Help! ...with selecting a traditional folder

[einsteinjon]

I usually go for more modern knives (Spyderco is my poison),but lately I’ve really been drooling over some traditional slip joint and lock back type folders. I’d love some help in learning about them and picking a great knife.

I know nothing about the traditional knife makers/brands and am not partial to any,but I’d like to find something that has good fit and finish and reliability,great steel (type,grind,heat treat,etc.),and a great reputation for customer service. The steels I was seeing pop up a lot are D2 and 1095. I usually love D2,but have been fairly disappointed with 1095’s rust resisting capabilities before. This makes me apprehensive to get a pocket knife with 1095,but I could be swayed. I am open to other steels,I just don’t want lower end junk like 420hc,etc. I typically find myself drawn to steels with higher hardnesses,so if it is known that one brand/maker heat treats their blades harder,I’d love to hear about it!

I don’t want to mention the retail websites or brands/makers I’ve been looking into so as not to sway suggestions,but what I’ve been finding is that I’m loving “jack” styles with preferably 2 blades –a clip-ish type blade and a sort of spear/drop point style. I’m also hoping to find something in the 4-inch-closed range with blades that are as long and DEEP as possible. I guess the handle length is a bit inconsequential as I’d just prefer something with a blade that is at least 3 to 3.25 inches,but longer would be better. I’ve also been particularly drawn to the look of stag handles,as well as various horn and bone handles,but that material isn’t a huge issue.

In regard to this 2-blade configuration,a question arises…does it matter from a usability or reliability standpoint if the 2 blades are on the same side of the knife versus on opposite ends?

Lastly,I’d like to mention that I’ve had Case knives in the past and really didn’t like the steel at all (didn’t take or hold an edge). I’d really like to find out about better brands rather than the “mainstream” ones. I don’t mean to hate on Case,just am saying it isn’t for me. If you like them, that’s great!

Oh,and price-wise I’m looking for under $200.

I know this is all really picky yet really vague,but I just wanted to see what would come of this. Thanks in advance for your help!!!

Jon

 

[Ryanol]

I'm interested in hearing what the "old timers" say on this one.

FWIW I think you'd be smart to start with a full size trapper if your coming from a typical "thumber".

 

[defaultuser]

The 2010 Traditional Forum Moose knife seems to fit your requirements pretty well!

Here's a shot of mine - Love it!

 

[einsteinjon]

The 2010 Traditional Forum Moose knife seems to fit your requirements pretty well!

Here's a shot of mine - Love it!

What's the size? Steel type? Cost?

 

[Gevonovich]

I think its made out of unobtanium

 

[Will Power]

Carbon is perfectly OK if you just wipe it down after use- it can, impart flavour on raw foods though.

Check the Great Eastern Cutlery website and threads on GEC here and I'm sure you'll find something (many examples actually!) that you will like. A few of their knives come in high grade 440c stainless too.

Look into Queen Cutlery's D2 range, frankly the edges usually come bluntish which is a scandal, but you can get them where you want with diamond plus time and skill...Paper wheels too I hear. Some nice patterns are available. Böker, Germany have some very reasonable carbon patterns at attractive prices. Many people start by experimenting with knives from Rough Rider to see if they like the pattern or not. These are inexpensive but not cheaply finished knives from China, many people who use&collect Traditional patterns have been very satisfied with RR (including myself), they help you to test he waters.

I certainly wouldn't give up on CASE though. Their Large Stockman in cv and Swayback Jack in cv are favourites of mine, and they can do other very good knives too-don't be put off by some of their rather tasteless garish collector specials either.

Finally, take a look in the Traditional Knives For Sale section, some interesting&decent knives have come up there, but they tend to go fast!! Good luck.

 

[einsteinjon]

I figured being 2010

 

[2Dead]

The below are all 440c or D2. For the GECs, there are fewer 440c knives than 1095 but the ones I have listed are still available.

Canal Street Cutler Trapper, 4 1/8" closed with 440c blades

GEC #23 Trapper, 4.5" closed with 440c blades, blades about 3.5"

GEC #53 Furtaker Trapper, 4 1/8" closed with 440c blades. 3" blades

GEC #73 Trapper, 3 3/4" closed with 440c blades, blades about 3 1/8"

I'd recommend one of the newer single blade #73 trappers in burnt stag if you want to try 1095 again. It should be easier to maintain with fewer blades. The lanyard hole may be useful too and they are available with liner locks as well.

Queen #11 Utility, 4 1/8" closed with a 3 1/8-1/4" D2 blade

 

[Will Power]

Fine stripe on that Zebrawood Utility, Trand.
Got the same in CSB and ACSB, nice pattern.

 

[2Dead]

If you can find one, a GEC #53 Cuban Stockman is a good versatile choice. I don't have pics but Queen has some good sized stockman knives in D2 as well.

Tuna Valley Stockman is similar to the Furtaker I listed but also has the sheepsfoot and spey of the cuban stockman. The bone and cocobolo should still be out there and there may be a stag one available on the secondary market at a crazy price....

 

[2Dead]

Fine stripe on that Zebrawood Utility, Trand.
Got the same in CSB and ACSB, nice pattern.

Thanks Will. Believe it or not, that one came shaving sharp too. Got one in ACSB and BEM as well.

 

[einsteinjon]

The below are all 440c or D2. For the GECs, there are fewer 440c knives than 1095 but the ones I have listed are still available.

I'd recommend one of the newer single blade #73 trappers in burnt stag if you want to try 1095 again. It should be easier to maintain with fewer blades. The lanyard hole may be useful too and they are available with liner locks as well.

Can you tell me what the blade height and length are on this one? Also, does GEC's 1095 and 440C usually come razor sharp from the factory?

 

[Stelth]

Choosing something from the Buck 300 series would be a good place to start.

 

[300Bucks]

Knives shown are all good. But I am surprised Stelth did not make comment on the 420HC disc.

Mr. Jon, I make this comment with knowledge you may not know, and with a kind heart as I appreciate other makers knives and steels. But, myself along with several thousand other Buck knife folks will discuss kindly, I hope, that Buck Knives 420HC is not run of the mill. If you will do some reading about knife steel tempering you will run on to a considerable amount of information about one Mr. Paul Bos. He was a industry leader in the tempering of knife blades. He worked with Buck Knives and actually ran a tempering business of his own under the Buck Factory roof. He carefully designed a process that gives Buck 420HC a couple of steps above that normal grade of steel. I would believe a goodly portion of knife folks who have carefully studied such things would support that as fact. To causally toss out that ALL 420HC is "junk" is not quite a statement that you would make after investigating Mr. Bos and his influence on Bucks 420.
I too enjoy some knives in different kinds of steel, but am quite satisfied with Bucks 420HC to meet my demands of a EDC slipjoint.
Just Goggle Paul Bos and you will find information that may satisfy your desire to learn about some tempering process.

300Bucks

 

[defaultuser]

What's the size? Steel type? Cost?

Size is just shy of 4". Steel is 1095 if I remember correctly. Although I don't know the exact hardness, it must be pretty hard based on the way the steel respond under the stone. Still plenty tough - no chipping whatsoever so far.

You could always post in the WTB section - there's some fellows who bought multiple of it.

 

[Stelth]

But I am surprised Stelth did not make comment on the 420HC disc.

I confess to not reading the OP's entire post. Buck's steel is excellent and should be tried first before it is disparaged. It's good steel.

 

[Ryanol]

If I had to guess that stag liner lock #73 has converted many a thumber to traditionals eventually.

 

[einsteinjon]

Hahaha...well I've now learned that modern knife fans such as myself are known as "thumbers" around here.

The knives I was really digging prior to posting this thread were Great Eastern Cutlery, and it seems there is good consensus here that will fit my bill. Not sure yet if I want 1095 or 440C, but I may try the 1095.

300Bucks, with all due respect to your knife preferences, I have owned and used a few Buck knives, both traditional and modern folders, all in 420HC, at various times over the last 10 years or so. In comparison to other steels I regularly use, it wasn't really what I wanted in my knives (I'm spoiled by CPM M4, CPM D2, ZDP-189, S30V, CTS XHP, and so on). I've heard of Paul Bos and am sure his 420HC HT is better than most/all others. I just don't dig any 420HC I've tried myself. I don't mean to dump on any makers or steel, so I apologize for calling the steel junk. I know there are others such as yourself who like Buck knives, 420HC, etc. and that's cool. I don't mean to call your preferences junk. You should use what you like. I do appreciate the input though! :thumbup:

 

[300Bucks]

Jon,

I am not waving the flag here, just making sure your experiences aren't tainted by time. If I am telling you stuff you already know then please consider we may be informing others so in a sense are doing a good thing.

Buck contracted folders prior to 1985 likely all were 440A steel. These are almost always noted by the long pull on the main blade. 1986 - 1990 425M was used along with switch to small nic. After that Paul Bos comes in the picture and 420hc is used. So just making sure your experience of Buck steel was not pre 1985 and was after Bos treatments occurred. In the fixed blade world 440c was used by Buck until the late 1980s . The 425M doesn't seem bad to me. Some folks really like it especially in fixed blades. I am limited in my s30V experience, as a collector I get the knife not the blade in order to do a history. I believe I have only one or two, that I would never carry or sharpen. I have a couple of Buck Vantage Sandvic blades that seem to do well and yet are reasonable to sharpen. My 425 and 420 303s and 309s get by for most of my EDC work. My hunters are 440C. In the Buck world 110s get most of the fancy steel issues. Good Luck on your folder choice. I put a vote for the first knife in post # 8.......
300Bucks

 

[2Dead]

Can you tell me what the blade height and length are on this one? Also, does GEC's 1095 and 440C usually come razor sharp from the factory?

Blade length for the #73s are the same at 3 1/8". The height is 5/8" just in front of the kick. They made improvements in their sharpening this year especially but its easy enough to sharpen yourself as well.