Falkniven F1 3G - Sadly disappointed

Status
Not open for further replies.
As a metallurgist and knife user I'll repeat comments that I've made numerous times ! It is very easy to damage an edge and especially a tip from improper grinding at the factory ! Heat build up from grinding is always there and excessive heat is easy to do . I've had some good brand knives chip edge or break tips with absolutely no excessive forces. The answer is grinding damage. Regrind , best by hand and the damage should be gone.
I have a Fallkniven TK-1 and that 3G is a real super steel and it's now my principle hunting knife and I take very good care of it. My S-1 was meant as a field knife and I gave it some rough tests. One test was cutting up old carpet .I was not surprized when the softer outer layers scratched easily as old carpets .certainly mine, had things like sand which is very abrasive. The center layer held up much better.

My grinding fight has been a long one as a metallurgist .It often meant not making friends when I show the grinder the cracks he caused. I had a forman tell me I shouldn't do that as it hurts peoples feelings !!!
My response was 'talk to the customer and see who's feelings are really hurt when a part fails in use at great expense ' !!!

Hey Mete:

Could you see those cracks with a loupe, or did you need to magnaflux them? Were they shallow enough to be removed by sharpening? I'm curious as to what percentage of knives come out of the factory with cracks.

And do you know if resharpening/reprofiling just removes the cracks or is there a work-hardening effect as well?
 
It is unfortunate the tip broke. I would imagine Fallkniven will do the right thing and replace the blade.

Yes lets hear what they say. I would not expect them to replace it with a brand new knife if they find there is nothing wrong with the knife. I don't think that is to be expected either. Warranty, at least in Sweden, is only there to protect against error in manufacture and to make sure the product arrives to the consumer to specifications. Anything beyond that would be called "insurance" over here. And it certainly is not expected of any manufacturer of any goods to offer free insurance. Fällkniven is an honest company run by a small family and I certainly trust them much more than I would any large corporation.
 
I wouldn't call the Fällkniven company or the F1 a "bluff"!:grumpy:
I do have the F1 in VG-10 and it has taken everything without trouble.
My 3G TK1 and TK2 both have thinner tips than the F1 and both have intact tips and edges.

Send Your knife to Fällkniven and let them say what they will do, but don't call them a "bluff"!


Regards
Mikael

Hi Mikael, I didn't call Falkniven a bluff - im sure the Swedish Air Force use them for good reason and with the countless good reviews and happy customers around the world I would say AGAIN as I said in my original post I think it is a manufacturing defect or as another member has said possibly a bad grind at the factory.

I will stand by my comment though that a SURVIVAL KNIFE, irrespective of price, manufacturer should not be called a survival knife if it isnt able to withstand the possible scenarios of a survival situation. Survival knives should be built so that you can rely on them.

Ok, im a humble 'traveller' with a love of knives and luckily my life wasn't depending on it, BUT what if i had been a Swedish pilot stuck in a burning cockpit trying to dig cut my way out with a broken tip or trying to hunt game, make a hole in a piece of wood etc etc etc the knife failed. Im not going to get hung up on a brand and stick up for a knife that in my PERSONAL experience has failed me.

Im glad (truly I am) that you have had no problems with Falkniven, good for you, stick with what you know, but I will call their bluff (call them out/ test the ability of the product and judge it on personal experience) thats how I choose all my gear and the stuff that works goes with me from the Jungles of Thailand, to the tops of volcanos in New Zealand and Indonesia or to the desserts of the Middle East or anywhere else in the world.

Regards
J
 
Agreed. Fallkniven has an excellent reputation for a reason. And I, for one, will ALWAYS give a manufacturer a chance to make a problem right before I air my dirty laundry in a public forum.

Hi

IF giving members of a blade forum an honest, un-biased review of a knifes performance in the real world is considered "airing my dirty laundry" then hell yeah, my dirty laundry is flying hi bro!

I agree with what ShaoloGear said 'I would venture that the knife rusted because it was left in wet leather over night' It is a distinct possibility that as the knife was in my kit bag while i was swimming through a cave that the leather became wet. The blade was left in the sheath overnight and even though the ambient temperature was pretty high it was sitting in a wet leather sheath so that could definitely have caused the small rust spots. This was not really a major issue for me, the knife was a present from my Father and if I had personally chose it I would have purchased the Zytel sheath for use in these situations.

Ill say it again - My review was HONEST and UN-BIASED, I didn't mistreat the blade (maybe i should have dried the sheath before putting it back in), it wasn't down to 'technique' and I don't give the left cheek of a rats ass about offending the reputation of a manufacturer if their product doesn't perform the way it should. Maybe I just shouldn't use the knife for the tasks I am using it for, instead the BK2 or ESSE 5 or RAT 5 or even just stick to my $50 Gerber Big Rock that has NEVER let me down might just do the job better.

ALSO I have only just sent the blade back to Falkniven, Eric has been polite and has neither said that they will or won't replace it so I am not judging Falkniven until they get back to me. I do not want the same blade reground because if there wasn't a manufacturers defect then the tip would not have broken off

Regards

J
 
And we still do not know - perhaps you do not - just what activity caused the damage. Drilling? Chopping? Batoning? Making a notch? Opening a can (I have done that MANY times with any number of knives with no damage.)?
 
Maybe I just shouldn't use the knife for the tasks I am using it for, instead the BK2 or ESSE 5 or RAT 5 or even just stick to my $50 Gerber Big Rock that has NEVER let me down might just do the job better.


Regards

J

Sounds like You have found the answer to Your knifeneeds already!
I suppose there's a reason why the knifeindustry makes so many knives out of AISI 440A at low HRC hardness.
Anyway it's good that the Gerber works to Your satisfaction.
With the right geometry and heat-treatment, a softer stainless will hold the edge reasonably well to be a good tool.

Regards
Mikael
 
User error, neglect and denial are usually the culprit.

Harsh. Isn't it possible that the knife just failed? Is it a cardinal sin to report a knife failure on a knife forum? I don't get why that's considered such ill form here. In other consumer markets this would be considered good form, reporting on a faulty product. If consumers continually swallowed ill performances on trusted brands then brands would have no reason to improve.
 
Hi Twindog,

It is possible I hit a knot in the wood, just a shame that it would take only that to damage a pilots survival knife presuming they may at some point depend on it with their life.

I want to love this knife and hopefully Falkniven sort it out but I agree with you, although I avoid the massive knife blades the F1 seems a little small for bushcraft. I do use an axe and a Bacho folding saw in my kit depending on where im going but when a manufacturer calls out 'Survival' knife im gonna call their bluff and the F1 should be able to take some abuse IMHO

Cheers
J

I'm sure a pilots survival requirements are not dependant on slicing paper, looking good or leather sheaths which (no surprises there) swell when wet.

A couple of mm off the tip and the odd chip by no means render the knife useless, you go call bluff, I'm sure you know better than the Military.
 
Sounds like the point he was trying to make is if it's marketed as a life or death survival knife then they had better be sure it's 100% before it leaves the door.

FWIW, I've never heard of any *real* leather that you could take in to a wading pool. Some can be water proofed to the point they will stand rain, but I definitely wouldn't take the leather in to standing water. That's usually what the synthetic sheaths are for. I would venture that the knife rusted because it was left in wet leather over night. I haven't looked in to 3G steel, but standard steel does get "consumed" by ferrocerium rods.

It is unfortunate the tip broke. I would imagine Fallkniven will do the right thing and replace the blade.

Fully waterproof leather is available and has been since the birth of dive watches.

Kodiak leather for example.
 
Harsh. Isn't it possible that the knife just failed? Is it a cardinal sin to report a knife failure on a knife forum? I don't get why that's considered such ill form here. In other consumer markets this would be considered good form, reporting on a faulty product. If consumers continually swallowed ill performances on trusted brands then brands would have no reason to improve.

It is possible that the knife failed, but no one knows the cause of failure yet.
Here in Sweden consumer laws says that a company are obliged to correct manufacturing faults under warranty.
There's also a right for the company to correct a failing product under warranty without the need to compensate any loss for the customer.
Any damage caused by the user, are not covered by warranty laws.

The Fällkniven company always want to see the knife before they say it's covered under warranty or not.
They do have the proper experience to see what's covered and they also have a university tech institute to guide them.

To go public before a final verdict from the company is considered as bad form,as it hurt sales maybe without juste cause.
He could have waited until Erik had a chance to give a proffessional examination and response to the OP's warranty claims.
So yes the OP's actions in this thread are harsh IMO!


Regards
Mikael
 
Last edited:
Man, this bums me out big time.
I was thinking of buying either the F1 or Essee 4.
I like the handle and laminated steel of the F1.
But if something like this happens, no way do I want to send it back to Sweden
and wait for Fallkniven to tell me that it isn't covered under warranty.
That's where Esee shines.
Made in USA, no questions asked warranty.
Plus, a little less expensive.
Lenny
 
Whenever a knife model of any brand gets popular you get a lot of forum threads with unlucky people who have problems and they are usually quite vocal. That doesn't necessarily that the product is flawed.

We don't don't how the tip got broken. The OP has not stated even though posters have asked several times. There are a couple of things that make me suspicious:

- Why bring a leather sheath into water?
- It looks like there are marks on the cutting edge from a firesteel(!).
- That's some really ugly rust spots on a stainless knife.
- If you draw comparisons regarding rust resistance with soft kitchen knives, like the OP does in the first post, it shows you know little on steel.

It is possible there is error in the manufacture and in that case it's a win win. All I have seen so far, and I'm just a guy on the internet just like you, is someone who can't take care of a knife. The F1 is a ridiculously strong knife. It's an overbuilt survival knife. That doesn't mean you should abuse it. What is a survival knife? This is a survival knife.

Think this is a sour post? Well, I understand if one is angry about ones knife breaking for whatever reason. I don't think it is right to then proceed posting publicly how a product is a "bluff", and demand a new knife, when all I have seen in this thread is evidence of user error.

I might be mistaken, perhaps the tip broke from a perfectly legit task, perhaps those edge marks is not from a fire steel, perhaps, perhaps, perhaps. I just comment on what I can see and read. OP think I am unfair? Perhaps I am, perhaps you could have explained what caused the damage. Otherwise expect reactions like this one when you go out and call a company a bluff in the face of users who have hard used the F1 for years.
 
Twindog, my problems with knives has been either broken tip or softened edge.Both can be easily fixed by regrinding carefully. I don't remember cracks on my knives but have seen many photos on forums of cracks .I did much of my professsional work in "failure analysis" so I sometimes get mixed up on where and what application the failure has been ! Remember that poor HT can cause internal cracks which you can't see until it grows an breaks !! One example I worked with was a large thrust bearing which had numerous cracks on the surface .Our etchant used to bring up heat damaged steel showed nothing. Well the cracks were shaped typical of grinding cracks.So I went to the rough ground races .There were the cracks and the heat damage.They then carefully finish ground the race , removing damage except heat type !

Cracks on a knife blade I would never trust because there's too man other things that may have happened and you don't know what they were. Was it misuse ? HT? If it breaks while you're using it you could get hurt !!!
 
Mete


As You are a metallurgist with experience of the 3G laminate steel, I have an OT question regarding welding to the 3G steel.
If You want to weld a pommelscrew in the tang end, how do You do this?
Can it be done without ruining the heat-treatment?

Regards
Mikael
 
I'll make a couple of points and this is just MY opinion:

- A knife marketed as a "survival" or "hard use outdoors" blade should be held to a much higher standard. I realize companies can call whatever they make whatever they want. I think they should be held to the standard they themselves have set with their marketing.

- We don't know what happened here, as stated by the OP, and the OP wasn't really being harsh in his critique IMHO. I would be very dismayed if I had done what he said he did, and I have no reason to question his account, and it resulted in that damage. I have seen many complaints about FK chipping and such. I've seen enough that I will not buy one, but that's just me. This is an online knife community. Posts like this are why we are here. I will also refer to the above statement. If a knife is marketed for hard use, but fails someone under intial light use (or heavy use for that matter), I want to hear about it. That doesn't mean the knife is crap, but having information available allows us to see if a pattern exists. I really hate that it's risky to even post a knife failure because it immediately brings howls of: you didn't know what you were doing, you used the wrong tool, there's no way that brand could ever fail, etc....

- Just because a country's military uses something, doesn't mean that it's the best. Ask anyone who's been in the military. A lot of things go into that decision, domestic manufacture being huge for logistical and nationalistic reasons, and cost being the usual deciding factor.

I guess I'm getting cranky, but I see the same behavior again and again. It gets old. Anyway, about the leather. People have used leather forever. No one can say it's not to be used in poor conditions. It will wear out faster and there are better options, but leather does work. If you want to use leather in all conditions, it requires care. If you boil the entire sheath in bee's wax, it will help it hold up to a lot of harsh weather. The creator of SnowSeal once told me about seeing leather harnesses the ancient Egyptians used. They would boil them in wax and they were usable to this day. Take care.
 
To go public before a final verdict from the company is considered as bad form,as it hurt sales maybe without juste cause.
He could have waited until Erik had a chance to give a proffessional examination and response to the OP's warranty claims.
So yes the OP's actions in this thread are harsh IMO!


Seriously? to go public? this is a Blade forum is it not? I gave an honest, review of a knife. I have not said anywhere in my posts that I think Falkniven are shit, or that no one should buy the knife, I said I would give the knife another chance and that in my opinion there was a manufacturers defect in the steel.

Is this not a reasonable assumption to make based on the fact that this knife should not have broken under normal circumstances, I have already said what I was doing with the knife and I can't be bothered repeating myself. I do not believe it was my technique or mistreatment of the knife that caused the failure, I have nothing to loose admitting if I mistreated it but I didn't.

This thread was started by me as a review on a knife, NOT a place to badmouth Falkniven. Eric has done nothing to make me think bad of the company, it is you who is making assumptions about my opinions on the manufacturer.

It is not bad form to report on a products performance and I will report on Falknivens reaction to the knife and I will report my next field test on the knife because that is what this forum is for.
 
I'm sure a pilots survival requirements are not dependant on slicing paper, looking good or leather sheaths which (no surprises there) swell when wet.

A couple of mm off the tip and the odd chip by no means render the knife useless, you go call bluff, I'm sure you know better than the Military.

A couple of mm off the tip of a brand new expensive knife through a fault in the product is not acceptable. It does render the knife useless in my opinion because the product failed under less than extreme circumstances.

When you say "you call bluff" I dont think you read the post properly. I said "when a manufacturer calls out 'Survival' knife im gonna call their bluff" this means incase I din't make it clear enough that when someone tells me a knife is a survival knife I expect it to be a survival knife. This means that the knife should inherently perform well under more extreme circumstances.

Bluff is not an insult directed at the manufacturer but a 'call out'. Give me your so called survival knife and ill expect it to perform like one.

As far as telling me in a sarcastic tone "I'm sure you know better than the military" you don't know what I do, what my job is or anything about me.

This post was a knife review. PERIOD
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top