Exploding knife market?!

[Kevin Jones]

The knife market is as funny as any other collectible market. I have spoken to several very knowlegable folks and they tell me that my Moran is worth pretty much what I paid for it even though, in theory, it should be worth more. One person told me that the Moran market is flat and he is not sure why. There aren't going to be any more Bill Moran knives......ever. Contrast this not only with the Loveless market, but with other areas. I have a 1966 Fender Vibrolux guitar amplifier that is probably worth $400-500 more than what I paid for it a year ago. Ditto on a 2005 Gibson Les Paul Standard 1959 Historical Reissue. It may be work $600-800 more than what I paid for it 15 mohs ago because Gibson chose to put a cheaper matte "vintage" finish on the new ones and the "regular" period corrct polished nitrocellulose laquer finish is now a $400 option. On the other hand, my Fender Custom Shop Nocaster Relic may be worht a couple of hundred less than I paid for it. Go figure.

Yep Joe, you never know with collectables.
The rare big block late 60s; early 70s Camaros and Chevelles are bringing two, three times what the rare midyear 60s big blocks Corvettes are bringing. And the big block Mopars (70ish Hemi Cudas and such) are bringing even twice that.
If we only knew that a $6500 car back in 1970 was going to bring over a million dollars today

 

[ptgdvc]

Kevin,

I think you would have been very hard pressed to spend 5K on tricked out Camaro in 1970, but my memory ain't what it used to be.

P

 

[Kevin Jones]

Kevin,

I think you would have been very hard pressed to spend 5K on tricked out Camaro in 1970, but my memory ain't what it used to be.

P

Yes Peter, the 1969 "Yanko" Camaro made very special with the ZL1 all aluminum 427CID engine and limited production (69 made) had an astounding sticker price for the day of about $5,200 and change. That compared to a sticker of about $3,200 for a very nice 69 Z28 model with the 327CID engine or $2700 for the base model camaro.

One of there cars sold @ the Barris-Jackson Auction two years ago for just over a million. Reggie Jackson formerly of the NY Yankees was the very proud seller.

Sorry, a little off subject here, but kinda relative as we go back and forth as to what custom knives will or will not be worth in the future.

 

[mlovett]

That is surprising about the Moran Market, and puzzling! Anyone have any input. I would be very interested in what you think. Mike

 

[Don Hanson III]

I think the main reason the Moran market is flat, is there are not enough of his knives available or changing hands to keep the prices on the upward move.

 

[SharpByCoop]

Since this thread is all over the place, I'll add some flotsam:

It's Yenko, not Yanko regarding the hi-perf builder. '69 Z-28's came with a 302ci, never a 327ci. (I owned a '68 396 Camaro, with the lowly 325hp round-port heads. )

Loveless knives: You guys all know I shoot for a number of notable web dealers. I number my images this way: Maker_Website initials_consecutive number.jpg I just finished up a set of eight more Loveless' to be sold, and my consecutive number is #44. MORE than any other maker (Warren Osborne being next closest).

Every RWL knife has sold. I'm a sideliner, but, what a parade!

Coop

 

[A. G. Russell]

Since this thread is all over the place, I'll add some flotsam:

It's Yenko, not Yanko regarding the hi-perf builder. '69 Z-28's came with a 302ci, never a 327ci. (I owned a '68 396 Camaro, with the lowly 325hp round-port heads. )

Loveless knives: You guys all know I shoot for a number of notable web dealers. I number my images this way: Maker_Website initials_consecutive number.jpg I just finished up a set of eight more Loveless' to be sold, and my consecutive number is #44. MORE than any other maker (Warren Osborne being next closest).

Every RWL knife has sold. I'm a sideliner, but, what a parade!

Coop

hose 8 rwl knives, what models? and at what prices?

 

[AV8R]

collectors / investors vs. speculators. My brother has a few rare muscle cars. I've had a few dozen show quality, rare cars. He has turned down $127, 500 for his 1973 SD455 Trans Am, because he thinks it'll eventually bring in the $150 to $200 range. This car could have been bought 10 years ago in the high $20's. It was just as rare then, as it is now. The supply hasn't changed. It's the demand. Those of you who are trying to make sense of the knife market based on logic, like "Morans aren't being made anymore" are trying to apply old fashioned, common sense to a market that has transcended common sense. Not unusual in today's world, because common sense is in short supply. Also in short demand. I don't own a high end muscle car right now. I don't invest in bubble markets. A few of the established knife purveyors here have been at this for 20+ years and know the market pretty well, but I think we have some other folks here as well who've had experience in other markets and "horse trading" in general over the last few decades (maybe Kevin, maybe Coop.....) and have some wisdom left over from the days of the old fashioned "horse traders". That wisdom applies here. I grew up with the "old boys" and they're still my favorite crowd. One rule that they hold firm to, is that "you gotta buy right". Here's a real car owned by a "good old boy" (my Dad).

Pete

 

[thombrogan]

Those are good points and a great car, AV8R.

When we invest, we're taking a stab that the demand for our knives will grow in the future and that tastes won't change or the market won't be flooded with nearly indistinguishable knives in that same future.

One neat thing about the forums is they let us find the makers who seem on the verge of a debilitating mental breakdown and buy their knives before their addresses are changed to one with nice, soft walls.

I like index funds and small cap. funds better, because I'm not tempted to use those investment vehicles to prune plants, make dinner, or break in a new sharpening stone.

 

[silenthunterstudios]

I mentioned to a friend about how cool it would be to see a Barretts auto auction equivalent in the knife community. He said its the Blade show .

I'm just worried about getting a good deal, sometimes you miss the forest for the trees doing that.

I like index funds and small cap. funds better, because I'm not tempted to use those investment vehicles to prune plants, make dinner, or break in a new sharpening stone.

exactly!

 

[Ellis]

You go AG! Buy all of the Loveless/Johnson Knive's you can find, they are money in the Bank.
As for Bill Moran Knive's,give them a bit of time. Jim Schmidt Knive's took a bit of time after his passing but look at them today...oh yeah, there are none to look at.. most if not all sell immediately.
I am still buying and selling Loveless and Moran Knive's, if you think their values have peaked that is fine, more for me and AG (lol)
Dave

 

[Kevin Jones]

Yes Peter, the 1969 "Yanko" Camaro made very special with the ZL1 all aluminum 427CID engine and limited production (69 made) had an astounding sticker price for the day of about $5,200 and change. That compared to a sticker of about $3,200 for a very nice 69 Z28 model with the 327CID engine or $2700 for the base model camaro.

One of there cars sold @ the Barris-Jackson Auction two years ago for just over a million. Reggie Jackson formerly of the NY Yankees was the very proud seller.

Sorry, a little off subject here, but kinda relative as we go back and forth as to what custom knives will or will not be worth in the future.

Since this thread is all over the place, I'll add some flotsam:

It's Yenko, not Yanko regarding the hi-perf builder. '69 Z-28's came with a 302ci, never a 327ci. (I owned a '68 396 Camaro, with the lowly 325hp round-port heads. )

Loveless knives: You guys all know I shoot for a number of notable web dealers. I number my images this way: Maker_Website initials_consecutive number.jpg I just finished up a set of eight more Loveless' to be sold, and my consecutive number is #44. MORE than any other maker (Warren Osborne being next closest).

Every RWL knife has sold. I'm a sideliner, but, what a parade!

Coop

Hey Coop, you are right I'm a poor speller, and you know spell check doesn't know anything about Camaros. And right again, I was thinking 307 but wrote 327. :foot: 1968 was the last year for the 327 in the Corvette.

And anyway I know nothing about Cameros. I love Corvettes, and have probably owned 50-60 of them over the years and do know a little about them.

And as to missed opportunities, In 1992 I think, I sold an all most all option 67 427-435HP Corvette Roadster, black w/ red leather, red stinger and 99.9 NCRS judged car with everything original down to the properly marked assembly bolts for $59,500.
The OEM sticker showed around $6700 I believe (I had the original sticker). That was premium money for the car at that time, however today that particular car would bring in the neighborhood of $300,000 in about 30 minutes. I had just under $29,000 invested in the car. The day I bought it I decided I would sell it when I could double my money. I sold a little short I would say.

Makes you wonder; Buy all the Loveless you can get your hands on now?

 

[Ellis]

If you are quoting me, I said, buy all of the Loveless/Johnson Knive's you can get your hands on.I do not recommend you purchase any and all Loveless Knive's at this time.
Dave

 

[Kevin Jones]

If you are quoting me, I said, buy all of the Loveless/Johnson Knive's you can get your hands on.I do not recommend you purchase any and all Loveless Knive's at this time.
Dave

No Dave, I was not quoting you, just making a point that no one knows how high they could go.

Obiviously, I thought my 67 roadster was near the top in 92. :grumpy:

 

[A. G. Russell]

If you are quoting me, I said, buy all of the Loveless/Johnson Knive's you can get your hands on.I do not recommend you purchase any and all Loveless Knive's at this time.
Dave

Any loveless, scagle, Moran you can buy at the bottom of, or under market is a good buy

 

[Kevin Jones]

I think the main reason the Moran market is flat, is there are not enough of his knives available or changing hands to keep the prices on the upward move.

I think you hit it Don. The market is stagnate. There's a fine balance to be maintained between having too many knives on the market and having just enough to hold interest.

 

[jdm61]

I think you hit it Don. The market is stagnate. There's a fine balance to be maintained between having too many knives on the market and having just enough to hold interest.

Bill made a goodly number of knives. I have seen a fair number of them come on the market lately, mostly Lime Kiln stuff. I wonder if a bunch of people sold theirs after Bill died and, in the short term, everyone who wanted one, like me, has one? I was keeping an eye open for a while and I only recall seeing one big damascus Moran come up and it was an ST23 that I believe Bruce Voyles auctioned for $23,000 before Bill died. Stange market...I remember telling Burt Gaston at the fall '05 hammer-in that i would guess that the ST23 board knife would go for around $35,000. This is right after the big bowie went for around $12,000 and I suspect that Burt thought I was stoned I was pretty close.....Arthur Britton won that thing with a bid of around $37,000.

 

[A. G. Russell]

Bill made a goodly number of knives. I have seen a fair number of them come on the market lately, mostly Lime Kiln stuff. I wonder if a bunch of people sold theirs after Bill died and, in the short term, everyone who wanted one, like me, has one? I was keeping an eye open for a while and I only recall seeing one big damascus Moran come up and it was an ST23 that I believe Bruce Voyles auctioned for $23,000 before Bill died. Stange market...I remember telling Burt Gaston at the fall '05 hammer-in that i would guess that the ST23 board knife would go for around $35,000. This is right after the big bowie went for around $12,000 and I suspect that Burt thought I was stoned I was pretty close.....Arthur Britton won that thing with a bid of around $37,000.

And if Bill Moran himself had made that knife I had planned to bid to $50,000 for resale. I expect that it would have gone much higher.

 

[jdm61]

And if Bill Moran himself had made that knife I had planned to bid to $50,000 for resale. I expect that it would have gone much higher.

Hmmmm.......how bout the little Reno "hunter" that he was carrying on hisbelt at Blade '05 and the Old Washington Fall'05 hammer-in? Some folks have said that it may have been the last one he made (as opposed to forging the blade). A.G......what would Bill's meteorite knife go for today?

 

[A. G. Russell]

Hmmmm.......how bout the little Reno "hunter" that he was carrying on hisbelt at Blade '05 and the Old Washington Fall'05 hammer-in? Some folks have said that it may have been the last one he made (as opposed to forging the blade). A.G......what would Bill's meteorite knife go for today?

I would think somewhere near 100,000. There are at least two loveless knives that will surpass that. I think though that the top dollar knife would be Buster's King Tut dagger.