Infi and their non-existant competition

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Just keeping it simple: I've had a bunch of custom/production fixed blades and folders over the years. So far, Busse knives hold the best edge out of all the knives I've ever used (not by too wide a margin though) but the knives that come close to edge holding abilities are also hard as hell to sharpen while INFI is easy (those knives whose edge holding is close in performance to INFI are also prone to chipping and or rust very quickly from what I've seen). INFI doesn't chip and is easy to straighten when dented/dinged and pits better against oxidation/rust than any other non stainless blades I have. The construction is incredibly tough, the materials are top notch as is the finish and the Busse team are a pleasure to deal with: whether it be questions about your knife and something you want to do, warranty (extremely impressive) or ordering some more knives :p. I'm hooked for life not because of tests, hearsay, or advertising but because of my first hand experience. I've always been a sceptic of EVERYTHING but I've found all the great things I've heard/seen with Busse co. and INFI to be true.
 
I read it in a post at knifeforums.com. The author was Peter Hjortberger, the founder and owner of Fällkniven, who goes by the name of VG10 there. I'll email him and ask for more details.

Here's the thread: http://www.knifeforums.com/forums/s...04/post/1163396/hl/infi/fromsearch/1/#1163396



Edit: There... i've emailed Fällkniven. I'll let you know if i get any more info.

Peter, you have stated this in the past and we have told you that this other guy is full of shizle. Tell that Peter guy to come onto this forum and make his statements here.
 
Someone please send me a SH-1 SE so that I can settle this once and for all.
 
Fallkniven has NEVER used INFI in ANY of their blades!. . . Please direct me to this mysterious testing. . . This is an unfounded rumor. . . PERIOD!

As for our rivals that compare, we have yet to see any "LIVE" testing done by any other manufacturer, like Busse Combat has done at numerous shows.

Let's drink!

Jerry

So it is written! So let it be done!

Now where is my MacAllan?:)
 
I think you're getting into the realm of pretty specialized tools once you're outside the INFI spectrum, and that's a consideration in terms of practicality. For example, what good is a super refined edge if it rots off the blade before you can use it?

Accumulating Busses over the years, it's always struck me as unfortunate that Jerry doesn't venture further into more acute grind geometries. I think INFI would work very well for small, fine utility slicers... just as well as it does at the BM scale.

For the task specific purpose of extreme abuse (being able to be completely chip resistant and able to take heavy lateral stress and shock stresses, while maintaing as many good steel attributes as possible), infi is by far the best all around steel there is.

If you want higher wear resistance, you may have to give up lateral strength at the same cross section or corrosion resistance

If you want higher corrosion resistence, you may have to give up chip resistance and/or lateral strength at the same cross section, impact resistance or any number of other attributes

If you want higher chip resistance, you may have to give up wear resistence, hardness, and lateral strength *specifically the amount of pounds of force required to bend or break the blade at the same cross section)

If you want higher lateral strength resistance... well.... I'm not sure about that one. I've heard/ read very little in regards to the technical specs regarding how much psi is required to bend or break infi at any given cross section, or seen any data to wich I could compare it to in the first place... Infi will bend and take a set before it breaks, and it will break at a pretty heavy bend - but it takes a LOT of force to get it to that point in the first place. you may be able to spring temper or differencially harden an edge to the point where it literally has to be torn or cut in half to break (otherwise it will bend like putty), but it will also take much less force to bend it then it would to bend infi at 59rc.


But, there are certain instances where you would want those attributes. If all you do all day long is gut fish, you dont necessarily need the high stiffness or lateral strength. if all you do is use your knife in acid baths all day you may not be able to afford any corrosion at all. If all you do is cut fruit all day, you may not need the extra thickness, and may want a lot of corrosion resistence.

If you only want one or two attributes, there are other steels that can get them for you (s7, m2, titanium), you just cant want to many attributes at once, or else infi will start creeping in as the better overall steel. If you want everything, its by far the best overall acheiver.


lol, and I base this on 0 actual education or real experience, just what I've read and the very, very limited scope of work I've done with various knife steels.
 
Peter, you have stated this in the past and we have told you that this other guy is full of shizle. Tell that Peter guy to come onto this forum and make his statements here.

No, i haven't. A guy called Unsub has though, and i questioned his statement.

Here's the thread: http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=467020&highlight=infi+fallkniven

Since then i have found the post he is referring to, and having dealt with Peter H and knowing he is a good and honest guy i have no reason to doubt him. In fact, i have more reasons to trust him than Jerry, just as you probably have more reasons to trust Jerry than Peter. Please don't speak ill of anyone before all the facts are on the table. There might just be a misunderstanding.

By the way. Nothing has been said about the overall characteristics of INFI, just that Peter preferred the respons of VG10 on lateral bending over that of INFI. I have several VG10 Fällkniven and several Busses. The Busses have better edge retention and are easier to sharpen to a decent edge, but Fällkniven's generally have better fit and finish and i find them more comfortable to work with. I don't think VG10 is a match to INFI for hard use. 3G (VG2 / SGPS / VG2) is another matter. I've found it to have better edge retention than INFI but it's a real pain to sharpen. Can't say much about chipping resistance since i've never seen a chip in either. I've dropped a F1 3G test series from chest height on to a stone floor and it landed on the edge. The edge took a microscopic dent but didn't chip. I've never abused or accidentally dropped an INFI blade.. all i've ever seen is normal dulling and very tiny dents from normal cutting, batoning and chopping.
 
Being as nimble and dexterous as I am I dropped my Busse Heavy Duty from chest high, tip first, into my cement garage floor. (doh!) The very tip rolled just a bit but was easily smoothed out.
 
PUT THE CONVERSATION IN THE BASKET!!! IT DOES WHAT IT'S TOLD!!!

PUT THE FREAKIN' DISCUSSION IN THE BASKET!!!

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Seriously guys... let's just drink. Besides, I happen to know that Coors uses a better can than Budweiser
 
Peter,

Jerry researched, designed, tested... in short, Jerry Busse invented INFI. Thus, he has exclusive rights and exclusive access to INFI. The steel is custom made for Busse and only for Busse. Nobody has access to INFI except through Jerry; that is how he can say wth confidence that Fällkniven never used INFI, not even for testing with their own knives.

Just as I can say with certainty that you do not have access to my slides and my scans and picture files, and I can say with certainty that you have never made a full sized print of any of my pictures, similarly, Jerry can say with certainty that this Fällkniven claim is false.
 
Peter,

Jerry researched, designed, tested... in short, Jerry Busse invented INFI. Thus, he has exclusive rights and exclusive access to INFI. The steel is custom made for Busse and only for Busse. Nobody has access to INFI except through Jerry; that is how he can say wth confidence that Fällkniven never used INFI, not even for testing with their own knives.

Just as I can say with certainty that you do not have access to my slides and my scans and picture files, and I can say with certainty that you have never made a full sized print of any of my pictures, similarly, Jerry can say with certainty that this Fällkniven claim is false.

I've also read this... as part of the marketing of Busse Combat (www.bussecombat.com, www.bussecompanystore.com), and as stated by Busse fans on internet forums (www.bladeforums.com, www.knifeforums.com). I don't doubt that the heat treatment is exclusive to Busse, but i doubt the steel is. I've never seen any proof that the raw steel is exclusive to Busse.
 
I've also read this... as part of the marketing of Busse Combat (www.bussecombat.com, www.bussecompanystore.com), and as stated by Busse fans on internet forums (www.bladeforums.com, www.knifeforums.com). I don't doubt that the heat treatment is exclusive to Busse, but i doubt the steel is. I've never seen any proof that the raw steel is exclusive to Busse.

Busse uses the same stuff out the ground that the other companies use.....just in a different configuration with other elements :p Let's say there's another company out there that has a steel very similar to INFI. What then? It obviously hasn't proven to be competition. Just as everyone has acknowledged: A Busse is a Busse because of the heat/cryo treat. Even the old A2 Busse's were badass. If Busse were to discontinue INFI for some reason or other and reverted to using A2 I'd still buy/use them. Jerry eeks out every ounce of performance out of whatever steel he works with. Infi wouldn't be INFI without the treatment the steel goes through.
 
I've also read this... as part of the marketing of Busse Combat (www.bussecombat.com, www.bussecompanystore.com), and as stated by Busse fans on internet forums (www.bladeforums.com, www.knifeforums.com). I don't doubt that the heat treatment is exclusive to Busse, but i doubt the steel is. I've never seen any proof that the raw steel is exclusive to Busse.

as far as I understand busse has infi custom made at a local smelting facility. "infi" as a name is trademarked to busse, and there may be a patent for the steel formula.

Just trying to think of search terms that wouldn't blank out the bladeforums search engine to drag up the threads housing the bits of information to prove my statements however is already giving me a headache... I know there out there, as there was a thread that started with "infi is identical to -such and such- wood chipper blade steel" and was slowly whittled down to "the microconsituents and their general percentage places infi's forumal in the same family of steels as those used in wood chipper blades", but not exactly matching any of them.... I'll try tommorow when I get home from work...
 
Well as some of you will know from a previous thread...I have reprofiled and polished the edge on a LE FBM. To be honest, it was so easier to hand sharpen and it is about double the length of the previous longest knife I have ever sharpened. Does it take an edge...like you wouldn't believe! For some weird reason, I also enjoyed sharpening this knife more than any other knife I have every sharpened!
 
peter469, sounds like you should stick to fällkniven and leave amy and the infi to us. in the future, if you should change your mind, stop back by and have a drink with us.



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Peter, sorry for the confussion on who it was who posted the orignal thread.

The basic elemental analysis of INFI is similar but not exactly the same as a few other steels. I doubt that they copied INFI's chemical formula, they probably used A8 or Bohler K329 which has the same main elments but different microconstituents than INFI. These other elements along with the HT make INFI much different than the other steels mentioned. However, I surely doubt that Falkniven could best a knife of properly HT'd A8 and it would be easy enough to prove, as Johaning makes one out of A8 which would probably wipe the floor with 3 or 4 Falnkivens in every department except corrosion.

Oh and I do doubt that it was INFI as Jerry would have known that. Now if he were to state that he tested purchased Busse knives that is different and it may be true, but he definitely did not by INFI stock and use it.
 
Hey, you better not have used the knife on the top. She's fer lookin at only:thumbup:
 
Seriously guys... let's just drink. Besides, I happen to know that Coors uses a better can than Budweiser

Blasphemy!!!

Please recite three times:

"This is the famous Budweiser beer. We know of no brand produced by any other brewer which costs so much to brew and age. Our exclusive Beechwood Aging produces a taste, a smoothness and a drinkability you will find in no other beer at any price."

I'd apologize to Amy, but she only drinks bottled beer.

:D
 
Somewhere in this discussion I detect a touch of nationalistic pride... well founded perhaps as I have met nothing but cool Swedes and have heard nothing but good things about Fallkniven. A couple posts back you claimed not to be defending Fallkniven and it's founder, has that changed? In any case this thread was started by someone who just came back from the war being very pleased with the Satin Jack he took along and I would LOVE to hear more about the SJ's performance over there than get in a pissing contest about other great knives. It's really the thread starters opinion that matters most to me in this context.
 
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