Emerson

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I talked to Ernie today and we discussed virtually all of the issues in this thread. I will not answer for him as he will do that sometime tomorrow. I am not sure if he will address Les directly as it appears Les may have a different agenda here and I will handle that on a different level.

I will go over the issues I wanted cleared up for the members here.

If you have ordered a knife and placed a deposit you can call Emerson knives at 310-212-7559. You may ask for a refund if the current delivery schedule is not to your liking. There may be other options like those I discussed above but that is up to Emerson.


DO NOT EMAIL HIM! He receives a ton of email and simply does not have the time to read them all.

We talked for about an hour and I now have a full understanding of what he is going through. There is always two sides to every story and this one is very interesting indeed. Even though one side appears to be backed up with a ton of facts please hold judgement until you here it from Ernie himself.

I will wait for his post tomorrow before I say anymore on the subject.


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Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
www.wowinc.com

[This message has been edited by Spark (edited 06 April 1999).]
 
<a href="http://www.emersonknives.com"><img src="http://www.bladeforums.com/images/emerson-2.gif" alt="Click Here"></a>
Click on the Emerson logo (I just made
wink.gif
) to get to the Official Emerson site.

Also Ernie when you read this you may remember at the Dallas Shot show several years ago you promissed me the first auto version of the CQ series you make. I will hold you to it
smile.gif


See ya at Blade booth 85!

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Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
www.wowinc.com




[This message has been edited by Spark (edited 06 April 1999).]
 
Okay, first of all please understand that I am not defending Emerson or anyone else, nor am I hammering anyone. Like all of you, I have my opinions, and I agree with a lot of what everyone has been saying. I respect everyone's opinions.

Dano, I thank you for responding.

Marco, You stated Emerson's "biggest problem is lack of communication." I agree with you regardless of who the person is. But, do we all know if he has failed to contact all those supposedly waiting for an order to be filled?

DonL, You have a problem with lotteries, and I agree they aren't too cool. But it's been going on for years. Usually the guys who hold lotteries only bring two, three, maybe four knives to a show, and that's likely to be two shows a year. Why do they do it? Because they have to attend shows to meet people in person. If they belong to the Guild, they also have to attend a certain percentage of Guild shows to retain their membership. I'm not condoning lotteries, I'm just saying it's been going on for years. I know one folder maker at the Blade Show a couple of years ago walked in on Friday, and sold his knives right out of the carrying case in minutes. He didn't even get to cover his table and get organized. Now was that fair to those collectors who couldn't make the show on Friday due to work or whatever? You tell me. I've also seen collectors meet makers in their rooms on a Thursday night, or early Friday morning, who have bought knives before they even made it to the showroom. That's not cool, but it happens when people's knives are in demand.

DougMason, I agree with you that not contacting customers is wrong. But, again, do we know if Emerson has not contacted all of his customers.

Mike Turber, After reading all of the posts last night, I telephoned Emerson this morning and gave him your name and phone number, and asked him to call you or Spark direct. This was because I care what goes on. No, I haven't any of his knives on order, and as I stated earlier, I have one of his early custom gent's folders that I purchased years ago. I don't need a SEAL(?) knife or any other bad? looking tactical. Evidently, Ernie did call you, as you just testified. Now I hope he responds. I did tell me a week ago that he doesn't have time to read all the e-mails that he gets, although the gals in the office do take phone calls. Enough.
 
Can't believe I said that. I meant to say HE, not I, did tell me..... Sorry about that.
 
To All Members,

I would like to provide some information to those of you who are concerned about myself, my custom knives and my business. I will try to respond to the issues that seem the most pertinent and have aroused the most controversy.

1. Yes, I do make custom knives, although the numbers have been very few over the last couple of years. Yes, we still take orders for custom knives. Yes, we have missed our delivery dates by a mile. Mea Culpa, Mea Culpa.

2. We offer, and always offer, to refund in full any deposit, for any reason to any customer without hesitation. This has always been our policy. Oddly enough we have had very few customers ever cancel their orders.

3. My Company has literally taken almost all of my waking hours over the last 2 years to build it into the position that it now holds. This did indeed prevent me from attending to the custom work. Yes this did put customers for custom knives in what I regret, a holding pattern. Now that my company is fully staffed and is basically a stand alone entity I am able to devote a large portion of my time back to my custom shop. This means that knives will once again be made to fill the orders that we have on the books. I'm building 50 CQC-6's that will be delivered in the next 30 days. Just to start.

4. When we go to a show we bring knives to sell. This is something that we do and always will do. It is a business decision to insure our presence and future presence in the custom knife field. However, I have heard that we have showed up with as many as 50 knives on our table. This is not the case. Usually we have between 10 and 15 knives on our table but never more than 2 of any given model. Of these 10 or 15 knives, there are always 2 to 3 one-off special pieces with odd blades or materials and 2 to 3 prototypes of new models that I am experimenting with for future factory or custom production. This means that there are only a few actual catalog models on the table, ever. The knives are not auctioned off to the highest bidder or any of that nonsense. When you have 30 to 40 people and shoving to grab a knife off your table, who is first in line? We have had several incidents where shoving matches and near fist fights have occurred at our table between people who were trying to get to the front of our table. We went to a number drawing process and the results were that it eliminated those problems at our table completely. We only attend 4 custom shows a year where we have any handmade knives.

5. If you wish to contact Emerson knives regarding any of the issues that fuel the discussions on this forum please feel free to do so. We have 3 gals who tend to the phones Mon. - Friday and answer the mail. Do not contact us by E-mail as we receive literally up to 1000 E-mails a week and can not respond to them in a timely manner. We will answer any of your questions and address the myriad of allegations as put forth by some on these discussion groups, to the best of my ability. I personally do not use the internet to view the groups, as my work day starts at 5:00A.M. and usually finishes at about 7:00P.M. each day. Sorry, but that's just a fact.

6. I understand that there are those who are angry with our situation and their orders. I understand that there may be those who dislike my knives for any number of reasons. I also understand that there may be those who also dislike me for any number of reasons. I also understand that there are those who will do whatever they can to achieve a personal agenda or personal vendetta.

That is our lot in the situation at hand and we are indeed accountable for all of our actions good, bad or indifferent.

7. At this point, if any of you are inclined to cancel, ask for a refund or just plain holler at us for being late in delivering your knife please feel free to contact us for any reason. I realize that my custom knives are what brought me to the dance and we will not forget that fact. I am now producing the knives to fill those custom orders. For those of you who have waited so long I thank you. For those of you who can not wait any longer I apologize.

My Best Regards,


Ernest R Emerson


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Ernest Emerson
Emerson Knives, Inc
http://www.emersonknives.com
 
I'm glad that this thread has brought about something positive. Bud is right in that there are two sides to every story. Thank you, Mr. Emerson for responding.

Things obviously aren't perfect yet but I can understand that a lot of time and effort went into building the production side of the company. This is something you wanted to pursue and many great things have come out of the production side and hopefully there will be great models in the future. Although the lack of communication was somewhat irritating, I can see how it was more prudent to wait until the infrastruture for the production company was complete to finally announce what the situation was.

The handmades I own now are exquisite knives and I patiently await the one I have on order.

Sincerely,

Jason Yang
 
This has been a rather intense discussion and it sounds like there are some issues between some people. I don't want to get in the middle of that.

I would like to thank Ernie for posting a response,it explained many things. I have spoken to him and his wife a few times over the phone. They have been extremely nice. I would like to point out why I think so few people actually cancel their orders. I am guessing most people only give him $25. While that will buy food for a few days, it is still not that much money to let go on the hopes of getting a good knife. In many cases I would bet these same people would be willing to turn around and sell the knife(s) for a substantial profit.

I must say I don't agree with or particularly care for a business man who promises a delivery date, can't meet the date but still sells his product at a show. In my opinion, it is somewhat less than honorable.

To sum things up, Ernie Emerson is, based on what I have heard and through a few phone calls, a hell of a great guy. Being a great guy does not make you a great business man. My advice to Ernie, revise your business practices and become a great business man as well as great guy.
 
I was pleased to see Mr. Emerson chime in so quickly after Mike talked to him, and I guess some of us can better understand the trials and tribulations of bringing "production" versions of a custom knife line to fruition. (Or we can probably talk to Jerry Busse, who was and maybe still is dealing with the same issues.) I think that an improved line of communication could have headed some of the rumors and hard feelings off at the pass.

While I might not feel as strongly as Dirk does about the issue (or maybe not voice itas directly) I think we'll simply have to agree to disagree with the show practice. I can understand selling the one-off and oddball knives, but if it's a catalog piece that somebody has been waiting for, it should still go to the person who has been waiting the longest. I really don't see how it would hurt the desirability of Emerson knives to take show orders after letting prospective customers fondle a custom Emerson. I would wonder if the desirability for Emerson knives might be higher for those who handled one of the knives at a show versus those who ordered the knife sight-unseen?

That's just an academic or rhetorical question, and my $0.02 on this whole thing.

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Don LeHue

The pen is mightier thant he sword...outside of arm's reach. Modify radius accordingly for rifle.

 
One problem I see with the lottery is that the knives are gone in the first couple hours of the show. Then Ernie is left standing behind an empty table for a couple days. I think I would have a few knives which are NOT FOR SALE. This way he can show product, take orders and tell people that these knives are meant for display only. Ernie is a draw for any show he attends and some Emerson worshipers (and yes they do exist and even put tatoo's on them selve, Reenie Raines
smile.gif
) might be a bit upset to drive to a show and see Emerson but no knives.

The lottery solved a problem for him but created another. Emerson did say that he had not heard a complaint about it so it may be only an issue in our minds and not those who have actually ordered.


------------------
Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
www.wowinc.com




 
My suggestion: Everyone with an order for a custom should cancel and demand their money back, immediately. WHY, you ask? So I can get mine sooner!!
smile.gif


Hope things work out, Ernie. Your 'gals' are very nice and helpful when I call.

Tony
 
Even though my comment came across a little harsh, it was meant to be constructive. I am being sincere when I say Ernie is a great guy. I think DonL is right on when he pointed out that better communication would have been a good remedy. I really would like to see Ernie improve his business practices. Someone like him deserves a better reputation. Now, for many people, he is going to need to earn it. I think he will and the knife community will be better for it.
 
I just want to add my 2 cents to this frenzy of Emerson bashing. I am a 17 year veteran of a major Southern California Police Dept. I have personally known Mr. Emerson for the last 7 years. Let me tell you what I know about him. I do have several of his knives both from Benchmade and his new factory. I first attended one of his edged weapons classes several years ago and over time have gotten to know him as a friend. I have assisted in several of his classes over the years and am a welcomed guest at his home. The man is #1, a gentleman, and one of the most respected individuals I have ever been associated with.

I read what he had written to this forum to explain to you about his situation. Let me tell you what he wouldn't say. Since I have known him I have seen him sever his thumb (skin was the only thing attaching it to his hand). I've seen the x-rays, steel pins and the year of therapy he went through. I have also seen the operation on his left shoulder for joint reconstruction and then the operation on his right shoulder to repair a serious rotator cuff injury. I have seen him with broken ribs on first his right side and then broken ribs on his left side. I also saw him go through reconstructrive surgery on his left knee. All of these injuries have occurred within the last 5 years. For any of you who doubt my word ask him to show you the scars on his body and lumps on the healed ribs. I have never seen him complain once about these misfortunes or ever use them as an excuse. Ernie, depite these adversities has accomplished many wonderful things, including his new company, and he is frankly, regarded as a legend among PD's and Law Enforcement Agencies across the United States. I have seen him donate his time and expertise to many no charge Law Enforcement seminars and he has donated his time to teach many rape prevention and personal safety classes for women and children's classes around the Southern California area. I wonder how many of you have done the same. Yeah, he is late on delivering knife orders but things are getting pretty nasty about a guy who has saved a lot of Police Officers loves through the use of his knives and his teachings. Whoever this Les Robertson character is, I have to say, he is the most pompous, arrogant litle egomaniac I can recall. I did this, I did that. I'm on this cover, I'm an expert. Well guess what? I'm sick of you. Get a life - you are obsessed. In all my years of conversation with Ernest about knives and related subjects I have never heard him mention your name.

As far as you stating that you know more about tactical knives and their use. What you really are, is an egotistical self promoting little squirrel who only exists because of the good work of others (knifemakers) and not your own.

I know from personal experience that Emerson has balls of steel! Please don't ever insinuate that he would back down from you. I've seen him in action. Quite frankly anyone who threatens lawsuits and civil actionwhen someone calls them out, is not of the same steel as the men who were soldiers of the 101st Airborne that I have known and worked with over the years.

I know Ernest as a friend and, given the chance would have him as my partner anytime, anyplace. I know for a fact that he woudl go down fighting to protect the six of a friend.
 
If he is injured it stands to reason that he knows ha cannot make deadlines and should not promise delivery dates. What you have said is all good and nice but at question are his business practices not what a great guy he is. I have met him on several occasions and I also think that he is a great guy. This does not Excuse not being straightfoward with customers. My $.02.

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Long live Bladeforums!

Al

 
#1 Rule broken.
No personal attacks.

#2 Rule broken.
Moderator uses my forum to attack another.

Although Les at first did answer the question the thread took on a life of it's own. After talking with Ernie and several other parties this past week I have decided to remove Les as moderator until further notice. No hard feelings, just a decision to keep the forums atmosphere the way I want it to remain.



------------------
Best Regards,
Mike Turber
BladeForums Site Owner and Administrator
Do it! Do it right! Do it right NOW!
www.wowinc.com




 
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