In HATE with VG10 and Elmax

[Bob6794]

Hi guys. Not scared per say but too much to respond to. Here is some clarification.
I am not new to knives. I sharpen freehand on stone and on sandpaper. I always convex the edge of my knives. I have many spydercos in vg10 , enduras, caly3, big caly sprint run, junior , and many others. I have always hated vg10 and am amazed when I see people raving about it. Is it just me that fined it dull and frustrating? it dulls so quickly. Yes it will keep some working edge but I have no love for it.

Elmax is the same to me. I swear that Elmax is vg10. .
I have a knife in about every steel. but these two are my worst. Now, Why keep buying something you dont like? because I like spydercos and SOME Kershaws too much to not buy them because of the steel.
When I see people saying "Oh they are wonderful steels", it drives me even more crazy

Sounds like you have a wire edge if they dull very quickly. Steels behave differently when you sharpen them, even the same steel if they have a different heat treat. Try to resharpen them with taking care to make sure you don't form a wire edge and see how it behaves, head over to the maintenance sub-forum and we'll help you on that if you like.

 

[pnsxyr]

B/U has done themselves a big disservice by promoting Elmax as "D2 on steroids", at least as far as the cutlery market is concerned. Chemically I can see why they'd say that, and it makes sense when comparing them as die steels*. But in knives, they perform very differently from one another in every aspect that's important to knife users.

* it's important to remember that neither steel was actually developed for hand-held knives, and the appropriate cutlery-specific HT for either one will vary quite a bit from the "industry standards" that are geared towards totally different uses.

I've heard that distinction drawn and it has always confused me given my D2 knives and ELMAX knives are just so...different. I see ELMAX and S35VN having many similarities in terms of how the steels perform for the end-user with a good heat treatment (just fantastic performance in all categories earning their right to be called "premium" steels) but I really cannot compare ELMAX and D2.

I knew D2 was never a specific cutlery steel, but I did not know that about ELMAX. Now that makes a little more sense why I have heard this comparison. I'm guessing the application of steels to knives varies from many other industrial usage in the sense that we generally are favoring wear resistance and heat treatments that yield steels closer to their upper levels of hardness?

 

[Lee48]

I've never had any experience with Elmax. I've owned VG10 knives forever, it seems. Al Mar, Fallkniven, Spyderco, etc., and all have been excellent at taking and holding an edge. I'm no expert on steels, just my experience.

And, as I've said before about comparing steels: Both of them slice apples well.

 

[anthony cheeseboro]

VG-10 is very easy to sharpen and maintain. It is very stain resistant too. In the case of Elmax, I think the thick edges of the ZT knives that came with it hurt the steels image. My 0770 has a thinner blade and it cuts like crazy.

 

[pnsxyr]

VG-10 is very easy to sharpen and maintain. It is very stain resistant too. In the case of Elmax, I think the thick edges of the ZT knives that came with it hurt the steels image. My 0770 has a thinner blade and it cuts like crazy.

I think it goes beyond just that. I think "tactical" knives in general can hurt an image of almost any material if the knife is not well-matched to the usage. Many of the tactical folders have thicker blades and thicker angles, which is useful for some sorts of usage in which toughness is a desired trait, but generally performs poorly when used as a light pocket knife. For light tasks such as slicing fruit thinly which is easily bruised/damaged, a super thick blade and angle isn't really ideal IMO. I often test my knives progressively as I sharpen using tomatoes, and over time I have come to prefer thinner blades on lower angles, despite any trade off in toughness that may occur (over time I have really come to like the flat grinds).

And I agree that the 0770 is a very good slicer, and it does really well with prepping delicate foods.

 

[TC4Taay]

Got a ZT 0566 before work yesterday, then used it at work yesterday and today during seasonal transitions. Lots of breaking down cardboard shippers-- primarily 5"-6" slices over the last couple days, about 20 such cuts per shipper. Broke down. 4 shippers. It's still cutting effortlessly.

I'm only 2 days in, but I'm loving Elmax so far.

I have a ZT 0561 I carry in my edc rotation at work and use it in the same way as you. I have it sharpened at 20 degrees per side with a 25 degree micro bevel and it holds an edge great. I break down a good 15-20 boxes per day and I have no issues using it all week. Sure, it won't shave hair after a couple boxes but if I want to shave I'll use a razor, not a knife.

 

[RBid]

I have a ZT 0561 I carry in my edc rotation at work and use it in the same way as you. I have it sharpened at 20 degrees per side with a 25 degree micro bevel and it holds an edge great. I break down a good 15-20 boxes per day and I have no issues using it all week. Sure, it won't shave hair after a couple boxes but if I want to shave I'll use a razor, not a knife.

Based on what I'm seeing so far, that is about what I have been expecting. This thing is still flying through corrugates. I had to do two five foot cuts against the grain to break down a shipper base *after* making a bunch of small cuts, and the 0566 blew through it and still looks like it has a virgin edge.

Just did some paper cuts after typing the first paragraph. It's cutting very cleanly.

 

[cpio]

I have dropped my ZT 0561 in ELMAX from above chest height onto concrete. Fortunately it impacted on the spine, but I was only able to put some micro chips into the spine. I think that says plenty for this steel. It also stays hair popping sharp with a few passes over a Knives Plus strop block loaded with green compound and it cuts a LOT of cardboard, zip ties and clamshell packaging.