How do traditionals compare to a Sebenza?

[davek14]

This is a great video and shows a love of the knives he sells which is pretty awesome. It highlights an important difference between moderns and traditionals, but not the only difference.

I love slipjoints for their old timey craftsmanship, but that's not the only, or even primary reason. I like a smaller knife, I like the left handed friendliness, I like the blades better suited as slicers, I usually don't like thumb studs or even opening holes, I like the non-threatening appearance, yadda. Goodness, old world crafsmanship is in there and important but not the most important thing, especially for carry at work.

I am a machinist and like CNC manufactured assemblies as well. I would love to see slipjoints made with modern methods and widely available at convenience stores. We have kind of lost the utility knife gestalt in favor of a flashier one but ne-mind that.

Maybe it would be valid to say "tried and true design" or "tool for the job" as well as "old world craftmanship". That bicycle would be better for getting around in Tokyo than a Ferrari. A modern bicycle might do even better.

Thanks for the great video sir. I'm just over analyzing.

 

[leghog]

I like bicycles, but I think a better comparison might be your Ferrari against an old pickup truck.

Yeah, try hauling top soil or lumber or moving a piece of furniture with a Ferrari. Takes the truck to do real work.

And that's what knives are, real working tools for real work. Otherwise they are just fancy pocket litter/man jewelry. I've known too many who carry what they consider a "Ferrari" in their pocket and are loathe to use it for what it really is, a working tool. If that's the case, why even carry it?

 

[RedLynx]

I like the left handed friendliness,

True, I can still open my slipjoints with them in my left hand. I do wish I could sometimes get a knife with the nail nick on the opposite side (so that I could open it with the right hand while it sits in my left) just to feel a bit more secure. Even though I can still do it without, half the time I do find myself opening with the left hand and then switching to that hand.

 

[davek14]

True, I can still open my slipjoints with them in my left hand. I do wish I could sometimes get a knife with the nail nick on the opposite side (so that I could open it with the right hand while it sits in my left) just to feel a bit more secure. Even though I can still do it without, half the time I do find myself opening with the left hand and then switching to that hand.

I hold the knife tip up in my left hand and hit the nick nick with my right thumb. I guess I'm holding the knife with my fingertips first and grasping it as I open. It ends up ready to use in my left hand. I never thought about it till I joined this forum.

 

[bladeboss]

I can tow home my Ferrari with my 1989 Dodge truck.
They can both get along.

 

[Frotier76]

Well Derek here's the problem with your insight...

Some knife users have come to the conclusion of preference or different outlooks on modern vs. classic knives.I carry my modern knife at work and on travel and have for many years.Use around the homestead I use a slipjoint...that's what I grew up on.Some people just don't like to stray from the roots of a natural cutting tool.I like that knives have progressed but most of anyones cutting tasks can be accomplished with a non locking blade and some are realizing this.And the modern knife market has shamelessly conned people into dropping $400 on a modern knife in S35VN steel.Once the blade is spent it's titanium handle is trash and THAT's the big picture...it's disposable like any other knife.A slipjoint feels compact in your pocket yet the pocket clip is effective too.The modern knife originally became innovative but also catered to a lot of materialism too and created a lot of snobbery.Society has changed too-you have a better chance of teaching a kid about proper knife safety and responsibility with a slipjoint than a modern knife.Now the price tag of a GEC knife seems unjustifiable versus an original Schrade because it's only a little better fit and finish but the same could be said for the Sebenza too.A $400 Sebenza doesn't make sense...a $100 Spyderco Manix 2 does.

 

[okbohn]

Hey guys, I appreciate the different approaches to the topic. The reason I didn't do two bicycles is they were still too close in kind. Also, you could legitimately argue good vs bad or better and worse within that category. By going one level beyond the specific vehicle (bicycle) I went to vehicles in general. So we were forced to compare two vehicles.

Both vehicles do exactly what they were designed to do, but they are not directly comparable. That was kind of my point.

 

[okbohn]

Yeah, try hauling top soil or lumber or moving a piece of furniture with a Ferrari. Takes the truck to do real work.

And that's what knives are, real working tools for real work. Otherwise they are just fancy pocket litter/man jewelry. I've known too many who carry what they consider a "Ferrari" in their pocket and are loathe to use it for what it really is, a working tool. If that's the case, why even carry it?

That is a video in the works!

 

[Dean51]

I understand the bicycle vs Ferrari comparison but I think it's more functional vs non functional that fuels the debates. Or maybe it's just advertising hype vs reality.
The best analogy might be bicycles to bicycles, whether it's a old single speed or has a 10 speed Derailleur it's still a bicycle. As long as it works well as a bicycle it's a bicycle.

A knife is a knife it has two functions, cut and slice. If it will do those two jobs well it's a good knife.
I've got two knives that are considered modern. One a Benchmade bone collector 15055-1, kind of a modern Buck 501. The other a de-assisted Mini-Barrage 586. The Benchmade is as nice a small game knife as the Buck 501, it just has a modern twist. The Mini-Barrage 586 is just a slicing machine it doesn't matter if you're cutting carpet or paper.

Even though I carry a stockman, I can understand modern knives. What I don't understand are the grossly overbuilt knives be they folder or fixed, being sold now. They don't cut well and they can't slice well and are not good game knives. I suppose for the inevitable zombie apocalypse they would be more useful than slip joints for sticking zombie brains.

I was watching a few fellows on youtube battoning wood, all of it cut with a chain saw. All of it could have gone on the fire without being split. I'm thinking, I've got a $30 Estwing hatchet that would do a better job. It's like they were using a tool created for a job that didn't have to be done. Not to mention the guy who broke his knife using it as a pry bar and upset because the manufacturer wouldn't honor the warranty.

I believe that as these people realize that an overbuilt knife doesn't cut or slice worth a flip they will start looking for a more usable pattern and or style. They are also going to expect a different steels than the traditional steels. Slip joints and reasonably sized modern knives is what they will be looking for. I'm thinking some company will step in with modern machinery and techniques, produce volume, consistent quality, with newer steels and at a lower price. From a manufacturing viewpoint there is no reason why a slip joint can't be produced with modern methods at a lower price, with better quality and lower warranty costs.

 

[Dean51]

Thread needed more pictures.

 

[22-rimfire]

I like them both too. But when it comes down to everyday cutting I tend to lean traditional. That doesn't mean I don't buy modern knives or carry them. I actually carry one of each in most cases. So, I'm a fence straddler and I'm proud of it.

 

[chickenfried]

...never mind, again good video.

Well Derek here's the problem with your insight...

Some knife users have come to the conclusion of preference or different outlooks on modern vs. classic knives.I carry my modern knife at work and on travel and have for many years.Use around the homestead I use a slipjoint...that's what I grew up on.Some people just don't like to stray from the roots of a natural cutting tool.I like that knives have progressed but most of anyones cutting tasks can be accomplished with a non locking blade and some are realizing this.And the modern knife market has shamelessly conned people into dropping $400 on a modern knife in S35VN steel.Once the blade is spent it's titanium handle is trash and THAT's the big picture...it's disposable like any other knife.A slipjoint feels compact in your pocket yet the pocket clip is effective too.The modern knife originally became innovative but also catered to a lot of materialism too and created a lot of snobbery.Society has changed too-you have a better chance of teaching a kid about proper knife safety and responsibility with a slipjoint than a modern knife.Now the price tag of a GEC knife seems unjustifiable versus an original Schrade because it's only a little better fit and finish but the same could be said for the Sebenza too.A $400 Sebenza doesn't make sense...a $100 Spyderco Manix 2 does.

 

[okbohn]

I agree on function. I I think that is on the bottom of some peoples list. Kind of crazy.

I understand the bicycle vs Ferrari comparison but I think it's more functional vs non functional that fuels the debates. Or maybe it's just advertising hype vs reality.
The best analogy might be bicycles to bicycles, whether it's a old single speed or has a 10 speed Derailleur it's still a bicycle. As long as it works well as a bicycle it's a bicycle.

A knife is a knife it has two functions, cut and slice. If it will do those two jobs well it's a good knife.
I've got two knives that are considered modern. One a Benchmade bone collector 15055-1, kind of a modern Buck 501. The other a de-assisted Mini-Barrage 586. The Benchmade is as nice a small game knife as the Buck 501, it just has a modern twist. The Mini-Barrage 586 is just a slicing machine it doesn't matter if you're cutting carpet or paper.

Even though I carry a stockman, I can understand modern knives. What I don't understand are the grossly overbuilt knives be they folder or fixed, being sold now. They don't cut well and they can't slice well and are not good game knives. I suppose for the inevitable zombie apocalypse they would be more useful than slip joints for sticking zombie brains.

I was watching a few fellows on youtube battoning wood, all of it cut with a chain saw. All of it could have gone on the fire without being split. I'm thinking, I've got a $30 Estwing hatchet that would do a better job. It's like they were using a tool created for a job that didn't have to be done. Not to mention the guy who broke his knife using it as a pry bar and upset because the manufacturer wouldn't honor the warranty.

I believe that as these people realize that an overbuilt knife doesn't cut or slice worth a flip they will start looking for a more usable pattern and or style. They are also going to expect a different steels than the traditional steels. Slip joints and reasonably sized modern knives is what they will be looking for. I'm thinking some company will step in with modern machinery and techniques, produce volume, consistent quality, with newer steels and at a lower price. From a manufacturing viewpoint there is no reason why a slip joint can't be produced with modern methods at a lower price, with better quality and lower warranty costs.

 

[jackknife]

I guess some people care about how fast it opens. I just like having three different blades with three different type edges in one small pocket size package. But then, I've never been in a quick draw contest with my pocket knife.

 

[Krissig12]

Yeah, try hauling top soil or lumber or moving a piece of furniture with a Ferrari. Takes the truck to do real work.

And that's what knives are, real working tools for real work. Otherwise they are just fancy pocket litter/man jewelry. I've known too many who carry what they consider a "Ferrari" in their pocket and are loathe to use it for what it really is, a working tool. If that's the case, why even carry it?

So I guess only traditionals can do hard work?

 

[RedLynx]

I hold the knife tip up in my left hand and hit the nick nick with my right thumb. I guess I'm holding the knife with my fingertips first and grasping it as I open. It ends up ready to use in my left hand. I never thought about it till I joined this forum.

Very cool! I have to try this.

 

[@LeathermanGX]

There's nothing high speed low drag about a Sebenza. It has bells and whistles, more like a Prius.

 

[Krissig12]

There's nothing high speed low drag about a Sebenza. It has bells and whistles, more like a Prius.

I see no bells and whistles on my small seb. I see a couple pieces of Ti and a chunk of s35. Far less complicated than you multi-bladed, multi-part-handled traditionals

 

[davek14]

And although I'm sure not many here will get this, the video is great in that it reminds me of the fictional "war" between DC comics and Marvel comics fanbois who insist one is better than the other. As a true fan I like both... I don't have to choose.

And DC is for wimps.

 

[RedLynx]

And DC is for wimps.

They are certainly not doing as good a job as Marvel at creating a Cinematic Universe, at the moment, (A Flash TV show but they've already decided the movie Flash will be a different actor altogether, lol wut!) I must say. But I'm thoroughly impressed by Arrow.