Has anyone asked kershaw why they don't want forums here?

Status
Not open for further replies.
G

GalvanizedHero

Feedback: +0 / =0 / -0
Joined
Feb 3, 2018
Messages
48
For a brand that refuses to take part in the community here it's strange they get rewarded with 2/3rd's of the new posts in general discussion. Has anyone asked them why directly or tried to appeal to kershaw?

It's been 5 years. Who ever asked for the closure might not even work there anymore.
 
It obviously wasn't worth the work. Some other companies have felt the same, for different reasons. Maybe they will get to the time when they will come back, but to be honest, the KAI haters are louder than the fanboys, and it just ends badly so often that it doesn't get anyone anywhere.
 
GalvanizedHero said:
For a brand that refuses to take part in the community here it's strange they get rewarded with 2/3rd's of the new posts in general discussion. Has anyone asked them why directly or tried to appeal to kershaw?

It's been 5 years. Who ever asked for the closure might not even work there anymore.
Click to expand...

Well... sometimes done is done. Or as has been said by others "enough it too much".

The Kershaw forum was on fire when I signed up, and it was a busy place. Got me interested in Kershaw more than I ever thought about as they posted new models, looked for customer input and had a factory rep that visited here on their behalf.

It looks like you just got to BF, so it might be hard for you to understand how nasty and demanding some people can be. The tone went from being a friendly and great place to discuss Kershaw to people thinking it was an actual factory customer service venue where they should be able to get all questions asked on their schedule. The moderator (Thomas) was slammed hard if someone asked a question and he didn't respond to them personally, and as soon as they thought possible. He was trying to sell knives, and now matter how many times he posted the toll free number, any time some meathead bought a Kershaw they were unhappy with they rarely looked at any previous posts, never searched the archives, but posted to him here. He was out selling the knives as their main rep and took and just added this forum to his duties so from time to time Kershaw would have an actual guy here.

But it became a full time job of answering questions all day long, pissing off people that didn't get a "timely" response from him. And there were a ton of stoooopid questions, too. Can I baton with this knife? How good is your steel? Can I order this knife in XXXX steel? Why not? Do you have a custom shop? Why not? Can I cut food with this knife? Will this knife be offered with different colored scales? How hard is this knife to sharpen? Can I get another pocket clip in black?

And on, and on, and on. Watch to see how quickly nearly every thread goes off topic here on BF. Sometimes just three posts later guys are yakking about something totally unrelated to the thread.
So the guy that thought he would be dropping in from time to time to see how things were going suddenly became the main customer service rep for them, easily searched for on Google. People joined BF just so they could contact him directly. When he didn't respond in a timely manner or with the answers they wanted, they called Kershaw directly. Thomas had enough and started firing back at the posters and things got pretty sour. IIRC, they closed it down for a while.

It came back, so did Thomas and he had some help this time. But people here were already pissed off, and truthfully, their moment had passed. A lot of people wanted them to succeed, and just as many had to post on their forum a lot of snark, smart a$$ remarks, and then criticize the Kershaw product. The things that got under Thomas's skin to begin with started all over, and it got nasty fast.

I bought a lot of Kershaws. I actually talked to Thomas Welk on the phone a few times, no long conversations, and one on one he was great. He wasn't geared for the job here, and I have to say though, that he had a lot more patience than I would have. I remember one post in the Kershaw forum (paraphrasing) being along the lines of "I have a problem with my Kershaw XXXX and wondered if anyone else had this problem". The answer from some butt hurt clown smart guy was something like "I don't know about that knife, all I carry is Spyderco, and I NEVER have had that problem". The digs like that got to be too much. Thomas can be pretty thin skinned, too, and was a dyed in the wool Kershaw man. I seem to recall that Spark had had enough of all of it, and so it was done. So off the forum they went again. The second time they left it was really time.

I don't think there is any reason for them to come back. Plenty of chatter about Kershaw knives. Good bang for the buck, lots of new models, and no one needs the headaches on their part or the problems they had here. I chatted with a lot of devotees of the product back then and there were a lot of great guys hanging around from time to time on that forum. But sometimes in the end, it just isn't worth it to anyone. Too much he said, she said, they said, I am right, no you are wrong, all that kind of stuff.

That's my take. You can call Thomas at Kershaw and ask! Yikes! As of mid last year he was still there at Kershaw and has moved up the ladder a notch or two.

Robert
 
GalvanizedHero said:
Work?



I figured even asking the question would shake both of their trees but I was genuinely curious. Angry people on the internet is like 98% of the internet.
Click to expand...
It's fine to be curious. As you can guess, angry people mean work. Its also tough to be a Mfg mod, they have a harder job in some ways than the super-mods because they can't just start knocking heads without also representing their brand, where as the supers can just roll in with the ban-hammer if needed. Its a tough line to find. So if other people higher up prefer other social media which has "better" penetration for them, it becomes easier to moderate a facebook feed, or similar, and the effort is put there instead.
 
midnight flyer said:
Well... sometimes done is done. Or as has been said by others "enough it too much".

The Kershaw forum was on fire when I signed up, and it was a busy place. Got me interested in Kershaw more than I ever thought about as they posted new models, looked for customer input and had a factory rep that visited here on their behalf.

It looks like you just got to BF, so it might be hard for you to understand how nasty and demanding some people can be. The tone went from being a friendly and great place to discuss Kershaw to people thinking it was an actual factory customer service venue where they should be able to get all questions asked on their schedule. The moderator (Thomas) was slammed hard if someone asked a question and he didn't respond to them personally, and as soon as they thought possible. He was trying to sell knives, and now matter how many times he posted the toll free number, any time some meathead bought a Kershaw they were unhappy with they rarely looked at any previous posts, never searched the archives, but posted to him here. He was out selling the knives as their main rep and took and just added this forum to his duties so from time to time Kershaw would have an actual guy here.

But it became a full time job of answering questions all day long, pissing off people that didn't get a "timely" response from him. And there were a ton of stoooopid questions, too. Can I baton with this knife? How good is your steel? Can I order this knife in XXXX steel? Why not? Do you have a custom shop? Why not? Can I cut food with this knife? Will this knife be offered with different colored scales? How hard is this knife to sharpen? Can I get another pocket clip in black?

And on, and on, and on. Watch to see how quickly nearly every thread goes off topic here on BF. Sometimes just three posts later guys are yakking about something totally unrelated to the thread.
So the guy that thought he would be dropping in from time to time to see how things were going suddenly became the main customer service rep for them, easily searched for on Google. People joined BF just so they could contact him directly. When he didn't respond in a timely manner or with the answers they wanted, they called Kershaw directly. Thomas had enough and started firing back at the posters and things got pretty sour. IIRC, they closed it down for a while.

It came back, so did Thomas and he had some help this time. But people here were already pissed off, and truthfully, their moment had passed. A lot of people wanted them to succeed, and just as many had to post on their forum a lot of snark, smart a$$ remarks, and then criticize the Kershaw product. The things that got under Thomas's skin to begin with started all over, and it got nasty fast.

I bought a lot of Kershaws. I actually talked to Thomas Welk on the phone a few times, no long conversations, and one on one he was great. He wasn't geared for the job here, and I have to say though, that he had a lot more patience than I would have. I remember one post in the Kershaw forum (paraphrasing) being along the lines of "I have a problem with my Kershaw XXXX and wondered if anyone else had this problem". The answer from some butt hurt clown smart guy was something like "I don't know about that knife, all I carry is Spyderco, and I NEVER have had that problem". The digs like that got to be too much. Thomas can be pretty thin skinned, too, and was a dyed in the wool Kershaw man. I seem to recall that Spark had had enough of all of it, and so it was done. So off the forum they went again. The second time they left it was really time.

I don't think there is any reason for them to come back. Plenty of chatter about Kershaw knives. Good bang for the buck, lots of new models, and no one needs the headaches on their part or the problems they had here. I chatted with a lot of devotees of the product back then and there were a lot of great guys hanging around from time to time on that forum. But sometimes in the end, it just isn't worth it to anyone. Too much he said, she said, they said, I am right, no you are wrong, all that kind of stuff.

That's my take. You can call Thomas at Kershaw and ask! Yikes! As of mid last year he was still there at Kershaw and has moved up the ladder a notch or two.

Robert
Click to expand...
Hey, thanks for the insight, midnight. It's genuine enthusiasts like you that drew me to this site in the first place.
 
midnight flyer said:
Well... sometimes done is done. Or as has been said by others "enough it too much".

The Kershaw forum was on fire when I signed up, and it was a busy place. Got me interested in Kershaw more than I ever thought about as they posted new models, looked for customer input and had a factory rep that visited here on their behalf.

It looks like you just got to BF, so it might be hard for you to understand how nasty and demanding some people can be. The tone went from being a friendly and great place to discuss Kershaw to people thinking it was an actual factory customer service venue where they should be able to get all questions asked on their schedule. The moderator (Thomas) was slammed hard if someone asked a question and he didn't respond to them personally, and as soon as they thought possible. He was trying to sell knives, and now matter how many times he posted the toll free number, any time some meathead bought a Kershaw they were unhappy with they rarely looked at any previous posts, never searched the archives, but posted to him here. He was out selling the knives as their main rep and took and just added this forum to his duties so from time to time Kershaw would have an actual guy here.

But it became a full time job of answering questions all day long, pissing off people that didn't get a "timely" response from him. And there were a ton of stoooopid questions, too. Can I baton with this knife? How good is your steel? Can I order this knife in XXXX steel? Why not? Do you have a custom shop? Why not? Can I cut food with this knife? Will this knife be offered with different colored scales? How hard is this knife to sharpen? Can I get another pocket clip in black?

And on, and on, and on. Watch to see how quickly nearly every thread goes off topic here on BF. Sometimes just three posts later guys are yakking about something totally unrelated to the thread.
So the guy that thought he would be dropping in from time to time to see how things were going suddenly became the main customer service rep for them, easily searched for on Google. People joined BF just so they could contact him directly. When he didn't respond in a timely manner or with the answers they wanted, they called Kershaw directly. Thomas had enough and started firing back at the posters and things got pretty sour. IIRC, they closed it down for a while.

It came back, so did Thomas and he had some help this time. But people here were already pissed off, and truthfully, their moment had passed. A lot of people wanted them to succeed, and just as many had to post on their forum a lot of snark, smart a$$ remarks, and then criticize the Kershaw product. The things that got under Thomas's skin to begin with started all over, and it got nasty fast.

I bought a lot of Kershaws. I actually talked to Thomas Welk on the phone a few times, no long conversations, and one on one he was great. He wasn't geared for the job here, and I have to say though, that he had a lot more patience than I would have. I remember one post in the Kershaw forum (paraphrasing) being along the lines of "I have a problem with my Kershaw XXXX and wondered if anyone else had this problem". The answer from some butt hurt clown smart guy was something like "I don't know about that knife, all I carry is Spyderco, and I NEVER have had that problem". The digs like that got to be too much. Thomas can be pretty thin skinned, too, and was a dyed in the wool Kershaw man. I seem to recall that Spark had had enough of all of it, and so it was done. So off the forum they went again. The second time they left it was really time.

I don't think there is any reason for them to come back. Plenty of chatter about Kershaw knives. Good bang for the buck, lots of new models, and no one needs the headaches on their part or the problems they had here. I chatted with a lot of devotees of the product back then and there were a lot of great guys hanging around from time to time on that forum. But sometimes in the end, it just isn't worth it to anyone. Too much he said, she said, they said, I am right, no you are wrong, all that kind of stuff.

That's my take. You can call Thomas at Kershaw and ask! Yikes! As of mid last year he was still there at Kershaw and has moved up the ladder a notch or two.

Robert
Click to expand...

I don't know man that sounds like some thin skin on thomas. The other 30 manufacturer forums seem to get on fine.

I can't speak as to what took place before I browsed these pages but if people were as buck wild and ignorant as you describe the rest of the forum members would have a heyday tearing them to ribbons everyday as is the custom on the internet.
 
They hadn't a clue as to how to moderate a forum and decided it was too much trouble. I doubt it did them much damage from a sales perspective, so I don't think it can be called a poor business decision, though I feel for the KAI fans who enjoyed it as a digital watering hole.

About Thomas Welk, I honestly feel the less is said the better.
 
Thomas Welk is a bit of a prickly character and a lightning rod. He has very little patience for people trying to tell him how KAI should be run. The Speedsafe issue is a good example of the dynamic that developed in the forum. Thomas tried any number of times to explain that Speedsafe was hugely popular among their customers. Forumites (some/too many) just refused to accept his explanations and insisted on telling him how wrong they were and how much Speedsafe sucked. That same dynamic obtained on other issues as well. He/they just had enough and left. I follow them on a forum on which they continue to participate. There are criticisms and questions raised there, but in a much less confrontational/obnoxious way. It seems to work fine, even though Thomas is still prickly! FWIW
 
M midnight flyer Thank you for the very clear post. That took time.

Although I never participated in that venue, your overarching synopsis makes it very clear why it can be ALSO good business to NOT participate in forums. I have very thin skin, and would never survive in an angry arena. Good for him to do as much as he could.
 
Insipid Moniker said:
They hadn't a clue as to how to moderate a forum and decided it was too much trouble. I doubt it did them much damage from a sales perspective, so I don't think it can be called a poor business decision, though I feel for the KAI fans who enjoyed it as a digital watering hole.

About Thomas Welk, I honestly feel the less is said the better.
Click to expand...

He is mercurial, VERY thin skinned and acted like a child here and on the "green" forum. KAI did not get any more negative attention here than any other brand. The simple fact is that Thomas does not do a good job of dealing with the public on a forum.

All that being said, my interaction with him (very limited) was positive, and I think ZT and Kershaw make some GREAT knives.
 
HappyDaddy said:
Thomas Welk is a bit of a prickly character and a lightning rod. He has very little patience for people trying to tell him how KAI should be run. The Speedsafe issue is a good example of the dynamic that developed in the forum. Thomas tried any number of times to explain that Speedsafe was hugely popular among their customers. Forumites (some/too many) just refused to accept his explanations and insisted on telling him how wrong they were and how much Speedsafe sucked. That same dynamic obtained on other issues as well. He/they just had enough and left. I follow them on a forum on which they continue to participate. There are criticisms and questions raised there, but in a much less confrontational/obnoxious way. It seems to work fine, even though Thomas is still prickly! FWIW
Click to expand...

I remember that. He had physics, engineering and research on his side, and the nay sayers had an anonymous opinion and a Blur in theirs. And you described pretty much how most (not all) of those guys expressed themselves. With great authority, a sense of gravity, and a bit of haughtiness they would proclaim "get over it dude, Speedsafe sucks".

They have made millions of knives (literally) with Speedsafe openers, and it has been an overwhelming success for Kershaw. But the internet gives voice to everyone, including those that no one wants to hear from. Kershaw hit on a few clinkers at that time, and it got to be open season on them from a few guys. They didn't like the fact that Kershaw was moving more and more of their production to China (unAmerican).

Folks didn't like the idea of one handed opening. Sitting at their desk at work, they couldn't see any benefit, so it had to be wrong. For me, working on construction it was like finding the gift you wanted under the Christmas tree. I didn't have to put down material that needed to be cut (say a binding strap) to open my knife for use. Score!!

People didn't like recurves and Kershaw had a bunch. Most couldn't sharpen them so they were deemed "mall ninja gear" and bordering on fantasy knives. Personally, I still have three Tremors that I bought for work, and they are now several years old. Can't kill them, and they had not only the banana style handle, but a pretty good recurve. Sharpening is easy when you know how, but many felt that with a fairly heavy recurve that Kershaw should offer free sharpening due to its complexity. Free sharpening like Benchmade, except that Kershaws were about 1/3 the price.

Some people didn't like the assisted opening devices, and that is still true. "My pappy and his'n never had no switchblade, and I ain't neither" was kind of the rant. REAL knife people didn't consider a combination of an illegal knife (not really) made in China, with a blade they couldn't sharpen.

Choice of materials was also a point of contention and many didn't like FRN, G10, aluminum, or titanium.

Some hated the new designs and gleefully hammered Kershaw's efforts to dust. Others bought the same knife just to see what the fuss was about, then happily dog piled on the negativity feeling that their purchased had relieved them of manners and decorum.

You get the point. There were others. Then when someone disagreed, the wars started. Thomas would be called to referee, and there was always someone butt hurt. They had to be heard and had to have their point recognized. Thomas' take was simple; just don't buy Kershaw, and don't let the door hit you on the way out.

Personally I got so sick of the fighting myself that I just quit BF for a few years and stumbled back on it when I was looking for knife info and the Google search showed several threads on the subject that pointed to BF. The place has calmed down a lot, but some of the same old nastiness comes up from time to time which can't really be helped on the internet where everyone is right, and everyone is an expert.

Robert
 
I read a bit history of kershaw/ZT subforum here and can understand why KAI decided not to continue.

I'm just curious why the GKD forum cannot be re-structured with subforums under it that do NOT require moderators from the manufacturers? Just put a reminder on the top of the subforum like"This subforum is limited to posts/threads of Kershaw and ZT knives." If some people decide to post about Cold Steel knives in it then be it but as time goes I believe it won't be much of a problem. Really no more moderating than that for the GKD is needed.

Or maybe doing so is like branding for KAI for free, which Spark does not like? But on the other hand I can argue a subforum like that will increase the traffic and visitors of BFC, which is a good thing for this website.
 
sharp_edge said:
I read a bit history of kershaw/ZT subforum here and can understand why KAI decided not to continue.

I'm just curious why the GKD forum cannot be re-structured with subforums under it that do NOT require moderators from the manufacturers? Just put a reminder on the top of the subforum like"This subforum is limited to posts/threads of Kershaw and ZT knives." If some people decide to post about Cold Steel knives in it then be it but as time goes I believe it won't be much of a problem. Really no more moderating than that for the GKD is needed.

Or maybe doing so is like branding for KAI for free, which Spark does not like? But on the other hand I can argue a subforum like that will increase the traffic and visitors of BFC, which is a good thing for this website.
Click to expand...
Running a subforum for a company without the explicit permission from said company would open you up to a whole world of legal headaches and, frankly, if the company isn't willing to put in any effort, why bother? Manufacturer subforums here are provided freely, as a courtesy, but they're opt in and manufacturers have to moderate their own. I don't think BFC is in any way hurting for traffic and I doubt an unofficial forum would make much difference even if they were.
 
I like Kershaws.. I like AO.. I like their designs and REALLY like some of the 2018s coming.. Shame the Forum had to come to an end!! Real Shame!! John:)
 
They’re still on the green forum, and their people still have the maturity of a 5 year old most of the time.

I like (and own) a lot of kai products but truth be told every time I read their forum for more than 3 mins it makes we want to buy any more less and less.

By contrast, the Spyderco forums both here and on their website are polar opposite of that Kai forum.
 
I can say one thing positive that happened from all of that business with Kai. I now have a super allergy to fanboys and once they once they arrived in force on a thread, I abandon ship. Blind allegiance to anybody or anything is not a good thing.

I like certain brands more than others, that's for sure. But I also understand nobody or nothing is perfect and from time to time even the best of us and our favorites are less than perfect or even fall on their face. I have no blind allegiance.

But there are those that are so in enamored with certain brands that it makes it impossible to have an intelligent discussion about a product. Plenty of other things to do with time than to ARGUE with someone about the color of a pocket clip for how much recurve a blade has before it is not useful.

Robert
 
Last edited:
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top