fixed blades in boy scouts?????

Using cutting tools of all types is such an important part of Scouting. I was lucky that our leader was a really cool guy who was interested in knives. He let us carry whatever we wanted as long as we were safe. In this PC day and age, I can almost understand their reasoning though. Some idiot parent would probably sue if Junior cut his thumb with a knife.
 
Runs With Scissors said:
Overall though, I'd still consider it a nitpick. Scouting is still one of the last great American traditions that hasn't been completely overwhelmed by political correctness....yet.
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I thought the scouts were founded by Baden Powell. A british dude.

:)

Anyway, back home in Malaysia when i was a scout we were aloud to carry anything we wanted. A big machete. A small fixed blade. An SAK. It's a pity though at that time i didn't know anything about quality knives so it was usually crappy knives bought at the hardware store.
 
Spydiefan04 said:
Think they should issue all of them a Ka-Bar. Much more useful than any boyscout knife. Also, who in the world would favor a little pocket knife for wilderness survival over a good fixed blade? A complete moron.
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Oh, I don't know. I think that if all I had on me for wilderness survival was a Rucksack SAK I'd be a happy camper. I'd rather have a tomahawk though. :cool:

While I only had an SAK in scouts I don't remember there being a no fixed blades policy. If a kid exhibits the maturity needed to carry a fixed blade then what purpose are you serving by denying him that option?
 
Point44 said:
I thought the scouts were founded by Baden Powell. A british dude.

:)
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Scouting as a youth program was originated by BP, as you know perfectly well. :) ("Dude"?)

The Boy Scouts of America was founded by several Americans, who were, with one exception (the elderly Dan Beard) soon run off by James West, a egomaniacal bureaucrat, who took American Scouting somewhat off the track followed in the rest of the free world (e.g., by creating relatively huge paid staffs and adopting military uniforms). Nevertheless, BP would recognize American Scouting as derived from his program.

Our Troop, like many others, was founded on BP's book Scouting for Boys in 1908 -- BEFORE the formation of the B.S. of A.
 
Looks like it's time for some enterprising manufacturer to come up with the ULTIMATE ....California...... Boy Scout Folding Knife.
One that completely folds up. Made of paper. Then the scouts could go out in the woods and get an origami merit badge.
Complement it with some Lincoln Logs to pretend to cut and everyone could make believe they were camping.
In one of the parents' rose gardens of course.
And I'm not REAL sure of letting em have flashlights what with retinal damage and such. Just the glow sticks.

Wheeeeeee !!!!!

:barf:
 
Thomas Linton said:
Scouting as a youth program was originated by BP, as you know perfectly well. :) ("Dude"?)

The Boy Scouts of America was founded by several Americans, who were, with one exception (the elderly Dan Beard) soon run off by James West, a egomaniacal bureaucrat, who took American Scouting somewhat off the track followed in the rest of the free world (e.g., by creating relatively huge paid staffs and adopting military uniforms). Nevertheless, BP would recognize American Scouting as derived from his program.

Our Troop, like many others, was founded on BP's book Scouting for Boys in 1908 -- BEFORE the formation of the B.S. of A.
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Superb info. I always thought uniforms and badges were invented to make money. Much like martial arts belts. It's really sad to see that most of the scouts now only think competitively of who gets the most badges. I believe what's important is the knowledge that's passed on, especially bushcraft and survival skills and other skills to develop an overall good natured person.
 
Of course they should allow fixed blades, and machetes and axes and saws, the kids are out camping and learning, what do you want them to learn, that fixed blades are bad things or that fixed blades are good tools ?.

I was never a Boy Scout, but I got this knife from my father when I was in my early teens and carried it in camping trips until my 20´s, sorry the Boy Scout etch is not very clear.

Luis

scoutknife1.jpg
 
My point is, you're about 30 years too late to have an impact on the BSA's fixed-blade policies.

And how many of you are actively involved in the BSA anyway?

I'm not...

-Bob
 
The rule is just a bunch of PC sheeple stupidity. Almost all the troops and both councils I was in during the 1980s had this rule. My last troop let me carry what I wanted since I was the only one with any skills and if they lost me no one whould know how to do anything at camp. :D My "compromise" was to carry a junk knife like one from Pakistan which would get confiscated until we went home and have my "good" ones concealed unless I used them. Now my standards are higher so my definition of a "good knife" is different.

One of the Scout staff at summer camp had his lockback fold on his fingers. He previously made fun of fixed blades. :rolleyes:

The thing I thought was strange until I later learned that the "ban" was more a local thing (those idiots would use the term "illegal" until I asked them what laws they violated.) was that they did sell a BSA fixed blade. Some of my leaders carried fixed blades when camping or hunting on their own. So did their kids who were Scouts. They still preached the "fixed blades are dangerous" BS. IMO if they are dangerous it would not make much sense to carry them on their own with no supervision.
 
Bob W said:
My point is, you're about 30 years too late to have an impact on the BSA's fixed-blade policies.

And how many of you are actively involved in the BSA anyway?

I'm not...

-Bob
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I'm not. It was just something stupid I had to put up with when I was a kid. I think they'd have many more (and better) people involved if they cut out their PC sheeplism.
 
Thomas Linton said:
1. As noted above, the policy of the National Council of the Boy Scouts of America is that "large" fixed-blade knives are "discouraged." There is no ban.

2. No Scout may carry any knife by national policy without earning the "Tot'N'Chip. This requirement may not be waived by any Council or Troop, although it is often, foolishly, ignored. (There are no state BSA organizations.) Failure to follow the policy, amongst other things, may void BSA insurance coverage of adults in Scouting. (Required to follow "safety rules.")

3. The Tot'N'Chip may not be earned without demonstrating how to carry, pass and use a fixed-blade kinife.

4. Any absolute ban on fixed-blade knives is contrary to national policy.
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Yup. From the official web site here
A sharp pocketknife with a can opener on it is an invaluable backcountry tool. Keep it clean, sharp, and handy. Avoid large sheath knives. They are heavy and awkward to carry, and unnecessary for most camp chores except for cleaning fish. Since its inception, Boy Scouting has relied heavily on an outdoor program to achieve its objectives. This program meets more of the purposes of Scouting than any other single feature. We believe we have a duty to instill in our members, youth and adult, the knowledge of how to use, handle, and store legally owned knives with the highest concern for safety and responsibility.

Remember—knives are not allowed on school premises, nor can they be taken aboard commercial aircraft.

References: Boy Scout Handbook, Fieldbook, Bear Cub Scout Book, and Wolf Cub Scout Book
 
i remember going camping once (in scouts) and my father went and we were goin out the door and he was putting a sheath on his belt. and i said ohh you arent allowd to bring those (i was joking of course, as in i didnt care if he brought it) and he said somethin like i dont care or what are they gunna do. that might have been the weekend that he lost this b-e-a-utiful ivory balisong.

and most of the kids in scouts have a buck or a kabar or a machete in their bag, they come out at night.

yea it is a stupid rule, now they dont even allow knives that are longer than four fingers
 
As a dad and a cub scout den leader, there is nothing that makes me more happy than to have my son ask me when at scouting "events", "can I whittle?"

Where else, besides in your own home (for now) can a boy sit down, pull out a pocket knife, and whittle a stick or something without someone screaming "terrorist" or flipping out.

I encourage all my boys to enjoy and respect pocketknives. It's funny, at my last pack meeting, we gave a "special" award to a bear den cause they had all managed to cut themselves (even the parents) while working on whittling chip. I take great pride that when I worked that in my den last year, not one of my boys cut themselves once.


Sorry, a little off topic, I think it's just PC bull leeching into even the Boy Scouts. That's a shame.

I even find that some of the discipline and patriotism and citizenship is not being encouraged enough in Cub/Boy scouts.

Nice to see alot of current former Cub/Boy scouts here, but I would have expected that.

Glenn
 
I am involved with Boy Scouts of America at the Council, District and Unit levels. I have suggested that the language regarding fixed blade knives is silly, particularly as fixed blade knives are often included in the cooking gear. However, there is undoubtedly a reason for the effort to discourage Scouts bringing fixed blade knives on activities. I suspect it has to to with the "arms race" among Scouts and leaders, that is the competition to have the biggest knife. I remember seeing large knives that had little practical application to the actual activity. A large fixed blade knive might have use in a survival situation, but doen't at a run of the mill camporee held on a college campus. A second possible rationale is to discourage experimentation in knive throwing, which seems to be less of an issue with folders than with fixed blades.

On a different topic, the Boy Scouts of America is always interested in recruiting adults to serve as unit leaders or committee members, merit badge counselors, volunteers to help get camps ready, and so on. Contact your Council for more information.
 
Thanks for an informative post from an inside point of view. Related is a current "shopping help" topic here where the fixed-blade-necessity conversation is ongoing. Most serious backpackers and hikers carry SAK, small lockbacks, Opinels, or similar.

I do agree, as I mentioned, that there are small fixed-blade knives that would be suitable for boys to carry.

Another issue is the current trend of the Scouting costumes to be dressy and formal, not well suited for activity. A large knife hanging off the belt doesn't mix with the current uniform trend. But a single small pocketknife can be carried in the dress pants and also used for most outdoor knife needs.

On a different topic, the Boy Scouts of America is always interested in recruiting adults to serve as unit leaders or committee members, merit badge counselors, volunteers to help get camps ready, and so on. Contact your Council for more information.
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I'll consider it when the BSA stops desciminating based on religious beliefs, or lack thereof. No way I'd support the current organization. If they want to be considered the Boy Scouts of America, they should welcome all Americans.

-Bob
 
Bob W said:
. . .
Another issue is the current trend of the Scouting costumes to be dressy and formal, not well suited for activity. A large knife hanging off the belt doesn't mix with the current uniform trend. But a single small pocketknife can be carried in the dress pants and also used for most outdoor knife needs.
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No a "dress uniform." Called a "Field Uniform," the poly blend makes it less than ideal for physically active pursuits. (Actually very cheaply made work clothes PRICED like a dress uniform.)

I'll consider it when the BSA stops desciminating based on religious beliefs, or lack thereof. No way I'd support the current organization. If they want to be considered the Boy Scouts of America, they should welcome all Americans.

-Bob
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All totally OT, Bob, but since you brought it up.

Bob, would you expect the Catholic Church In America to drop religious requirements for membership because its "In America"?

No particular belief is required by Scouting and your practices are not inquired into in my (long) experience on the Regional, Council, District, and unit levels. You just have to agreed to do your "duty to God" and have to respect the religious beliefs of others. If you can't do that, the organization is not for you because you do not believe in the organization's values or practices. Just not a fit. Scouting, on the other hand, has an inalienable right, recognized in the Constitution, to promote "duty to God."

Funny thing, in the 1950's and 1960's the John Birch Society attacked Scouting because it had a policy of racial and religious integration, had a World Brotherhood Merit Badge, and supported the UN. Now the left wing attacks Scouting because, among other things, it will not agree to homosexual adult leaders (Gee, what would the parents say on that issue?). "Times" change. Some things do not.

Thus endeth the rant.
 
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