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Interesting, I'm trying to remember to no avail who these two major knife companies are. Can you name them for us with aging memories?
Schrade and Camillus
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Fixed pricing....
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Schrade and Camillus
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Benchmade isn't as American as apple pie either. Isn't its founder Filipino? It was founded late 70's and made its name selling Filipino knives/balisongs. They made knives in China long before "the other company" did and still do, just not labeled Benchmade. $700 MSRP and enforced MAP on the recent 586 Gold Class is quite outlandish too whether made in Mars or Oregon. Just pointing a few things out since people want to get off track away from the subject that many are upset at prices artificially going up 30%-to 40%. Bringing up other companies' situations etc. that has nothing to do with the topic is quite useless here.
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I honestly don't know the history of BM from the very beginning, and at this point in time, it's really a non-issue... Especially discussing the founders Nationality.
We are only focusing on the two topics we have been discussing. I do know that for quite some time now, they have been an American company. They are headquartered, and build many, not all, of their products here in Oregon. About 160 miles from where I live.
I'm not sure which companies you are referring to, when you say bring them into the conversation is useless... If you mean Schrade and Camillus, it does actually have some relativity to our discussion. It proves that no matter how long a company has been in business, and how big they might be,they can collapse.
I mentioned they collapsed because of poor management decisions. That is the reason that has been written in numerous publications.
It appears to me, that with 6 or 7 IIRC personnel changes, in what appear to be key positions, that could very well happen at BM as well...
Changing one person in a key position, can have devastating effects. A person new to a position is going to try and prove themselves worthy, so the changes they make may very well not be positive changes, and in the best interest of the companies longevity.
When you have 6 or 7 at the same time, you have a lot of changes going on at the same time, and that can create a lot of problems if they aren't working together, and some of the people are trying to go in a different direction, than the rest.
It doesn't mean that it will have these results. It could go the other direction, and have positive results. However, I think the odds of it working out that way, are slim at best.
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I don't really think it's as "black and white" as you imagine, but it's not my job to convert anyone. It's simply when I read something and it strikes me as grossly erroneous I question the reasoning, at least until I can understand the larger picture. In any case, there were some details I added that were excluded, so at least a more complete picture can be provided.
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The topic is Benchmade, we are in the Benchmade forum so we are discussing Benchmade and not any other company, in General Knife Discussion, maybe we would.
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I know exactly where I am posting. The topic IS Benchmade and my point is valid, as is the point regarding Camillus and Schrade -but you have nothing to say regarding those posts? Please stay on topic.
Originally Posted by harris2
Interesting, I'm trying to remember to no avail who these two major knife companies are. Can you name them for us with aging memories?
That is strange. There is a very large Schrade "outlet" store ten miles away. I haven't been there in a long time, but the last time I drove by they still had the Schrade brand displayed on the side of the building. Maybe it is now a "closeout" outlet
. I believe it's time to go inside again and see what is going on. 
Addendum: Oops, to stay on topic I'll see if they are selling any Benchmades.
Interesting, I'm trying to remember to no avail who these two major knife companies are. Can you name them for us with aging memories?
That is strange. There is a very large Schrade "outlet" store ten miles away. I haven't been there in a long time, but the last time I drove by they still had the Schrade brand displayed on the side of the building. Maybe it is now a "closeout" outlet
. I believe it's time to go inside again and see what is going on. Addendum: Oops, to stay on topic I'll see if they are selling any Benchmades.
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Well then we have one thing in common because I react the same way when I see certain product pricing structures for imported goods. Maybe we are more similar than I thought.
Back on topic, although the new pricing structure is lame, it is good to know that the Benchmade line is still being produced in Oregon. I don't like that they are betting on my willingness to pay more for that fact -but I will, albeit less often. Oh well. In the meantime, the new M390 Contego in my pocket every day should tide me over... until the Stryker is released :thumbup:
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Numbers, it wasn't in response to Schrade and Camillus at all. I think you should know who my post was for.
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Actually quite off topic, no one here is required to show any outrage at price fixing from any other company, and most haven't because they are staying on topic.
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I hurried and bought a Benchmade as a Christmas present for my dad before the pricing went up. There was 1 or two knives I would of bought but have not since the pricing went up. Still like Benchmade and understand why they did what they did, their knives are not as good as value as they used to be but still a decent/good value to me just not great like it used to be.
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If the value ie materials, f&f and its something that tickles me than I have no problem paying increased $$ relative to Msrp. I buy customs in the 1k range so why not 2 or 3 hundred for a quality production Imo. Answer to op, yes there are ones that I would not consider getting at higher prices now, value just isn't there anymore for me.
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When I first heard of the news that they will begin to enforce MAP pricing, I actually convinced myself not to believe it. I'd check the sites like KW and CS and saw that the coupons were still available. Stupid me, I should have jumped on the prices like many of you did because now, I will not be purchasing any new BM's for the foreseeable future.
Take a look at the 710... It was going for as little as $106 shipped and is now around $148. That is a huge artificial price increase for the exact same knife. No steel upgrade, same hit or miss F&F.
How about a compromise and they allow dealers to do temporary sales? During the holidays perhaps?
Take a look at the 710... It was going for as little as $106 shipped and is now around $148. That is a huge artificial price increase for the exact same knife. No steel upgrade, same hit or miss F&F.
How about a compromise and they allow dealers to do temporary sales? During the holidays perhaps?
Esav Benyamin
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Way out of line. He doesn't have to be born in America to be American. My grandparents weren't. Apple pie wasn't invented in America, either. The company is American. Getting into ethnicity is a topic for an ancestry website, not Bladeforums.
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Well, as I said before I'll buy the occasional LE, the new CF 940 looks nice, the M390 Contego is nice. Those items never ever had any special discount as far as i can remember so, that won't change much in my eyes. However, time is going to be the ultimate test of what happens.
For the record, I don't see these topics as bashing or whining, rather as an attempt to have a legitimate discussion. It doesn't hurt anyone to talk, not like we are dealing with classified government projects or anything. Some folks though, are incapable of conversation, educating themselves or others. Communication in general is a huge obstacle for these people. That is what is a shame, but such is life. Some folks only want to see what they want to see, and when challenged for an alternate opinion they freak out.
For the record, I don't see these topics as bashing or whining, rather as an attempt to have a legitimate discussion. It doesn't hurt anyone to talk, not like we are dealing with classified government projects or anything. Some folks though, are incapable of conversation, educating themselves or others. Communication in general is a huge obstacle for these people. That is what is a shame, but such is life. Some folks only want to see what they want to see, and when challenged for an alternate opinion they freak out.
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If my history is correct, everyone here - no exceptions - got here on foot, on a boat or on an airplane.
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Taken, but please don't get my point misconstrued. It probably wasn't politically correct to bring up our nationality, I myself am Filipino American. The company IS American but my post was in response to those on here who were setting examples as to why other companies ARE LESS AMERICAN by selling knives made in other countries, selling them for a price they do not approve of etc. hitting their point home that Benchmade is this All American company that we should support and and if anything NOT give a free pass to those other "Less American" companies. Spyderco, which is the company a poster here was referring to, was forced to go east in 2006 with their value line because of competition doing so a decade earlier such as Benchmade (cited here:http://www.spyderco.com/forums/showthread.php?30951-quot-Tenacious-quot-model&p=391555#post391555)
I will refrain from this moving forward as I understand where I went wrong but knocking other brands and the idea of putting Benchmade in this ALL AMERICAN pedestal is also flawed when its humble beginnings were nothing but that and still make foreign knives to this day.
Other American companies aren't any less American when it comes to which parts are manufactured where. But outsourcing to foreign countries saves them money and takes jobs away from Americans.. Not exactly ideal, but a common way for most American companies.
Benchmade takes that extra step to ensure you're getting a made in USA product. Sure they could've just taken the easy way out, saved money by outsourcing the labor, and probably still charge the prices they do now. But they didn't. When I buy a knife from them, it's a strange comfort that what I'm getting is a quality product built by people that could be my neighbour or go to my church. Not some giant mfg. company in Taiwan.
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