Hinderer forum gone?

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Esav Benyamin said:
Another part of the problem is that Spark tries to select moderators who can deal with the different problems we see here.

When a knifemaker or manufacturer selects a moderator, he is probably taking someone off the workbench or office who may not have experience in management or customer service. If they don't spend much moderating, they may never learn how. They just get frustrated.
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Absolutely. That's why I'm a proponent of making sure proposed moderators learn how to swim before they get dropped into the deep end of our pool. Nobody likes to see a subforum fail because people without the skills to moderate it properly get selected for that task. I hardly need to tell you that moderating a high-testosterone forum is not for the faint of heart.
 
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Agreed, but you don't have to be a mind reader to make an educated guess shortly after a thread asking tough questions. Given their track record of how they dealt with anything but sheer praise especially. I agree with esav completely.
Insipid Moniker said:
Maybe. They're in a much better place to determine the efficacy of any advertising they do than either of us. I don't try to read minds, so I don't pretend to have any idea why they shut it down, but the best business practices are often counter to what many of us would like to see done.
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shinyedges said:
While some people are like that, the dude who asked the tough questions in the hinderer forum contributes in testing and reviews. And I see nothing wrong with looking for clarity, when in gkd a debate is being had on the amount of work a company does in house to their own blades. Sometimes asking for information comes off as just "generating heat" but perhaps they are valid questions.

I agree on the people who don't contribute in ANY way other than pot stirring. But I don't think that was the case here.
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bld522 said:
True that, RD. But if folks set up subforums here and expect that they're not going to have to deal with the good, the bad and the ugly, they're kidding themselves. If they want to be successful, they need to have their intention in the right place at the outset. And what's the right intention? To paraphrase JFK, I'd say they shouldn't come here asking what our community can do for them. They should come here asking what they can do for our community. So is there an example of someone who possesses the right intention around here? I can't think of a better example than Sal Glesser.

I think folks who want to set up subforums here should have to lurk for 30 days and get a feel for this place before we set them up. At least that way they'd have an idea of what they're in for.
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But who benefits from the rampant speculation, heresay and whatnot (like whats going on here in this thread) against manufacturers who've chosen to do business here? Noone really....All it serves is to drive a wedge between manufacturers and customers and between the customers themselves. It certainly isn't conducive to good business for the manufacturer and also isn't good for this site, as the manufacturers and their participation are what help bring people to this site. It can be mutually beneficial for both sides, but only if both sides are treated equally and fairly and mutual respect is afforded each other.

When having to deal with these type issues from various trolling individuals of all types on top of running a business becomes such a burden that it interferes with manufacturers ability to conduct business in a positive manner.....then why pursue doing business here? It's no wonder why so many manufacturer forums are unmoderated and of those that do have moderators, participation is almost nil. Especially on a site that has such a problem taking criticism itself without issuing warnings, bannings and closing of threads about such criticisms. Many of these same people demand that manufacturers interact with them in a positive manner with integrity, but those rules go out the window when the roles are reversed and they are allowed to speak as they please, at will, manners and civility be damned. Meanwhile these same people go ballistic when they are called on their poor behavior.
 
I don't see speculation, hearsay and whatnot on the part of forum members as the core of the problem here, Karda. I see poor product management, communications failures, and overzealous moderation on the part of the manufacturer as being the key causes of why the Hinderer subforum is no longer with us.
 
I have been waiting for this thread to pop up as i was also wondering what happened. But to be honest, when i noticed it was closed i instantly "knew" why. Im not saying i know the facts, but with how it was always moderated and such i assumed immediatley thats what happened. Sad really i never thought it would shut down, just get harder to start certain topics.
 
bld522 said:
I don't see speculation, hearsay and whatnot on the part of forum members as the core of the problem here, Karda. I see poor product management, communications failures, and overzealous moderation on the part of the manufacturer as being the key causes of why the Hinderer subforum is no longer with us.
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Tell me why your heresay and opinion is more valid than the people who are directly related to the problem in question?
You don't know exactly why hinderer closed their forum. That is the only undisputable fact in this thread.
 
And you do know why Hinderer closed their subforum? If so, do tell. Otherwise your speculation that it was our speculation that made them close it is no better than mine.
 
I agree with this as well.

Karda you have your opinions and your entitled them. I disagree with them and quite Franky don't get where your coming from with all most all of your post.
bld522 said:
I don't see speculation, hearsay and whatnot on the part of forum members as the core of the problem here, Karda. I see poor product management, communications failures, and overzealous moderation on the part of the manufacturer as being the key causes of why the Hinderer subforum is no longer with us.
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bld522 said:
And you do know why Hinderer closed their subforum? If so, do tell. Otherwise your speculation that it was our speculation that made them close it is no better than mine.
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Even if I did know, it wouldn't be my place to say. If Hinderer or Spark themselves are mute on the subject, perhaps it's clear indication to some people that they should do the same?
 
Ahh. Welcome to a public forum. :) If a moderator feels that we shouldn't discuss this topic, they have the ability to close the thread.
 
Yea why does your opinion hold more weight than others? Just because you think a certain way, doesn't make it fact or true. Its an OPINION which is disagreed with by others.
 
shinyedges said:
I agree with this as well.

Karda you have your opinions and your entitled them. I disagree with them and quite Franky don't get where your coming from with all most all of your post.
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Of course you wouldn't. You have no skin in the game past your opinion. Your livelihood is not affected.
 
Perhaps people are free to discuss topics on a public forum as they please, without you discouraging them because you disagree. As long as discussion is within forum rules.
Karda said:
Even if I did know, it wouldn't be my place to say. If Hinderer or Spark themselves are mute on the subject, perhaps it's clear indication to some people that they should do the same?
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Karda said:
Of course you wouldn't. You have no skin in the game past your opinion. Your livelihood is not affected.
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Seriously? Hinderer's livelihood is affected by no longer having a subforum here? I rather doubt that. KAI's disappearance doesn't seem to have damaged them too badly. And Hinderer can always play the same game KAI did if they want to.
 
What skin do you have in the game? Livelihood?
Karda said:
Of course you wouldn't. You have no skin in the game past your opinion. Your livelihood is not affected.
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shinyedges said:
Perhaps people are free to discuss topics on a public forum as they please, without you discouraging them because you disagree. As long as discussion is within forum rules.
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And anyone, manufacturers included are welcome to their own opinions and to close their forums with no explanation as they see fit. Help or not from trolls notwithstanding......

Three sides to every story....
 
Not everyone who questions a manufacturer or disagrees with them is a troll. Just saying . . .
 
So you can't talk about it and we're just supposed to take you at your word. Does that sum it up?
 
Going back and forth with karda is a waste of time as usual. Your opinion isn't fact. You talk as if your opinion is better than ours, troll... You've heard that before haven't you karda. I'll leave it at that.
 
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