order and subsequently canceled it)? You asked me if you could visit my shop sometime to which I graciously offered to have you over for a visit to learn about forging, and to even take you to other local knifemakers shops to see how they have their shops set up? I think it's probably best that we forego those plans now.

Mitch, I'm sorry that you're angry...life is too short to be petty...take care my friend.

-Darren
 
In the original post on this thread ANGRYMOB stated that the only two times he has tried to contact Darren he was unavailable. Darren states that ANGRYMOB actually place an order and then cancelled it. Not only that, but it also seems that he talked to ANGRYMOB on the phone and invited him to visit his shop. That doesn't seem like unavailable to me. Am I missing something?
 
I think Angrymob at one time in the past arranged and order and cancelled it and had talked with Darren about visiting shops etc. Hearing that, the initial post seems even more out of line. Darren has always been professional, as evidenced in his response.
 
Darren Ellis said:
Hi Mitch (Angrymob),

I'm not sure how to even go about responding to this message...I'm a bit baffled that you even posted this. ...I'm not sure how to even react to the skewed (in your favor) details above or the fact that you called me a liar. That's not a very nice thing to do, especially considering that we have never even completed any business together....and the fact that it is simply not true. Mitch, the date wasn't changed because of your phone call, it was changed because I made a mistake in looking at the calendar. As soon as I realized this, I updated the voice mail and the website, there was no correlation at all to your phone call. Mitch, I don't think you're stupid, and if I somehow implied that in the voice mail message that I left on your machine, it was certainly not intentional and I apologize.

Do you remember back in May of this year when we corresponded through email (when you placed an order and subsequently canceled it)? You asked me if you could visit my shop sometime to which I graciously offered to have you over for a visit to learn about forging, and to even take you to other local knifemakers shops to see how they have their shops set up? I think it's probably best that we forego those plans now.

Mitch, I'm sorry that you're angry...life is too short to be petty...take care my friend.

-Darren
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I think it is pretty clear how I was made to feel or we wouldn't be having this discussion......I don't mind playing the bad guy, I have done it before, it suits me, but lets not pretend the blame is entirely mine. I wasn't rude, I was honest, even said you were a nice guy, Darren, and you call me back, knowing you made the initial error which brought on my response, and call me rude??? Then, in so doing, leave me with the impression that no error was ever made?? I am glad I got my question answered, too bad it couldn't have been in the form of a phone call since I missed yours. And I also recall our discussion earlier this year, which added to my frustration due to my inability to make a transaction for the second time........the first is a bit more complicated than me placing an order and cancelling, I will call it my mistake, though, as I was pretty certain I had just inquired and not ordered, but was a little less experienced in online dealings then. I also don't hold grudges once things are settled, I have always come across as blunt or harsh and probably always will....but that is my way, as for you being a liar, it was implied by your response, which I would have been much happier if you had said," I made a mistake on the date, I apologize, and you are still an *******", but, that's just me. As it was, you just left me hanging, with nothing but speculation, and if you put yourself in my position, you might be a little pissed too, but then, judging from the responses, I am the only person here that ever gets mad, so, maybe not........anyhow, thanks for the belated clarification.
 
TikTock said:
I think Angrymob at one time in the past arranged and order and cancelled it and had talked with Darren about visiting shops etc. Hearing that, the initial post seems even more out of line. Darren has always been professional, as evidenced in his response.
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I made an inquiry, got no response, went on to place an order with someone else, then got a call or email from Darren well after the inquiry.........so, yeah........you need to stick to the things about which you have the facts.
 
Keith Montgomery said:
In the original post on this thread ANGRYMOB stated that the only two times he has tried to contact Darren he was unavailable. Darren states that ANGRYMOB actually place an order and then cancelled it. Not only that, but it also seems that he talked to ANGRYMOB on the phone and invited him to visit his shop. That doesn't seem like unavailable to me. Am I missing something?
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I said....correctly, that the two times I tried to buy something form him, I was unsucessful....I sent him an email about buying a couple of items, and he responded a couple days later at which time I had already placed another order....until I either place my online order or actually talk to someone from whom I am ordering, I haven't ordered....and I think it should also be clear by now what this is about and that is as far as I am concerned, settled...
 
Darren's response was right on. Angrymob, sorry you didn't get exactly what you wanted when you wanted but such is life. Even if it was the 24th and Darren got home then, maybe he was too tired from traveling or busy to answer calls, who knows but any person is allowed time to respond. If you felt stupid at all, it wasn't his fault, it was yours for calling and leaving a message saying "I'm sure your nice but I will not be ordering through you, etc" all because the matter of a few days passed. I'm sure whatever you would have ordered from Darren would have been top quality had you given him his "earliest convenience" to get back to you. Which would have probably only been a few days if that. Any offense suffered by the ego is a matter of the ego. Or simply, maybe you turned him off by that message of words though you think phrased politely contained upset over a deal not made. That would certainly turn most people off. He did not curse you, and only just now responded to you and quite rightly. No deal was made so no loss was incurred. No harm no foul. So let it die. Heck in the past when I was ordering knives it would take some knifemakers a month to reply. I didn't care. I know they’re busy.
 
ANGRYMOB said:
I made an inquiry, got no response, went on to place an order with someone else, then got a call or email from Darren well after the inquiry.........so, yeah........you need to stick to the things about which you have the facts.
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Mitch, please don't be rude to other members of the forum. If you want to pursue this further, we can discuss it personally after we re-open on the 31st. This will be my last post to this thread.

I have all of the emails that I have *received* (made it through the spam filter) dating back to 1996...you placed an order, then three business days later canceled it before it was shipped. We even chatted a little back and forth via email afterward.

It's all a moot point though. I guess we're "settled" or done, or whatever we should call it. There's a good post by Chuck Bybee (especially the last two paragraphs of his post) over in the "Around the Grinder" area of the board...the thread is entitled "Deposits , what a stinkfest"...

Take care.

-Darren
 
and the winner is.......................

Darren Ellis is a first class guy. I think I'll do MORE business with him now!
 
Darren Ellis said:
Mitch, please don't be rude to other members of the forum. If you want to pursue this further, we can discuss it personally after we re-open on the 31st. This will be my last post to this thread.

I have all of the emails that I have *received* (made it through the spam filter) dating back to 1996...you placed an order, then three business days later canceled it before it was shipped. We even chatted a little back and forth via email afterward.

It's all a moot point though. I guess we're "settled" or done, or whatever we should call it. There's a good post by Chuck Bybee (especially the last two paragraphs of his post) over in the "Around the Grinder" area of the board...the thread is entitled "Deposits , what a stinkfest"...

Take care.

-Darren
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I have the emails as well....first sent on the 26th of may......cancelled on the 31st.....everything I order, I get a response the same day or I don't order it....so, there it is.......
 
TorzJohnson said:
I don't think Esav deserves to be called a sackrider. I would recommend an apology.
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He is a sackrider........my position, since I am a nobody, has never once been given an iota of consideration by him or any other member here, save one, so he can be called exactly what he is......and leader of the bandwagon as well.
 
Wow, this is absolutely RIDICULOUS!!!

Talk about how our society has fallen to "immediate gratification."

Why do so many people think that everything in the custom knife world is supposed to operate like main industy??? Sure it would be great if every knife outfit had a couple hundred employees like someplace like MSC, and could send out any item from an inventory of thousands of items that same day..... but that's not how it is.

Darren is a totally stand-up guy! I have done business with him, and will definitely do business with him again.

Angrymob, you taking pot-shots at people is only going to make any semblance of an argument you had that much weaker. Not to mention diminish the respect you have from other forumites.

I'm disgusted with your posts :mad:

On the upside of it...Way to go Darren... first class all the way :)
 
You won't even budge? still with names and delusions of instant gratification? You don't see that, that may be unfair? Heck, I'm sure you're a nice guy, but your angrymob mentality seems only to be coming from you and no one else.

Take a step back, a deep breath and think about this...

isn't it just a little bit fun ordering a knife and whether it takes a day, a week or a year to get there, whether it took one try or 50 tries to get in touch with the maker/manufacturer, ain't it the wait, the hunt, the desire that builds over time for the knife you want so badly that makes it worth while?

That when you finally get it and you had a great and friendly exchange with the maker or seller though it took a while. Isn't it that day when it all payed off that made the collecting habit what it is?

Peace
 
Angrymob, in all caps, among all the usernames to choose from...

Re: changing a voicemail message, that can be done remotely when needed, who knows what his time demands and needful situations were.

I got slightly upset with a recent ebay transaction when this past week I could get no response from a seller. It seemed I was being blown off. I didn't get rude, but, (over a week) it seemed I was being blown off.

Finally today the guy responded, he had been wiped out in the hurricane. Wiped out. I'm glad I kept my "conclusion jumping" to myself, and gave the guy the week he needed.

Sometimes you don't know why there is a delay, or why someone "needs a few days".

But you always know the importance of people - or you, as a person, unobserving the life of others, become unimportant, in context.

Because people do matter. Grind on them in a vacuum, at your own risk.

The life that becomes unimportant is your own.

Frank H.
 
ANGRYMOB,

I've NEVER heard a bad word about Darren. I've heard lots of good comments from knifemakers. I'm confident enough in Darren to refer customers to him. That means I'm staking my reputation on him.

ANGRYMOB, what is your name and where do you live?
 
ANGRYMOB said:
I have the emails as well....first sent on the 26th of may......cancelled on the 31st.....everything I order, I get a response the same day or I don't order it....so, there it is.......
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If you don't get an answer back on the day you order, you cancel? So you don't leave any leeway for a maker going to a knife show, or maybe on a vacation? You seem like a perfect example of the me generation.

ANGRYMOB said:
He is a sackrider........my position, since I am a nobody, has never once been given an iota of consideration by him or any other member here, save one, so he can be called exactly what he is......and leader of the bandwagon as well.
Click to expand...

Before I take too much offense to this term, could someone please tell me what a sackrider is? It is a term I have not run into before.
 
I forgot to add:

Darren, great responses. You have grace under fire.

Rather than just post a response I just placed an order with Darren for wrought chain. You can never have too much wrought iron! Darren, please process the order when you get time. I'm not in a hurry. ;)
 
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