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Hate for benchmade or spyderco

I must add that my new s30v military came today, and there is some very minor play in the blade back to front. It gets better as I tighten the pivot, but is never completely gone. Part of me wishes I had gotten an atr, but the other part loves the knife design and isn't too worried about the lock.
I believe I saw a pic of a military where the lock commpressed under stress, but still was blocking the blade. Is that right?
-Well, gonna try some break in time too, so it (the lock) might tighten up still.

Also meant to say a while back that I too feel that the endura and delica 3 are better than the newer modles. I sold a endura 3, bought an endura 4, sold the endura 4 , and bought an endura 3. -Never sold my delica. Old ones were fine, better than fine even. I'll stick with the 3 series.
 
Hello Brownshoe, I guess we'll try one more time as well. :rolleyes:

There have been no changes in Spyderco's philosophies for the past 25 years.

"Let me try one last time to clarify the warranty issue, the Jot's screws went into micarta as opposed to the steel liner. Myself and others had knives replaced by spyderco due to the problem and were told by spyderco warranty repair that it was a design flaw. SMKW advertised spyderco knives with this problem as "clip not meant to be removed." Clearly this is a design flaw. Since the change in warranty policy, the screws coming out of the micarta on a Jot has been denied compensation. This is a change in past policy. By the way, the Jot may be 10 years old, but I've seen two of them for sale new at MSRP. One in a hardware store and the other in a knife store. Both have the original packaging. One already suffered from another Jot manufacturing problem you noted earlier, the poor liner lock".

The design called for the clip screws to go through the liner. the maker did not follow the design and the first several hundered pieces suffered the problem. the maker then followed the design. We replaced them as we could until the models were gone, and the parts were gone. Then we offered alternatives. Anything beyond that is in my opinion unrealistic. Your expectations are IMO unrealistic.

We no longer make the model and we no longer work with the maker. If we ever make the model again as a sprint, it will be with another maker.

And yes, I think you are harboring a 10 year old grudge.

"The same change in policy has been noticed by me and others with the older intergral endura and delica clips that used to be fixed for free and now no longer are".

"In addition, older spydercos were bought with the expectation that the tips would be reground for free; this is no longer done. I've had knives returned to me with a note indicating that the current service covered by my original contract with spyderco, would be no longer offered due to an upcoming change in spyderco policy. "We'll help you now, but in the future, sorry boy you're out of luck." These knives were bought by me and others with an original repair and warranty expectation, that spyderco no longer supports. The note from spyderco shows this was a corporate decision to no longer support the original consumer expectation".

We made millions of Enduras and Delicas with integral clips. A few came back so we replaced them. Then we learned that people were intentionally breaking the clips and tips to get a new knife. so we charged $10 to replace the clip and mail it back. It stopped the "cheats". Not unreasonable.

Did you read the Warrantee? Mfg defects for one year. Did you write your own Spyderco warrantee and expect us to honor it?

"I like your kitchen knives and deplore their removal from the catalog. Instead of marketing one of the best tools around, spyderco markets the Kris, a more martial product. This is a change in the company that used to not even list the civilian on-line".

We spent many tens of thousands of dollars marketing the kitchen knives. We do no marketing of the Kris. Besides, the Kris is a historical product, not a martial product.

Methinks your marketing knowledge and experience is very limited.

"When it comes to lockbacks, i agree spyderco makes a great product. My three lockbacks have no play, but I bought them before spyderco started indicating play was normal. Queen replaces/repairs their lockbacks if there is play. From the spyderco philosophy, what would one expect? You read the forums, this seems to be a common product complaint. There's a thread on the mannix right now and have been past threads on the native".

Sorry, I'll match our lockbaks against Queen any day. I think you should re-read and re-read my replies to you. Your arguments are dwindling. Your "selective reading" is cheating you of sincere communication.

Good luck Mr. Brownshoe. I don't think you should ever purchase another Spyderco product. I think you should continue to complain about your 10 year old model for the rest of your life. I will continue to look upon your posts as generally negative and and watch you continue to beat this dead horse.

I am no longer interested in trying to please you.

best,

sal
 
brownshoe said:
"We'll help you now, but in the future, sorry boy you're out of luck."
Click to expand...

I have a very hard time believing this is an actual quote from a representative of Spyderco.
 
Mr. Glesser, how are you? -Hope you're still around here. Anyways, I am currious as to your feelings about my new military's liner issue. It came from a non dealer in "new" condition via an e-bay seller.
This must be about my 10th spyderco, so I have many boxes that state the warranty, and from them I must assume the warranty follows the knife. -Is that infact the case, and what is your feeling about the originality of the blade play to begin with.
-We all thank you for your time.
 
Hey Sal: I kept wondering when you would throw in the towel on this one.
I've never seen any knife maker try harder to really explain his position, but how much can a man take for God's sake :D I must say I really enjoyed this post :)
 
I've had nothing but great results with both companies. I've had issues with about 3 Spydercos over a 10yr period. Stripped screws, stuff like that. They always fixed'em up right away and got'em back to me quick. I have problems with 3 Benchmades also in this time period, one of which was caused by me tinkering with the lock and breaking it. Again, fixed right up and quick. No complaints here at all. One thing I don't understand is Brownshoe's hatred for the Martial line of folders\blades. Does he not realize that some people do use knives as weapons??
 
Mr. Glesser, You are a skillful communicator. I certainly respect your skill. This is my first comment on you personally, other than to mistakenly state you do not control spyderco. I do know you are the president and founder, I just thought the company had been sold awhile back. Your remarks about me are humbling and constructive. Thank you.

I don't hold a 10 year grudge, I've only been a spyderco consumer since ~2000. As I said, I was a big fan in the begining. Per me being negative, there have been more than a few spyderco problem threads I've ignored.

I'll give my final reply also.

When it comes to enduras and delicas, the policy I was familiar with was fixing the clip and regriding the tip for no charge, not replacement for no charge. If spyderco used to replace for no charge, then it's clearly an even bigger change to stop replacement for a spyderco factory problem and to then start charging.

The Jot, Endura and Delicas with integral clips are not 10 year old products to the man who buys them NIB today from a brick and mortar store. Plus, even it is a 10 year old knife, if you'd regrind a tip for free a year after purchase, why not 8 years later? It was a service expected (and paid for) at the time of purchase.

I'd only expect spyderco to honor the warrantee and repair promise that came with a knife. New warranties for new knives, not new warranties for old knives.

Don't know what spyderco calls marketing, but I've seen a lot of "buzz" on your kris for the last couple of months. Anyone into knives for a couple of years knows the relationships between the knife rags and the manufacturers. Maybe marketing means only ads to spyderco.

In your response to play in spyercos lockbacks, you claim I don't read the responses. What an artful dodge, because I can't find a straight answer to this question. What is stated is lockbacks are not self adjusting, spydercos are great even with some play, etc.. Read the threads if you want to see what customers expect and get from other companies when it comes to play. With the number of complaints about spyderco's lock-up, the horse is not dead.
 
Monochrom I should rephrase that to: Liner locks and any integral lock like the frame locks "can" on occasion be problematic in more ways than one.

I refer you to my liner frame lock quiz just to give you a tip of the ice berg view of the differences and/or controversy surrounding these style of locks.

Don't interpret this wrong though. I carry them, use them and make them. I also have my own ideas of what is best but am always open to someone that can show me scientifically that their way is better. It isn't that I am a liner or frame lock hater. I just tell it as I see it and if now and again I have to swallow my foot in the process I'll be ther first to admit it.

STR

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3685458&postcount=103
 
Hi Brownshoe.

Your comments are noted and respected. And thanx for your kind comment.

Perhaps in the future, through our perserverance, philosophies, values and good products, we will win you back.

sal
 
My Friend,

brownshoe said:
5. The MBC stuff is disgusting. Stop it. Don’t openly market the civilian. Get rid of spyderco weapons line (that’s why I can’t stand the Kris.)
Click to expand...

MBC is not disgusting; it is a extension of the utility and value of knives. Period. Spyderco does not have a "weapons" line. There are some knives more suited than others to MBC/SD, but ALL of them can be used as utility blades, including the Civilian you so revile (which is riding proudly in my pocket as I type this).

FYI - to the best of my knowledge, the Civilian has NEVER been "marketed" in the way in which you describe. In fact, I have never seen it in a Spyderco Catalog until this year, and I have catalogs back to the early nineties.

You might want to brush up on your homework before leveling a finger at Sal Glesser and Spyderco. :D Failure to do so will result in looking very silly. :jerkit:

--------
Hannibal
 
From my view point and experience working with Spyderco I have learned alot. I have personally witnessed Sal hold the line on product quality; it takes a lot of determination and fortitude to make that happen at the level of quality in the products that come out of Spyderco.

Joyce Laituri is responcible for marketing at Spyderco; she is the best in the industry. She maintains positive honorable relationships with 100's of people. Joyce's marketing packs at the SHOT and IWA shows are specifically designed to the recipiant. Joyce has personally introduced me to many writers and publishers.

I market my own custom knives in that industry. I market my Spyderco designs in the commercial market. I send sample knives to ten different writers and other persons of interest that I respect. My designs are best handled to be understood. I have gotten press with this effort.

My focus with knives has been for functional ergonomic safe use. I see knife as tool, yes they are tools that can be used as weapons. The Keris or Kris is a highly identifiable ethnic design. I chose to use the more utilitarian Moro-bolo Kris as my inspiration rather than the more dagger sword like Keris. The cutting ability of the wavey blade is an experience and very functional in EDC. Ethnic knives give use the chance to work with different and very highly developed means of cutting.

As a farmer I work in isolated areas by myself. Personal safety is survival. Although weapons are not my focus I believe in and support many martial artists friends. I'm all about teaching people to be able to care for themselves. A friends dojo has the moto (paraphrased) Only a warrior can chose to be a pacifist; all others are condemed to that position...Take Care...Ed
 
Ok, call me a dick or whatever you see fit, or nothing at all, but does someone have to totally disrespect the owner/operator of a knife company to get a responce or feed back? I can completely understand you are a very busy man, Mr. Glesser, but you have plenty of time for one mans "issues"; why not another? Do I need quadruple didgit posts, or was I just too respectful?
I understand you were/are dealing with a long term discussion with a very disgruntled (sp) customer, but I have to believe you overlooked my post/question. -Perhaps not.
I have nothing but great respect for you and your company and even as I write this I seem to be coming across as the bad guy in my own mind. Clearly you are very dedicated to your customers, and perhaps that's why I expected a responce from you. Maybe I've been spoiled, if you will, by your willingness to communicate with your customers.
Regardless, I'll happily contact the person answering the phones at spyderco, and get my info there.
I'm sure I'm probably over reacting (and about to gety my a** ripped by some other members), but I still would like you to know that I appreciate the fact that you take the time to post here at all. I look forward to having my problem resolved and to buying more of your fine knives in the future.
Siggyhk
 
Please don't feel sauer, Siggyhk. I'm sure your question will be answered in due time. You may also wish to send a note to customerservice@spyderco.com to get your linerlock issue corrected. Maybe someone only had an eye out for one specific person on this thread? While glad he posts here and at his company-owned forum (and British Blades and probably several others), maybe we'd get more knives out of Sal if we weren't always addressing questions specifically to him. In your case, you want your particular knife you already have dealt with, so my advice applies more to me.
 
Hi Siggyhk,

Sorry, didn't mean to slight you. Guess I was caught up in "Brownshoe's problem". I aso half thought you were kidding to Spice up the complaints".

My apologies.

I don't normally handle Warrantee & repair complaints unless they really become a problem. We have a Warrantee staff for that and they are very good. I try to focus on questions that others might not know the answers to.

As Cliff mentioned, the degree of "imperfection" from collectors can be difficult to determine.

I might also mention that most manufacturers will only service the original owner, with receipt of purchase. That's one of the reasons where our "honest, fair and proper" warrantee is more fair.

sal
 
I don't really have a preference between Benchmade or Spyderco I like them both. But It does seem that Spyderco is more customer oriented when it come to design. In the end though I just buy what I like whomever the maker. However Spydies do make up the bulk of my modest collection.

:D
 
Boy, this turned into a major thread with major players involved.

Got more respect for Spyderco now (that's impresive in its self).

Still a "Benchmade Man," but those Spyderco knives that have been on the back burner are movin' up the line.
 
I do believe after my Rukus pruchace next month, Because if what I read from Sal, Im going to buy my first Spyderco! Now I need to know what 50.00 will get me. But as I said I have all BM;s in my collection and its time to venture out and live a little................
 
I just cant sem to get past the HUNCH BACK OF NOTER DAMN look most spydie blades carry with them. Its just plain homely,(my opinion)
 
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