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Meant to ask a bit ago.. American Chestnut should be good enough to use without stabilizing, right? We've got an old semi dead one on the mountain I wouldn't mind having a chunk of either.
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- Thread starter crimsonfalcon07
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I think hoss meant an assembled upper, not lower. The upper is the only part that really requires specialized tools (barrel wrench among others). There are some tools that make putting the lower together easier, but they are not absolutely necessary.
Anderson Rifles is also a good source of parts in addition to Palmetto State. Anderson supposedly manufactures parts for quite a few other "brands." Kind of like there are only 3 or 4 (I think) companies that make automobile batteries in this country, but an aweful lot of brand stickers are put on them.
Nitrided is one of the treatments that is now in vogue. It can be applied more uniformly inside and out (so accuracy is easier to maintain) and is supposed to be incredibly hard. I've read that nitrided barrels will cause excessive wear on tooling, so most machine shops try to avoid working on barrels after the treatment has been applied.
There are a ton of YouTube videos that help you learn how to be a "gun plumber." Before I started, I also bought "The AR-15 Complete Assembly Guide" by Walt Kulek and Clint McKee (owner of Fulton Armory). My first build was an old-school 20" M16A3 (fixed buttstock) style AR, and this was the only book I could find that included the fixed stock as well as the carbine stock.
Another thing I'll add is that there are only two reasons to build your own rather than buy it outright. 1) pride of ownership and 2) if you're starting with an 80% lower to keep it "off the books". I suspect you're after #1 but if neither of those things concerns you than you can get a Colt 6920, which is considered to be the least expensive life-or-death AR15 on the market, for about $1000 by the time you get it shipped and take it home. You can get one without any furniture and customize it how you like for $800.
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Brownells has a series of free videos on how to build a AR.
http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/lid=11004/learn/
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Thanks for all the AR info guys, I went through all the responses and thought it would take to long to address everyone so I'll just spill it all out here.......
First of all what kind of AR am I after. I want something dependable, and accurate..... As simple as that. What caliber? I like the .223/5.56 and the 7.62X39MM.....
Why do I want to build my own (bighoss) well, both of your reasons, pride in work, off the books, and one big reason you overlooked. Because I can. 80% lowers are easy. You would be very suprised of what my small shop is capable of as far as machining. ;-) Im self employed now going on two years. I'll always make knives. But thats not the only,thing I'm gonna for the rest of my life. Might start a custom gun shop down the road.
Chrome lined barrels. Its my understanding that the chrome was added to the inside of barrels to achieve tighter tolerances. Make it slightly oversized and sneak up on the finished tolerance by adding the chrome. They are getting away from that technique simply because rifling techniques,have improved so much just in the last 20-years that that chrome is obsolete. The Nitride coatings are the go to thing, and as a person that has spent all of his adult life working in machining and fabrication. Believe me, Nitride is some wicked shit!
As far as cost (bighoss) ANYBODY, can take $800 to $1000. bucks and buy or build a good/decent AR. With my tools and capabilities. I just about bet anything I will have a finished gun thats just as capable as the high rollers guns for not much more that $400. Granted, I'm going to be spending a lot of time on my mill and lathe. But thats what there for.
First of all what kind of AR am I after. I want something dependable, and accurate..... As simple as that. What caliber? I like the .223/5.56 and the 7.62X39MM.....
Why do I want to build my own (bighoss) well, both of your reasons, pride in work, off the books, and one big reason you overlooked. Because I can. 80% lowers are easy. You would be very suprised of what my small shop is capable of as far as machining. ;-) Im self employed now going on two years. I'll always make knives. But thats not the only,thing I'm gonna for the rest of my life. Might start a custom gun shop down the road.
Chrome lined barrels. Its my understanding that the chrome was added to the inside of barrels to achieve tighter tolerances. Make it slightly oversized and sneak up on the finished tolerance by adding the chrome. They are getting away from that technique simply because rifling techniques,have improved so much just in the last 20-years that that chrome is obsolete. The Nitride coatings are the go to thing, and as a person that has spent all of his adult life working in machining and fabrication. Believe me, Nitride is some wicked shit!
As far as cost (bighoss) ANYBODY, can take $800 to $1000. bucks and buy or build a good/decent AR. With my tools and capabilities. I just about bet anything I will have a finished gun thats just as capable as the high rollers guns for not much more that $400. Granted, I'm going to be spending a lot of time on my mill and lathe. But thats what there for.
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I dunno if that's the only reason. If you want to build something truly premium with custom parts, you'd go the builder route also. Say, if you want a premium barrel, like Krieger, or Lothar Walther, or Criterion, or a tier down, such as Rainier Ultramatch. Then there's Ballistic Advantage or Aero Precision, or a variety of others. A Colt AR shouldn't cost you 1000 either. I've seen them go for 700 if you pay attention to deals, and you can build a decent battle rifle from parts for under 500 if you pay attention to sales, even with Magpul furniture. Not too shabby. 1000 could get you an upgraded trigger, barrel, BCG, selector, mag release, and buffer in a budget build right now. Or a standard build and at least a thousand rounds of ammo for it.
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.223 is going to be more accurate and slightly more dependable, but I wouldn't trade my 7.62 for a .223 any day. Just my favorite round ever.
No matter what caliber you go with, but especially 7.62x39, don't fully load the magazine to sharply lower your chances of jamming. If it's a 30 round mag, put about 28 rounds in, something like a 10 round you can usually fill, but I still prefer to put 8 or 9 in instead.
Either way you go, they're fun. Enjoy building it. :thumbup:
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Agree 100% a grand is steep. Not to mention, Ruger is selling there new AR 5.56- brand new in the box cor $600. and I hadn't seen a bad review on the gun yet.
See I can also and will make some things that most people wont or cant, I will machine the forearm, I will make my own grip and stock as well. I have a lower casting I got for $30. billet aluminium. I will buy a barrel but make everything I can here in house. Put my T.M.Hunt stink on it!
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Grow a 3 ft. beard, eat coffee grounds with a spoon instead of drinking coffee, go bowling (overhanded only) and go tell your old lady to bake you a pie with authority.......... That ought to make up for it.
For AR15's I say stick with 5.56. I'm sure you're more than capable of building an AK from a receiver flat which would also be considered an 80% receiver if you really want to shoot 7.62x39. The magwell of the AR15 and the extreme taper of the 'x39 cartridge usually work alright but you can't beat an AK mag for feeding AK ammo.
Oh goodness, if you start working on guns I'll have to start direct depositing my pay into your account.
I believe the chrome lining was mainly for corrosion resistance and durability and one of the major downsides is that it's difficult to control the thickness and accuracy can suffer. As I understand it, the army's M-110 (variant of an AR10) sniper rifle lacks a chrome lined bore and chamber for this reason
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Lol, I love to harass my wife. When I'm feeling like its time to give her shit, (Jokingly) I point to the kitchen and say " bake me a pie woman!" We get a laugh out of it. I figure if she thought I was serious, she'd beat my ass with a skillet.
I have a guy that can hook me up with a good upper. He wants a shop project of mine pretty bad that I have nothing but a little time in. Its, 5.56. My understanding is the 5.56-is a higher pressure round. Can fire a .223 round in it, but vise versa is not recommended is this correct. I hear the 5.56 is a hotter round.
Agree 100% a grand is steep. Not to mention, Ruger is selling there new AR 5.56- brand new in the box cor $600. and I hadn't seen a bad review on the gun yet.
See I can also and will make some things that most people wont or cant, I will machine the forearm, I will make my own grip and stock as well. I have a lower casting I got for $30. billet aluminium. I will buy a barrel but make everything I can here in house. Put my T.M.Hunt stink on it!
The Ruger gun uses a propietary gas piston system and if it ever needs work they won't sell you parts, it HAS to go back to them. (Not that you're considering buying one anyway) And have you ever seen a bad review of any gun? There's only one gun mag I know of that will print a negative review of a gun and they don't have any sponsors. Every other magazine I've ever read has been filled with fluff pieces to appease the companies that give them add money.
I've seen Colts for just under a grand but by the time you include shipping, dealer fees, and taxes it's about $1000. And I use Colt as a base line because they are about the least expensive brand I would trust my life to. I can get an AR15 for less but I wouldn't want to. I have a DPMS and it works fine with brass cased ammo but I sure as heck wouldn't grab it if I felt I needed to defend myself. I don't expect to ever need to get into a gunfight let alone one bad enough I need an AR but I figure I might as well spend a little extra and get one that I could do that with.
5.56 is slightly "hotter", yes. You can fire .223 in a 5.56 chamber but not vise-versa. It probably wouldn't explode but it will not be good for the gun.
5.56 has slightly thicker case walls which reduces the case capacity. So there is less space relative to the powder charge compared to a .223 round which equals higher chamber pressure.
And I totally spaced this out but it was probably in one of those links I put up earlier. There are three length's of gas tubes/handguards; rifle, mid-length, and carbine. For a 16" barrel the mid-length is ideal. The carbine system was made for the M4 which has a 14" barrel and the extra 2" of barrel length generates just a bit more pressure which can be good for reliability in the short term but bad for durability in the long term. And don't even bother with a piston system on an AR, the direct impingement works just fine.
5.56 has slightly thicker case walls which reduces the case capacity. So there is less space relative to the powder charge compared to a .223 round which equals higher chamber pressure.
And I totally spaced this out but it was probably in one of those links I put up earlier. There are three length's of gas tubes/handguards; rifle, mid-length, and carbine. For a 16" barrel the mid-length is ideal. The carbine system was made for the M4 which has a 14" barrel and the extra 2" of barrel length generates just a bit more pressure which can be good for reliability in the short term but bad for durability in the long term. And don't even bother with a piston system on an AR, the direct impingement works just fine.
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So, what kind of reputation does Del ton have as far as AR parts. I have one lined up for a even trade on a shop project that I have no money in, just some time. The upper is a full upper. Dust cover, forward assist, retractable sights, the whole nine yards chambered in 5.56. If I decided to do the trade, that would basically be free to me other than a few hours labor thats already been spent. Thoughts?
I have not read good things about Windham, at least not from guys who run their guns hard. I haven't heard of an AR yet that doesn't work just fine for having fun at the range though. Again it goes back to whether you want a range toy (nothing wrong with that) or a fighting rifle. My understanding though is that to get a Windham you're spending fighting rifle money for range toy quality.
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