growing weary of the sprint run game

It's a shame those great knives are safe-queens for speculating or collecting, and dont get to be used.

My 2cts.

Keno
 
I really like the sprint program as it gives us knife models we like and may have, but with a differant steel and handle material.

What bugs me is the flippers that sell the week they get them for a huge profit. IMO If they were not pre announced, and just put up on sites as they come in, it would give more users a chance, and cut down on the flippers.
 
At least we aren't talking about a shortage of potatoes, gasoline or Mountain Dew. The essentials.

I scored a brown Military btw, after 2 vendors contacted me (I am very important, you know), and I'm on a notification list with a 3rd vendor.

It sucks when you can't find what you are after, and its fun when you can. I admit it.
 
Don't forget, in many cases a sprint run is cheaper for spyderco than the release of a brand new design. For a sprint run, anything not changed from the first run (e.g the design, tooling, package, logo, etc.) are all fixed costs that were paid for in the first run. New steel in existing models breaths life into sales for both the sprint and regular models. For "re-runs", such as this years Shabaria, Spyderco gets a "new" knife and all the "buzz", without the full upfront cost of a new model. If spyderco is doing it right, sprint runs may very well have a higher profit margin than other knives in their lineup.

Despite Spyderco's well publicized charitable endevours, they are in business to support their family and sprint runs brings money to their bottom line with less business risk than a new product. The danger is that re-runs dilute the collectibility of their old knives and that "steel of the month" may tire out some peoples walllets. However, look how many people will buy a new Case trapper just because it's now available in pink G10 or will buy a new Case toothpick because it's been "returned from the vault to current production."
 
I've always gotten the ones I wanted or at least had them offered to me. Don't rely on just BF dealers. The people I use aren't and I think that is why they usually have a few. Once a dealer is post here that has a sprint in stock they are gone in minutes.
 
The Deacon said:
Simple, but often overlooked, fact is that Spyderco cannot control who purchases their products. For the past couple years at least, most of the highly sought after Sprints have not been the "re-runs" of discontinued models, but the "big three" of their US made knives, the Military, ParaMilitary, and Manix 2, in exotic steels. Those are the ones that skyrocket in value almost from the day they're released, probably because they are attractive to all three groups - users, collectors, and speculators. More than a few of the "re-run" types, which attract mainly collectors and speculators, never fetch more than their original discounted prices and almost all the rest have yet to show more than a modest increase.
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Good point. It seems that there have a been an abundance of sprints of those "big 3" lately so the majority of the attention (and huge price markups) has been on those while some lesser desired models go at regular prices. If there was a solution that appeased everyone I'm sure Sal would have put it in play by now. If I want a knife bad enough, paying an extra $50-$100 on the secondary market wouldn't stop me. Hasn't happened yet, but it would't stop me.
 
mwalle6 said:
Good point. It seems that there have a been an abundance of sprints of those "big 3" lately so the majority of the attention (and huge price markups) has been on those while some lesser desired models go at regular prices. If there was a solution that appeased everyone I'm sure Sal would have put it in play by now. If I want a knife bad enough, paying an extra $50-$100 on the secondary market wouldn't stop me. Hasn't happened yet, but it would't stop me.
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To a degree, he has already found one and put it in play. That potential solution is the sponsored run. No risk for Spyderco, regardless of the number ordered, no promise of "only nnn will ever be made" unless the sponsor chooses to make one, otherwise they can always order another batch from Spyderco.

The other point that seems to be hard for folks to accept is that making "a couple hundred" more is not always possible, especially when exotic steels are involved. The amount Spyderco orders may be the smallest batch that the steel company sells, and the only way to increase the order would be to double it. While there's always a risk when introducing a new product, or a change to an existing one, producing twice as many may turn an acceptable risk into an unacceptable one.
 
powernoodle said:
At least we aren't talking about a shortage of potatoes, gasoline or Mountain Dew. The essentials.

I scored a brown Military btw, after 2 vendors contacted me (I am very important, you know), and I'm on a notification list with a 3rd vendor.

It sucks when you can't find what you are after, and its fun when you can. I admit it.
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Yes, but it costs too much - see the post below, which cracked me up except that it is true... :eek: :D

Ruff Cobb said:
My issue is definately not with the Sprint Runs themselves but with me. I have precious little willpower to resist the various Military variations & I can usually rationalize their EDC rotation and use.

(snip)

Ruff Cobb
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softrockrenegade said:
I find the fact that fellow forum members use the exchange here to jack up the prices of these knives to other knife nuts here on the forums repulsive .... I personally have never juiced up the price of any knife I got at retail price , spydies , Hinderers ect... This isn't eBay !!!! Then again I won't pay inflated prices for any knife , I guess it's all just personal preference .
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I found myself thinking about your post off an on all day today.

I would like to say that I have some emotional sypathy for your viewpoint. I remember the first time I ever sold things for more than I payed for them...it seemed ungentlemanly. I thought about it for a while and decided that this was an absurd way to feel.

Not only is it absurd i doudt it is a philophopy you apply consistantly in your own life. I really doudt that if for example you bought a house for 200k and then a few years later upon deciding to sell it found it was now valued at 300k that you would insist on selling it for only what you paid. Of course you would not. Each time an item is sold it's current market value is considered. That is the way of the world. That is how business is done.

I really think your judgement of people who sell limited edition knives on the exchange is unfair to both parties involved in such a deal. We must be honest here, both parties are acting in their own interests, this is not a relationship with an exploiter and a victim. One wishes to make a profit, the other wishes to aquire a rare item of value to him. There is no arm twisting or subterfuge going on. If they arrive at an agreement and both depart satisfied who are you to declare one of them reprehensible?
 
Bottom line is Spyderco has been putting out some VERY nice sprint runs and there's been a lot of demand for those knives.
 
powernoodle said:
I love my Spydies, and own more than my fair share. Have one in my pocket 5 out of 7 days. But this sprint run thing is growing old. A particular model is produced in a quantity intentionally insufficient to supply the market. And half the sprint run buyers flip the knife for a quick $100 profit. I'm after the brown Military. I'm sure that someone would like to take my money. But nooooooo.
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powernoodle,

With all due respect I strongly disagree.
During last six years of my Spyderco addiction I bought every sprint run, which I wanted from the dealer. The idea is very simple:find a good dealer and place pre-order in advance. Always worked for me.
Even more I believe that most of the people who really want sprint model and do enough efforts, get them. Just yesterday there were couple posts on Spyderco forum, where people spotted brown Milly.
I would like to share an observation. I see this almost every sprint. In most cases Spyderco makes more than one shipment of each sprint, sometimes even a month or more apart. So, people who did not get the knife, show their disappointment. A little later, most of them will get the knife, but the next sprint run story will repeat.
And do not worry about Brown Milly, this run is about 1000 pieces, so most likely these knives will be available for a while.
Also I believe that "half the sprint run buyers flip the knife for a quick $100 profit." is a strong extradition. I would estimate this like 5%, 7% max

powernoodle said:
I scored a brown Military btw, after 2 vendors contacted me (I am very important, you know), and I'm on a notification list with a 3rd vendor.
It sucks when you can't find what you are after, and its fun when you can. I admit it.
Click to expand...
Sorry, I missed this post, but it is only proof of what was said above.
Sorry, I am just getting a little irritated from this kind of thread every time, when we have "hot" sprint run.
 
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Joben said:
I found myself thinking about your post off an on all day today.

I would like to say that I have some emotional sypathy for your viewpoint. I remember the first time I ever sold things for more than I payed for them...it seemed ungentlemanly. I thought about it for a while and decided that this was an absurd way to feel.

Not only is it absurd i doudt it is a philophopy you apply consistantly in your own life. I really doudt that if for example you bought a house for 200k and then a few years later upon deciding to sell it found it was now valued at 300k that you would insist on selling it for only what you paid. Of course you would not. Each time an item is sold it's current market value is considered. That is the way of the world. That is how business is done.

I really think your judgement of people who sell limited edition knives on the exchange is unfair to both parties involved in such a deal. We must be honest here, both parties are acting in their own interests, this is not a relationship with an exploiter and a victim. One wishes to make a profit, the other wishes to aquire a rare item of value to him. There is no arm twisting or subterfuge going on. If they arrive at an agreement and both depart satisfied who are you to declare one of them reprehensible?
Click to expand...

The difference here is that there are people who preorder and snag up all the sprint runs with the sole intention of flipping them for a profit.... With something like a house a lot more goes into the market price such as the current cost of building materials , cost of labor ,fuel to run the equipment ect... Flipping these knives is no different then ticket scalping IMO
 
The easiest solution, which I have proposed before, is to limit sales to one per customer.

At least that way there is a much better chance of more knives getting to more people, less hoarding and flipping for profit.

If a guy has only ONE he is much less likely to sell it.

I dont have an issue with people selling at a mark-up, but I do have an issue with people buying several PURELY for the sake of re-selling at a profit when the supply dries up.
 
But the only way to implement that is direct sales from Spyderco, and even that can be evaded with a small amount of ingenuity.

Buffalohump said:
The easiest solution, which I have proposed before, is to limit sales to one per customer.

At least that way there is a much better chance of more knives getting to more people, less hoarding and flipping for profit.

If a guy has only ONE he is much less likely to sell it.

I dont have an issue with people selling at a mark-up, but I do have an issue with people buying several PURELY for the sake of re-selling at a profit when the supply dries up.
Click to expand...
 
I love the sprint run game, half the fun and lure of those knives is the hunt without paying exorbitant private seller rates. :)
 
Buffalohump said:
The easiest solution, which I have proposed before, is to limit sales to one per customer.

At least that way there is a much better chance of more knives getting to more people, less hoarding and flipping for profit.

If a guy has only ONE he is much less likely to sell it.

I dont have an issue with people selling at a mark-up, but I do have an issue with people buying several PURELY for the sake of re-selling at a profit when the supply dries up.
Click to expand...

There are some retailers that do a 1 per customer sales approach. I think that is cool, but it has it's downsides. There have been moments where this knife dealer had a limited run, implemented the 1 per customer and they ended up sitting a pile of awesome knives for over 10 months. That isn't making them any money having that stuff on the shelves. I've noticed that there is very little 1 per customer at this retailer now. It's to unpredictable, and in most business the person that is "first to market" with the hot nwew item wins.


JNewell said:
But the only way to implement that is direct sales from Spyderco, and even that can be evaded with a small amount of ingenuity.
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Just imagine the money it would take to implement that kind of policy too. It would end up like the Mule team, only worse.
 
Joben said:
I found myself thinking about your post off an on all day today.

I would like to say that I have some emotional sypathy for your viewpoint. I remember the first time I ever sold things for more than I payed for them...it seemed ungentlemanly. I thought about it for a while and decided that this was an absurd way to feel.

Not only is it absurd i doudt it is a philophopy you apply consistantly in your own life. I really doudt that if for example you bought a house for 200k and then a few years later upon deciding to sell it found it was now valued at 300k that you would insist on selling it for only what you paid. Of course you would not. Each time an item is sold it's current market value is considered. That is the way of the world. That is how business is done.

I really think your judgement of people who sell limited edition knives on the exchange is unfair to both parties involved in such a deal. We must be honest here, both parties are acting in their own interests, this is not a relationship with an exploiter and a victim. One wishes to make a profit, the other wishes to aquire a rare item of value to him. There is no arm twisting or subterfuge going on. If they arrive at an agreement and both depart satisfied who are you to declare one of them reprehensible?
Click to expand...

+1 Well said. They also don't work for free or turn down increases in their salary.
 
I used to buy short run/special edition slippies and make 'em safe queens but it just isn't right for me anymore. They are tools and I use all of them. Getting excited, waiting and waiting only to tuck it away in a dark safe isn't for everyone. They aren't worth a dime if you don't sell them and if you don't use them what do you really have? You spend hours getting that S90V edge down to a few molecules and then put it away like a mushroom! :D
 
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Buffalohump said:
The easiest solution, which I have proposed before, is to limit sales to one per customer.

At least that way there is a much better chance of more knives getting to more people, less hoarding and flipping for profit.

If a guy has only ONE he is much less likely to sell it.

I dont have an issue with people selling at a mark-up, but I do have an issue with people buying several PURELY for the sake of re-selling at a profit when the supply dries up.
Click to expand...

If Spyderco only sold the Sprints direct like the Mules as opposed to through dealers they could better limit the sales to one per person.

I don't really see that many Sprints flipped- I think most people buy them to keep, cherish and use. I think it's just a small percentage that buy with the intent to sell.
 
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