I'll be Boycotting CRKT

Gollnick said:
Successful businesses don't (and never have) take pride in their product line; they take pride in their bottom line... after all that's what makes payroll.
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that's absurd. i give my business to many successful companies that not only take pride "in their bottom line", but also show pride and enthusiasm in their products. want an example? a company named Spyderco. talk to a fellow named Sal Glesser, he'll tell you all about it.

sheesh. or maybe you were being sarcastic? it doesn't seem like it.

abe m.
 
I agree that many companies take pride in what they produce. If a company doesn't take pride in their products then I am not interested in purchasing from them. That being stated, the bottom line is the most important thing for a company to consider.

There are so many CRKT models that I have not handled that I can't comment on the overall quality of their knives, but the ones I have handled (I have owned an M16-14 and it was OK) have for the most part not impressed me much. They are good for the money, but in my opinion don't offer great value. The fact that they are lowering the quality of the steel in some of their models doesn't affect me at all, since I wouldn't purchase one that didn't have the better steel.
 
M16 Plain Edges. Til they come back, or til they make a KFF or Hammond Cruiser in AUS8, I'll avoid CRKT, only because they have nothing I want
 
I have my Rollock. It's a neat little knife. Nothing else from CRKT really interests me. I wrote some thoughts on the Rollock versus the Rollock 2 on the other CRKT thread.
 
I thought CRKT would introduce higher grade steels. There was ATS 34 and AUS 118 in the past. CRKT has competition from the BM red line, Emerson hard wear line, etc. CRKT might make more $ in the short term but what will happen to them in the long run? Is there goal to become huge like united cutlery? Does CRKT want to be just high volume low quality so they can push huge quantities on home t.v. shopping networks?

I am going to search for the old higher grade steel CRKTs before everything before they become hard to find and all that is left is aus 4 & 420j2.



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http://nbox00.tripod.com
 
Nonbox, there are still plenty to choose from. Please go back and read Post #9 where I talked about the knives that will continue to use AUS8 steel.
 
Blades_Two said:
I think CRKT has better quality than the Benchmade imports. I agree with your dealer.
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I don't agree with this IF they downgrade their steel. BM red class is using AUS-8, N690(?) etc. I think the two are comparable now, but not if CRKT downgrades.
 
The majority of the CRKT professional knives are AUS 8 but:


M16-13ZM & M16-14ZSF are AUS 4


Crawford/Kasper Black 6783K & Ryan Model Seven Black 6813K are 420J2


First Strikes & Hissatsu are 440A



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http://nbox00.tripod.com
 
What Gollnick said!!!!


Those guys have continued to grow because they are smart.


What one person thinks isnt the entire knife retail market.


Thats what they are looking at. :)
 
Something else I forgot to mention in the first post...

Imagine that somebody takes loan of, say, a KFF that was made in 2004 or earlier, and therefore made of AUS 6. The said person likes it, and decides to purchase at a knife retailer what looks to be the same knife, yet this knife at the retailer was manufactured in 2005 has a blade of 420 J2 although it looks identical to the aforementioned KFF of AUS 6. See how downright deceitful that is? Perhaps I'm too much of an idealogue for the modern world, but I just cannot accept that sort of blatently mendacious practice.

BTW, Gollnick, Hewlett Packard and IBM are two companies that, once upon a time ago, took pride in their products and made quality their pricipal concern before skimming every last penny.
 
Mr. Talmadge, you spin a sweet story, but you could be totally wrong about CRKT.

How about this scenario, Spyderco and benchmade are struggling, their step into asian manufacturing is one of desperation. CRKT knows their customer base, which is sensitive to price point. They bring out new knives, but they keep their price points steady. However, some of their designs are great (e.g. M series) or unique (e.g. pesh kabaz), but they also sell due to their affordability and overall fit and finish. With the dollar's recent international exchange rate performance due to Bush's wars, CRKT probably had to adjust to maintain low prices, and thus you get a cheaper steel in their lower priced knives.
 
"you spin a sweet story" :(


of course its possible that both companies are simply trying to cut overhead, similarly to what cold steel did with 420, but i doubt that spyderco did anything out of desperation. calculated chance perhaps, but i doubt they are scrambling to keep the bussiness alive/out of bankruptsy. but i could be wrong.

"Imagine that somebody takes loan of, say, a KFF that was made in 2004 or earlier, and therefore made of AUS 6. The said person likes it, and decides to purchase at a knife retailer what looks to be the same knife, yet this knife at the retailer was manufactured in 2005 has a blade of 420 J2 although it looks identical to the aforementioned KFF of AUS 6. See how downright deceitful that is? Perhaps I'm too much of an idealogue for the modern world, but I just cannot accept that sort of blatently mendacious practice."

i only consider it deceiptful if i get taken into the deciept. wich wont happen. if i look a the knife and ask what type of steel it is (wich i do for all purchases) and they tell me its 420, i'll ask if they have any older models. when they say no, i'll go online to get one made of the preferable steel. i dont see it as deceiptful at all. most of the deceipt is going to come from people trying to pass off the change as a bettering of the product (dealers, store clerks, retailers etc), wich crkt isnt doing. they are saying that 420 is good for a different purpose then aus6 - that of stainlessness and ease of sharpening. wich is true. not that its a superior steel.
 
jokrswylde said:
I don't agree with this IF they downgrade their steel. BM red class is using AUS-8, N690(?) etc. I think the two are comparable now, but not if CRKT downgrades.
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it could still be higher quality if the fit and finish on the bm red class is bad enough :rolleyes: :D
 
brownshoe said:
Mr. Talmadge, you spin a sweet story, but you could be totally wrong about CRKT.
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I could be wrong about many things :)

How about this scenario, Spyderco and benchmade are struggling, their step into asian manufacturing is one of desperation. CRKT knows their customer base, which is sensitive to price point. They bring out new knives, but they keep their price points steady. However, some of their designs are great (e.g. M series) or unique (e.g. pesh kabaz), but they also sell due to their affordability and overall fit and finish. With the dollar's recent international exchange rate performance due to Bush's wars, CRKT probably had to adjust to maintain low prices, and thus you get a cheaper steel in their lower priced knives.
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I don't think there's any evidence that Spyderco or Benchmade are struggling. I do think that both companies have noticed the competitive threat that CRKT poses (sound reputation for bang-for-the-buck products, and a killer network of custom makers to collaborate with). They have to move down and meet CRKT head-on, no question. I still think that CRKT's obvious move to strengthen their bottom line is to leverage their good name and very large volume-based customer base into higher-margin products. Obviously CRKT disagrees -- in fact, I'm thinking that they must be thinking exactly what you outlined, that price point is everything.

It'll be interesting to watch what happens. Some of my thoughts here could be the result of wishful thinking -- I'd love to buy some of CRKT's knives with better materials and production values.

Joe
 
One more time............for the slow learners.


At the first SHOT SHOW I ever went to, CRKT was an unheard of little company........


LOOK at them now.


The guys who run it know what they are doing.




History is for the next generation to write, not a bunch of second guessers!!! :eek:
 
And for the obtuse reader, I'm not sure anyone has argued that CRKT hasn't achieved significant success, and positioned themselves well for even more success. Hey, the fact that the likes of Spyderco and Benchmade felt they had to respond is pretty much proof of that.

But, in case anyone hasn't been paying attention, sometimes strong companies with great business plans end up making the wrong strategic decision, and it's not clear to me that CRKT management has a magic amulet that will prevent that from happening to them. This is a pretty classic business case -- of course there will be second-guessing, that's what makes the discussion interesting.
 
SethMurdoc is right.
I don't think CRKT is being deceitful at all.
If you don't know the specs of something that you are about to buy then you're deceiving yourself.
I work with a young lady who recently bought a new car (Nissan Altima). I asked her was it the 4-cylinder or 6-cylinder model.
She did'nt know.
Did the dealership deceiver her or was she just another uninformed buyer?

SethMurdoc is wrong:
Judging from the red class Benchmades that I have handled, there's nothing wrong with the fit-and-finish at all.

Good luck,
Allen.
 
I like it when a company prints the blade steel on the blade. However, many companies don't do this. Some don't even reveal the steel that's used (e.g. soligen, Randall stainless, Cold steel CarbonV and Case Tru-sharp). Thus, I don't think it's fair to say CRKT is "lying" when they change steel types.

When it comes to "collector value", you're dreaming if you purchase CRKT for that reason.
 
Agree 100% with Tom Mayo. I'll also add that most knife buyers can not name 2 differant steels,much less know anything about them.

Hell CRKT would be a large step up for most of my co-workers.We got over 500 firefighters on my dept. and the number one knife right now seems to be a $9 tanto point switchblade.Guys LOVE it. I think I've seen 2/3 Benchmades maybe a dozen Spydreco's all zytel handle ones over the years...

Us knife nuts are a very small part of the knife market.

I have a freind who has a 100k motorhome,a Harley and goldwing,two new pickups, snowmoblies and a nice home. He makes his living selling JUNK at gun/outdoor shows. A big part of his junk are junk knives,they line up for his junk while "knife dealers" at the show have one or two tire kickers at their tables.
 
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