How should Collector Knives sell GEC SFO's

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I’m not clear on how this went before...just a mad rush when early reserve was opened with a server crash?

I’m in favor of 1/person limits to give more folks a chance on these high demand models. Also limits flippers raking them in.

Any “doors open at xx o’clock” method would be crash prone, if that’s the issue. I like the lottery idea.
 
We have something like this for some of the very important bike races I've been in where the spots available sell out in 30 minutes. What some have implemented is a closed purchase session where prior customers (racers) get first dibs and then the scramble for remaining spots starts afterwards. Some of the international level ones pretty much require lottery unless you've placed in the top 10, or something like that.

This could perpetuate a system where only customers get SFO's so it may be better to split it up but I imagine there's also the strong possibility that there still isn't enough stock for even returning customers.
 
Of course dealers always think of existing customers first; thus I have always pondered a system based on a tiered approach of existing customers. Because, just to be blunt, there are those that only purchase high demand SFO's from us - that are going to sell out anyway. Then they go somewhere else for all their general production products. But I don't want to get into the game of deciding myself who should and should not be placed on the list - because that leads to all kinds of issues. But I do think an early release for, say the top 100 customers over the last 6 months, may be something we ponder going forward. It essentially is a further reward for those that let us be their source when possible. It will also help curb the flippers that are only buying high demand items.

I am also studying very hard this weekend on a "random draw" type opened at different times for different variations. Also, implementing a time-frame that would be plausible from the US to Europe to Australia.
 
Ultimately it’s your call Mike. But I appreciate that you’re soliciting input.

I can certainly appreciate your perspective on a system that encourages customer loyalty. I’ll just throw in the flip side...there’s the potential for that type of system to turn into a club where new folks can never get their foot in the door. Maybe your early release limited qty is a good solution that.
 
My opinion counts for approximately nothing as I’m a low value customer unless you’re a flipper on eBay where I have had to purchase the majority of my GEC’s after discovering them about a year and a half ago. I use all my knives and it’s a drag paying double retail to get good ones just to turn around and use them. I’ve been waiting to get one of the single blade match strike barlows off eBay (since it’s impossible to be quick enough to get one on the exchange) I saw these and am excited to hopefully get one. They are the perfect size (for my liking) as I found after paying 200+ for a used spear point micarta one. Anyway I hope you figure out a way to put them up that is good for everyone yourself in particular, and I hope I can land one. If not oh well they’ll be up on eBay as soon as they come out anyway. What I’m really not sure about though is why you and or GEC don’t raise the prices on the really popular ones to limit the value of resale’s and make some more money for yourselves. It would discourage flipping and still be less expensive than the secondary market.
 
Just dropping seems like the easiest for you , not good for me though. I'm usually too slow. Lottery seems good but there will be people who take advantage of this as well.
 
jsdistin said:
My opinion counts for approximately nothing as I’m a low value customer ....
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No such thing. A very large portion of any dealers business are infrequent buyers.

Txjohn said:
Just dropping seems like the easiest for you , not good for me though. I'm usually too slow. Lottery seems good but there will be people who take advantage of this as well.
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The first few minutes are fine, but after the word gets out and you have 300 people adding the same knife to their cart to checkout - if the system doesn't lose its mind the customers do when one gets the knife paid for before the other and it disappears from their cart. But many times the cart doesn't want to play favorites and sells one knife to both of them and then sends you an email letting you know you are about to get a butt chewing.
 
knifeswapper said:
No such thing. A very large portion of any dealers business are infrequent buyers.



The first few minutes are fine, but after the word gets out and you have 300 people adding the same knife to their cart to checkout - if the system doesn't lose its mind the customers do when one gets the knife paid for before the other and it disappears from their cart. But many times the cart doesn't want to play favorites and sells one knife to both of them and then sends you an email letting you know you are about to get a butt chewing.
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How difficult would a lottery be to do? Preorders can be unreliable when you don't know how many you're going to get, but once you get them do you really need to sell them instantly? Maybe do a lottery for 2-3 days. If the entrants don't exceed the number available then they can just be purchased normally, if you've got 600 buyers for 300 knives though you can do the lottery and give everyone a fair shake. Instead of having to be able to log on between 14:20 and 14:32 to get one.

Just a thought. I'm not a collector and love using your site as it is.
 
T.L.E. Sharp said:
How difficult would a lottery be to do? Preorders can be unreliable when you don't know how many you're going to get, but once you get them do you really need to sell them instantly? Maybe do a lottery for 2-3 days. If the entrants don't exceed the number available then they can just be purchased normally, if you've got 600 buyers for 300 knives though you can do the lottery and give everyone a fair shake. Instead of having to be able to log on between 14:20 and 14:32 to get one.

Just a thought. I'm not a collector and love using your site as it is.
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In theory, not so hard to do a lottery. In finding a system that will allow people to enter their information - guaranteeing nobody is entering several times - handling several hundred people simultaneously - and then producing a verifiable list to include winners and standby lists - is proving a bit difficult. Had GEC not published the schedule with the #77; I could have done it a bit more organized. But at that point I had to publish something or be on the phone / email constantly for the next 60 days. But those customers that are tech savvy and can consistently get on the list - I am sure they would not be too keen on a draw (and I don't blame them).
 
I think you should do what you think is right!
I won't complain what you choose because it's your website. Very thoughtful of you to ask for input.

I love your website and your sfo. I am really excited because I don't have a 77 yet and I really want one as a user. But I understand how quickly they sell out so no hard feelings.
I look forward to owning one of your knives.


Also what does the initials mean on the bolster?
 
NF=Northfield. If it means something different I’d be shocked but I’m sure someone else will chime in if it does.
Also TC=Tidioute Cutlery
 
Mike... you are a patient man to put up with this. I applaud you. I have been more worried about the run of 56s than the 77s, and that is why I have been "watching your page like a hawk " !!
 
Some form of lottery is fair, so long as all parties have an even shot. "Losers" might be given priority in a future draw. We all need to keep perspective here...these are very nice knives, not life-saving drugs or donated organs. I'll live, perhaps bitterly, if I miss out on the draw, but there will be many nice knives ahead. Thanks, Mike, for being so thoughtful about this process. It's always nice to see a seller who really cares about both his products and his people.
 
On the topic of Lottery/Preorders: easy to do, If you want to I can set something up in the near Future.
A google form where people have to give Name/adress/e-mail/bf-handle or whatever to ID them; and draws/interpretation can be done with a bit of Javascript and Google Sheets(basically Excel, but free etc.).
So if you're Interessed...? :D
 
You have to publish the java script here so we can all verify it doesn’t contain the letters s or v and the numbers 9 or 7 anywhere.
 
This is a tough situation for sure. While it is human nature for dealers of any item to think of their existing customer base first and provide them with perks as a thank you for their previous loyalty, it literally prevents someone else from becoming an existing customer if the entire stock is purchased by those who were given "first dibs". In my opinion, this will eventually limit the dealer's ability to acquire an increased customer base and force people to go elsewhere to spend their money. Think about it, what's the first thing you do if the item you are looking for is out of stock at Home Depot?..... You go to Lowe's to get it. If this happened repeatedly, you would just stop going to Home Depot altogether.

The other factor coming into play here is the fact that these are SFOs - the whole intention of these is for a dealer to have something unique that cannot be gotten anywhere else. People who are wanting to own one have no choice but to go to a specific place to get them which also contriutes to the "mad rush". Think of how busy (and nasty) it would be if there were only one grocery store in your town that had food, and they only had enough to feed 10% of the population. While I agree these SFOs do cause the flippers to come out of the woodwork, I am sure there are others who may only collect items that are unique so that may be why you only see them at SFO time, because they do not wish to collect production knives that are readily available to everyone.

At the end of the day, dealers order a SFO run from GEC, wait for the production and shipping process to complete, then they make those items for sale at a price they determine to be reasonable. They then sell like hot cakes to the point of server failure. Again, in my opinion, this is a good problem to have although it may be difficult to manage. I have done some business with CK in the past, am I one of the top 100 customers over the last 6 months?.....maybe, maybe not there is no way for me to know. I will continue to do business with them regardless if I am able to obtain one of these SFOs or not. Heck I was online within minutes of the latest run of TCs going on sale and I still wasn't fast enough to get one, but I still do business with CK because of the quality of service I have been provided on my other purchases and that won't change.

Good Luck to you Mr. Latham whichever way you decide to go with this one. I know your intent with the early reserve system was to take the stress out of buying knives but it appears that all of that stress has found its way to your door step. You could always do it like other dealers do and not have early reserves and just drop them on your website whenever you feel like it, but it would just be delaying the server issues that are experienced during the early reserve process until they went live on your site once word got out that they were there.
 
jsdistin said:
NF=Northfield. If it means something different I’d be shocked but I’m sure someone else will chime in if it does.
Also TC=Tidioute Cutlery
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Correct. Toms Choice was just a blade etch and tube art for Charlie's Tidioute Barlow. Last one was the Rams head, one before that was another Toms Choice.

In a way I can't describe knife lotteries takes the fun out of collecting... for me personally. Can't you rig a lottery by using the info from a bunch of people you know and have it shipped to their house and pay them back later? Hopefully there is some way to exclude new fake customers.
 
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