Is a knife as important as we would like to think?

ah i feel great, 12 hours sleep. Had breaky and saw this post , thought i would comment before i head into the woods for a day trip.

To ME, a knife is important. Can I get along without it? YES


.........HOWEVER.......in a survival situ when I'm cold or injured or whatever, do i really want to SPEND VALUABLE TIME making do with other techniques, suck as finding or making sharp edge rocks to split wood or make shavings with? NO i want to spend as little time as possible getting that fire going or making a makeshift shelter. I do not want to spend time braiding roots for rope, or hacking kindling with makeshift tools. My motor control for example when i am cold is crap, if i have to spend valuable time to make tools I wont be able to use them after some point. The knife allows me to QUICKLY & EFFICIENTLY deal with tasks, before I completely lose use of my limbs and extremities.



thats my quick take on it. I would comment more but i really want to make the most of my one day off.

:cool:
 
In reality, I don't see the value of preparing to be without a knife since I should always have a knife. Carrying a small pocket knife as a spare makes the "lost knife" scenario almost impossible. I guess I could break one knife, drop the other just out of reach, and suddenly get pinned under a crashing UFO. If the UFO captain doesn't have a knife I can borrow, then I'm really in trouble.
 
I think everyone needs a knife. It doesn't have to be a big one, but they should have a knife. In a survival situation I think it could be the difference between life and death. It is a tool that can aid in the saving of your life. Could you survive without one? sure you could. But having one will make it easier to do so.

There are alot of survival type shows on tv. Man Vs Wild, Dual Survival and others. What is the one thing they always have? A knife.

Think about how many times a day or week you reach into the old pocket and get your knife out to do something. 200 years ago the Native Americans didn't have blades made of steel. The used other materials. But they still had some kind of knife with them.


mlrs
 
dougshoe said:
In reality, I don't see the value of preparing to be without a knife since I should always have a knife. Carrying a small pocket knife as a spare makes the "lost knife" scenario almost impossible. I guess I could break one knife, drop the other just out of reach, and suddenly get pinned under a crashing UFO. If the UFO captain doesn't have a knife I can borrow, then I'm really in trouble.
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Well you could extend that to say you don't need to learn how to start a fire if you always pack a sleeping bag. Or you don't need to learn how to build a shelter if you always have a tent. The skill of not needing anything to survive is what I want to achieve. Am I going camping without a blade, heck no. Blades are too much fun and I'm lazy.:D Knowing I don't have to rely on gear is freeing though. To me at least.
 
Shotgun said:
Well you could extend that to say you don't need to learn how to start a fire if you always pack a sleeping bag. Or you don't need to learn how to build a shelter if you always have a tent. The skill of not needing anything to survive is what I want to achieve. Am I going camping without a blade, heck no. Blades are too much fun and I'm lazy.:D Knowing I don't have to rely on gear is freeing though. To me at least.
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I totally agree :thumbup:

I had made a similar post in another forum last week about practicing with tools that you are not familiar with, and also practicing with no tools at all.

Survival situations can and usually do occur at the damnedist times and anything can happen. So having the skill to get by on your own is definately worth practicing IMO.

I have as of late started to get familiar with using my axe as a do all. After that I plan on giving the no edged tool thing a try. However, everytime I go out it will be so hard to walk by my knives and not take one.. :o
 
dougshoe said:
In reality, I don't see the value of preparing to be without a knife since I should always have a knife. Carrying a small pocket knife as a spare makes the "lost knife" scenario almost impossible.
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This is exactly what causes a survival situation. Yes you should always have a knife in the wilderness. A spare is a great idea. But what about the one occasion when you happen to forget it. Or it actually does get lost or broken. Or you wind up in a survival situation when you least expect it?

Take note of my last sentence, thats when a survival situation happens. Knowing how to prevent one, and knowing what to do when it happens is key. Simply relying on a knife to get you through it could be literally fatal.

Would you say "I dont need to know how to use a compass because I have my GPS"? This can be applied just as well to the geniouses that go out with a GPS and have no clue how to use a map and compass. Or better yet don't even take a map and compass.
 
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I wonder how many Survivorman type bush shelters are made each year in the USA using a knife for actual survival situations.
 
People die in the woods of New England every year. I don't know of one case where a person started out with basic survival equipment (reasonable for his hike), somehow lost it all, and then died for the lack of training (on how to survive with nothing). The whole thing is pure fantasy. It might be fun to watch Bear Grylls bumble around, but the show is all "let's pretend." Gee, I wonder what would happen if I suddenly found myself in a remote part of the Amazon jungle. All I have in my pockets is lint, a used wad of bubble gum, and a kazoo. How will I SURVIVE? My Dad and grandfathers would have laughed at the show. If it hasn't happened in four generations, then it's kinda safe to say that it's not gonna happen.
 
part of the dilemma here is a variance in perspective I suspect.. I don;t view the wood from the perception of a hiker, I view it from a the perspective of an amature buschrafter, or survivalist, or woodsman or whatever ele you want to call it..
If I was a hiker than no a knife is not essential..
When My buddy was hiking the AT (end to end) before he left I gifted him a sak pocket knife he said "what;s this for self defense?" I kid you not..
He is an experienced backpacker
he has a stove, a sleeping bag a bivy and all kinds of nifty gadgets
for me and i suspect for others here the perspective is different..
If I just went to the woods to walk around, than no I don;t need a knife
but the activities I participate in facillitate the need of edged tools.
just like the act of hiking requires certain equipment
Is there cross over? yes
but are survival folks hikers?
are hikers survival folks?
 
RescueRiley said:
When My buddy was hiking the AT (end to end) before he left I gifted him a sak pocket knife he said "what;s this for self defense?" I kid you not..
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That floors me. I've been backpacking for 27 years and Ive never gone on a multi day hike without one. Nor have I heard of anybody going on a multi day hike without one.
 
dougshoe said:
People die in the woods of New England every year. I don't know of one case where a person started out with basic survival equipment (reasonable for his hike), somehow lost it all, and then died for the lack of training (on how to survive with nothing). The whole thing is pure fantasy. It might be fun to watch Bear Grylls bumble around, but the show is all "let's pretend." Gee, I wonder what would happen if I suddenly found myself in a remote part of the Amazon jungle. All I have in my pockets is lint, a used wad of bubble gum, and a kazoo. How will I SURVIVE? My Dad and grandfathers would have laughed at the show. If it hasn't happened in four generations, then it's kinda safe to say that it's not gonna happen.
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I suppose that is your feelings on the subject. If they died in New England with gear, do you not think that having a modicum of skills to go with their gear wouldn't help?

There is a wide variety of folks on this board who get a great deal of enjoyment by learning primitive skills and various survival technique. I think many folks, myself included, do a lot of this stuff under the guise of survival training but in reality much of it is performing an activity with a little education value thrown in. I know how to do a few deadfall traps and I never intend to actually use them. However, learning how to do a deadfall trap was a value action in of itself, I did some carving, learned a few principles about triggers and enjoyed the action. Trying my hand at collecting dew with a rag one morning and the transpiration from a tree were other experiments that made me learn some things, in both cases, not being overly impressed with the quantity of water taken.

A lot of what I do in the form of survival training or bushcraft training is based on using my time in the wilderness to do what I think are productive things. Other folks thing that 100% of their wilderness time should be devoted to putting one foot in front of the other and making distance. They are just different perspectives. However, I think the guy who spends his entire life backpacking and not learning how to start a primitive fire or who to make a basic shelter with a knife is sort of missing out something. Maybe not a skill that will save his life, but they are missing out on an experience and activity that is not downright terrible to experience. This is actually kind of common, at least much more common than the survivalist who never gets outdoors....although those do exist too.
 
dougshoe said:
People die in the woods of New England every year. I don't know of one case where a person started out with basic survival equipment (reasonable for his hike), somehow lost it all, and then died for the lack of training (on how to survive with nothing). The whole thing is pure fantasy. It might be fun to watch Bear Grylls bumble around, but the show is all "let's pretend." Gee, I wonder what would happen if I suddenly found myself in a remote part of the Amazon jungle. All I have in my pockets is lint, a used wad of bubble gum, and a kazoo. How will I SURVIVE? My Dad and grandfathers would have laughed at the show. If it hasn't happened in four generations, then it's kinda safe to say that it's not gonna happen.
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If you don't know how to handle a survival situation you can have all the gear in the world and still be S.O.L. There's a lot more to surviving than just having a bunch of gear, thats probably the half of it. As for Bear Grylls, that show is a complete joke.
 
Woods Walker said:
I wonder how many Survivorman type bush shelters are made each year in the USA using a knife for actual survival situations.
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There are probably far more made for fun and practice. I can count two in my local woods made by kids. I love the fact that there are still kids who get out in the bush and make forts while their peers sit in front of a play station or X-box.

The more relevant question is how many people in an actual survival situation just die because they weren't prepared to deal with the situation they were in? The number is not insubstantial. I'm a bit surprised at all the replies seeming to imply that survival situations don't occur. Like how Japan wasn't just hit with a massive earthquake and how Katrina never
happened. Having skills in these situations will help you out as well as in the bush. Whether a knife is your most essential item is debatable. But you won't ever catch me wearing flip flops for a reason. Full foot covering shoes are part of my gear list.
 
What I want to know, is why are all of you guys that don't need any knives, on this forum? How many of you that don't need knives, have a drawer full of them? How many of you leave on a hike of any length, and refuse to take a knife with you, just to prove how macho you are?:jerkit:

EarlFH
 
EarlFH said:
What I want to know, is why are all of you guys that don't need any knives, on this forum? How many of you that don't need knives, have a drawer full of them? How many of you leave on a hike of any length, and refuse to take a knife with you, just to prove how macho you are?:jerkit:

EarlFH
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Has nothing to do with being macho. I've hiked and camped since I was a kid and was even on a SAR team for a year. The only time I've "needed" a knife was to cut up a duck breast to fit it in my mouth. Real survival I tell ya lol.:D The original question was more or less wether your life depended on a having a knife. I maintain it doesn't. I carry a hawk/hatchet and a pocket knife out of convenience pure and simple. The fixed blade I carry because I'm a blade nut and I just like it.:D
 
kgd said:
There are probably far more made for fun and practice. I can count two in my local woods made by kids. I love the fact that there are still kids who get out in the bush and make forts while their peers sit in front of a play station or X-box.

The more relevant question is how many people in an actual survival situation just die because they weren't prepared to deal with the situation they were in? The number is not insubstantial. I'm a bit surprised at all the replies seeming to imply that survival situations don't occur. Like how Japan wasn't just hit with a massive earthquake and how Katrina never
happened. Having skills in these situations will help you out as well as in the bush. Whether a knife is your most essential item is debatable. But you won't ever catch me wearing flip flops for a reason. Full foot covering shoes are part of my gear list.
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Believe it or not I just got back from a survival situation during my afternoon conditioning hike. Well that is a bit....no rather a total exaggeration however did get hung up in a hell of mountain laurels for 45 minutes looking for a short cut and avoided a few potential slips/trips/falls opportunities. I was thinking of you guys and took along the camera if anyone wants to see. I had my daypack gear even though been in the area before.
 
Joben said:
But when it comes to real world practicality, like lost hiker, or stranded motorist type scenarios do you need a knife?
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I just realized I should have read the first post a few times.

In answering the posts question, in real world practicality... NO. In most cases in my everyday life and (extremely unlikely) survival situations I wouldn't "NEED" a knife.

A typical practical day could turn into a completely unpractical day. I would bet everything I own there are a few people in Japan who wish they had a knife they didn't "NEED" right this very minute.

As a lost hiker, no not absolutely necessary. But sure would like to have one. For the simple size and weight I don't see why I wouldn't have one.

Stranded motorist... Don't see how I would "need" it. I would rather have an Onstar button than a knife.

But BE PREPARED. I carry a knife with me on a normal day to be prepared.
 
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http://www.forbes.com/2005/08/31/technology-tools-knife_cx_de_0831knife.html

My Dad was an old school hillbilly and at times an outlaw . He taught me the base of my survival skills, use what is avialable, keep a cool head, never give up, know the habits of local animals etc. The two thing he was never with out, A small 3 bladed boker slipjoint and a match safe full of strike any where matches. Dad could use a flint and steel, old school flint not the fire steels we carry today and often carried more. But he thought a knife and way to start a fire were the least you should carry. Once in the late sixties he was trying to avoid the law. he stopped at a dime store bought an extra box of matches the biggest oilcloth table cloth they had. A tin of fish hooks , splitshots and a cane pole rig (line bobber and hook rigged on a plastic winder) two cans of spam and a loaf of bread and disappeared into the woods for six weeks.
Is it possible to survive with out a knife? yes but is easier with it.
For the record My Dad could could start a fire in a rain that would drowned a frog usually with one match.
Roy
 
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