INFI current vs Old

number41 said:
Self adhesive tape... gives you great traction. I have use all the different brands and this specific one made in South Africa is by far the best as its very thin but very durable.

I use it on every knife I own.
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So where can I get some? Does it leave a mess on the slabs?
 
In all of the above posts and replies no-one has posted a traumatic failure of a Busse.
Certainly in the course of hard use or abuse, chips, rolling and other small problems will occur but that is all taken care of with a restoration of the edge. Even if you loose a tip the knife continues to be perfectly serviceable and you are covered by the greatest warranty on the planet. Many other manufacturers simply cannot live up to that.

It is also worth noting that Jerry alters the heat treat depending on the blade he is producing. So for example comparing a BAD to a NMFBM is simply not fair. Horses for courses.
 
tinman44 said:
So where can I get some? Does it leave a mess on the slabs?
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No it doesn't leave any residue as it's self adhesive. No clue. It also looks really good on a knife.

You should be able to get at any hardware store. Not sure what the quality would be like in the states
 
POINTMANDDT said:
He did my flak Jack too. Really came out well.
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Those may LOOK like they were done well but I can virtually guarantee that the metal at the very apex of those knives is overheated and damaged which will yield very disappointing performance compared to an edge formed on undamaged steel.. Belt grinders are fast but grinding without lubrication and coolant has been shown to raise the temperature of the steel at the apex to thousands of degrees while the rest of the knife can be cold to the touch. This will destroy the heat treat at the apex and cause poor performance. For that same type of work on my Tormek wet-grinder I charge at least two times that because it is much slower grinder than a belt grinder but the results are well worth the extra effort.

On a side note, high polish may also look nice on edges but I believe they are best suited to very special niche where extreme push cutting sharpness is required like a wood cutting chisel which will never slice. This is not really something I'd desire in a combat knife because I assume the knives will do some manner of slicing work as well and a high polish on the apex will ultimately decimate both edge retention and cutting ability on a draw cut like a slice. Things get really confusing when you add the fact that my edge bevels look like a low grit 220 finish but the reality is that is only because they are ground to shape on the 220 and apex finished on a more suitable grit with a micro bevel, so you cannot even see the polish.
 
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Father & Son Traditional Sharpening said:
Those may LOOK like they were done well but I can virtually guarantee that the metal at the very apex of those knives is overheated and damaged which will yield very disappointing performance compared to an edge formed on undamaged steel.. Belt grinders are fast but grinding without lubrication and coolant has been shown to raise the temperature of the steel at the apex to thousands of degrees while the rest of the knife can be cold to the touch. This will destroy the heat treat at the apex and cause poor performance. For that same type of work on my Tormek wet-grinder I charge at least two times that because it is much slower grinder than a belt grinder but the results are well worth the extra effort.

On a side note, high polish may also look nice on edges but I believe they are best suited to very special niche where extreme push cutting sharpness is required like a wood cutting chisel which will never slice. This is not really something I'd desire in a combat knife because I assume the knives will do some manner of slicing work as well and a high polish on the apex will ultimately decimate both edge retention and cutting ability on a draw cut like a slice. Things get really confusing when you add the fact that my edge bevels look like a low grit 220 finish but the reality is that is only because they are ground to shape on the 220 and apex finished on a more suitable grit with a micro bevel, so you cannot even see the polish.
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How are these blades profiled from the shop after heat treatment? Aren’t they ground using a high speed belt sander? The gentlemen that did the work used water to cool the metal only on edges he was reprofiling such as an ax I gave him that had chips on it. As far as sharpening the blades, the edges weren’t on the belt sander long enough to get very hot, and cooled down, while he changed the each belt. But I did have a conversation with this gentlemen which is a master blade smith about heating up the edge and he made some very good points why it wouldn’t damage the edge. Lastly, I haven’t noticed any issues at all with my HR2 and I beat the hell out it, if fact the edge seems to be even stronger than before :/. The edges themselves have micro teeth, the bevel is polished. It’s a hybrid, best of both worlds, great for slicing and chopping ;)
 
Trying to veer the topic back to the OP’s post,

number41 said:
I have tested various steels .... so many steels and to be honest at 20 dps you get the same performance with many other brands.
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As far as Edge stability maybe, but you have to account for semi stainlessness, ease of sharpening and (My favorite) tensile strength.

number41 said:
I am a Busse fan, i like the designs and carry a Busse everyday but this bugs me. Not knowing what the steel was years ago and what it is now makes me wonder.

Are we allowed to speculate? Can we get a answer regarding this? I know a lot of people want to know this.
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I’m a bit confused, What question did you want answered? Both steel compositions, pre2002 and after, are public info easy to find.
The main difference is Nitrogen, Nickel, and Cobalt being removed. Modern INFI as shows has slightly higher carbon and the addition of Silicon.

As for which composition performs better, doing what?
 
Jack of All Blades said:
Trying to veer the topic back to the OP’s post,


As far as Edge stability maybe, but you have to account for semi stainlessness, ease of sharpening and (My favorite) tensile strength.



I’m a bit confused, What question did you want answered? Both steel compositions, pre2002 and after, are public info easy to find.
The main difference is Nitrogen, Nickel, and Cobalt being removed. Modern INFI as shows has slightly higher carbon and the addition of Silicon.

As for which composition performs better, doing what?
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Don't be confused... everything will be ok 🤣
 
POINTMANDDT said:
How are these blades profiled from the shop after heat treatment? Aren’t they ground using a high speed belt sander? The gentlemen that did the work used water to cool the metal only on edges he was reprofiling such as an ax I gave him that had chips on it. As far as sharpening the blades, the edges weren’t on the belt sander long enough to get very hot, and cooled down, while he changed the each belt. But I did have a conversation with this gentlemen which is a master blade smith about heating up the edge and he made some very good points why it wouldn’t damage the edge. Lastly, I haven’t noticed any issues at all with my HR2 and I beat the hell out it, if fact the edge seems to be even stronger than before :/. The edges themselves have micro teeth, the bevel is polished. It’s a hybrid, best of both worlds, great for slicing and chopping ;)
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Most knifemakers use powered grinders without coolant, that doesn't mean it's ideal. To be perfectly clear, the amount of steel we are talking about is very small that is damaged. Right at or just behind the apex, which doesn't necessarily mean their will be gross failure. It will show as poor edge retention also. There is an article by Roman Landes which documents this, he is a respected metallurgist. I don't have the link for it but you should be able to find it if you doubt the points being made. Being a knife maker doesn't necessarily mean you have a thorough understanding of the finer points of metallurgy, I like to thin we are all learning no matter how accomplished one becomes.
 
Father & Son Traditional Sharpening said:
Most knifemakers use powered grinders without coolant, that doesn't mean it's ideal. To be perfectly clear, the amount of steel we are talking about is very small that is damaged. Right at or just behind the apex, which doesn't necessarily mean their will be gross failure. It will show as poor edge retention also. There is an article by Roman Landes which documents this, he is a respected metallurgist. I don't have the link for it but you should be able to find it if you doubt the points being made. Being a knife maker doesn't necessarily mean you have a thorough understanding of the finer points of metallurgy, I like to thin we are all learning no matter how accomplished one becomes.
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I sharpened the HR2 trying to not get a burr and no stropping. The edge at 18.5dps showed much higher level of toughness chopping into camelthorn wood( similar to Australian hard wood) I use it to test the edge stability on all my choppers. I haven't had a knife without a micro bevel at 18.5dps pass this test. I remembered Cliff saying a while back never sharpen to a burr which makes sense. I found this challenging but it works. Forming a burr weakens the metal on the apex when removing it.
 
number41 said:
I sharpened the HR2 trying to not get a burr and no stropping. The edge at 18.5dps showed much higher level of toughness chopping into camelthorn wood( similar to Australian hard wood) I use it to test the edge stability on all my choppers. I haven't had a knife without a micro bevel at 18.5dps pass this test. I remembered Cliff saying a while back never sharpen to a burr which makes sense. I found this challenging but it works. Forming a burr weakens the metal on the apex when removing it.
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He would always use the analogy of bending a coat hanger that was made of metal until it breaks by flexing it back and forth. It's very obvious to see that the metal has been severely bent and damaged well beyond the point where it was fractured so the damage is never confined to this area. The best way to remove a burr is with something like a King 1000, Naniwa Lobster/SuperStone or other muddy stones which release abrasive as the loose abrasive plows into the burr as it tries to form and in this way you can remove enough damaged metal to get to undamaged steel. You can also cut the burr of using high angle passes on a hard stone with light force to directly grind away the burr but there is always the potential for damaged steel to show up here and not allow a good apex to form. The best way to form a clean undamaged apex is on a hard stone which doesn't release abrasive using a microbevel and only apply the apex using the finishing stone to avoid overgrinding.
 
On the wayback machine, the first recorded snapshot of the bussecombat.com catalogue is from 21 Feb 1999.

It lists five knives for sale. Check out the steel they're offered in.

Screen-Shot-2022-12-05-at-3-38-31-pm.png
 
Currawong said:
On the wayback machine, the first recorded snapshot of the bussecombat.com catalogue is from 21 Feb 1999.

It lists five knives for sale. Check out the steel they're offered in.

Screen-Shot-2022-12-05-at-3-38-31-pm.png
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Great find!

One of my favorite past-times around here is reminding people that there were never officially any 'Straight Handle' Busse monikers and that the original Battle Mistress was simply called 'Battle Mistress', lol.
 
Yet the ASHBM has Straight Handle in the name all those years later...
 
Old vs. New-
Always love this screenshot from the BCS. Another Wayback Machine grab, the date's up top, right side. (Oops, cropped it out... It's 03/08/05 🙂)

Screenshot_20221021-201358_Chrome-01.jpeg
 
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