Is Benchmade worth it?

[DMG]

Actually, intelligent people are typically smart enough to know that they can't possibly know everything. I believe it's called the Dunning-Krueger effect. The less intelligent a person is, the more they value themselves in the workplace, because they're not smart enough to realize they don't know everything. I certainly wouldn't give anyone medical advice, because I'm a mechanical engineer! You do realize spacecraft engineering often involves using very high end metals, for high strength to weight ratio. Making knives is certainly different. But, when we design a spacecraft, we have to choose which manufacturers we trust to make simple 6061-T6 aluminum, because not all manufacturers heat treat then the same. It's the same type of research that one does in the knife research world. As an example, I recently stumbled upon an individual knife maker who heat treats CPM-3V blades differently, and they're much stronger and tougher (and probably harder to sharpen). He calls it Delta-3V. Even though I don't need one, I might buy one of his knives when he makes a new batch. Such a knife would actually be worth $500.

The Delta 3V is probably Carothers. It is almost stainless with the heat treat. I have 2 of their knives and use one pretty hard. The other I never fell in love with so it sits but anyway, they are worth the price.

I agree that you have to know something about metallurgy in your field but that doesn’t mean you know what a knife should cost.

 

[DDDYLN]

The Delta 3V is probably Carothers. It is almost stainless with the heat treat. I have 2 of their knives and use one pretty hard. The other I never fell in love with so it sits but anyway, they are worth the price.

I agree that you have to know something about metallurgy in your field but that doesn’t mean you know what a knife should cost.

Yes, it is Carothers. He doesn't currently have a batch for sale. I don't know everything about metallurgy and knives. I do know economics. It's not difficult to predict that a company with an increasingly poor QC track record, which sells knives which people can find elsewhere for 1/3 the cost, will eventually get sold or bought out, because only the due hard fans will continue to buy their knives.

 

[Quiet]

Oh Cold Steel fanboys, never change.

As someone who's owned dozens of knives from both companies, the actual fact of the matter is that both companies have things they do well, as well as things that could be improved. BOTH companies knives' are too expensive for what they are, if we're being honest, which really goes to show that worth is really relative. We all know Benchmade's egregious price increases have made them a lesser "value" proposition (if they ever really were), but they do have some things going for them. There are a few factors to consider:

Benchmade:
- US made: let's be clear, they are made here, which is something Cold Steel/GSM can't claim. If CS knives were made here, they would be more expensive, there's no doubt in my mind. And argue all you want, being US-made still matters to some of us.
- Fit & Finish: Cold Steel Knives tend to be more rudimentary in form and function than Benchmade knives are. That's not claiming that CS knives are trash, they just are not as polished as most Benchmades tend to be.
- The Axis lock: It's not as strong as the Triad lock, but it is FAR easier to manipulate in one hand, and for many, that's a huge selling point. Me, as I get older, I find myself preferring knives with locking mechanisms I can manipulate where my fingers aren't in the path the blade travels in order to close. For me personally, that ease of manipulation faaaaaarrrrr exceeds the durability of the Triad lock in importance. If you need that lock that badly, then you should be using a fixed blade. My CS knives are essentially two-handed closers to me, and I don't love that. The AD10 with an Axis lock would be a perfect knife to me (I wish the AD15 with its Scorpion lock weighed less, I'd carry it more).
- Benchmade has offered knives in pretty much all of the popular steels: M390, S90v, M4, CruWear, Magnacut, list goes on, it's great.

Cold Steel:
- Taiwan made: Cold Steel knives tend to cost less becaue of where they're made, which is great if you're wanting a decent knife on a what USED to be a budget. I have never had an issue with them being made in Taiwan, though others might. But honestly, Cold Steel knives used to be an excellent deal, back when you were able to get a knife in S35vn or XHP (man, I miss those days) for under a hundred dollars. These days, they are no longer the cheapest ways to get decent knives in those steels. Just is what it is.
- Fit & Finish: CS knives tend to look and feel pretty rudimentary, with minimal choices of scale materials, or blade steels. For most of their knives, you can have any color you want, as long as what you want is a black handle with a stonewash, or black coated blade. BMs offer that too, but they also offer their models in a wide variety of choices.
- The Triad Lock: An excellent lock, and an industry icon. It's not my favorite lock, for the reason I've explained above. I DO like the Scorpion lock, and their new lock that's essentially CS's version of the Demko Shark Lock (because like the Axis crossbar lock, you can manipulate those knives without adjusting your grip, or having to use two hands to close the knife safely). I have never in my life used or abused a knife so hard, the lock disengaged, and I don't see that ever changing. When I need strength like that, I carry a fixed blade, others' miles may vary.
- Cold Steel offers (well, has offered) a few tried and true great steels overtime. The aforementioned XHP. then they went to S35vn, but they've never had that depth of bench on their steel offerings that BM has had.

I still have several CS knives, and I tend to use 'em as camping folders, but there are a few BM knives in my EDC rotation, they're just better for what I need and prefer.

 

[DMG]

Yes, it is Carothers. He doesn't currently have a batch for sale. I don't know everything about metallurgy and knives. I do know economics. It's not difficult to predict that a company with an increasingly poor QC track record, which sells knives which people can find elsewhere for 1/3 the cost, will eventually get sold or bought out, because only the due hard fans will continue to buy their knives.

Literally everything has become more expensive in the past few years. Some of my costs have gone up by 200-300%.

Luxury items like higher end knives, watches, etc will go up too. Some people will pay them some won’t. Benchmade competitors like Spyderco and Hogue have gone up too. Product placement and endorsement deals with Meateater and others help BM, too. What’s a $300 knife to go on your $10k elk hunt with your $2500 rifle/glass?

I think Benchmade quality control was not great for the $ a few years back but has really improved since then. Benchmade will be fine.

 

[DDDYLN]

Benchmade can certainly turn things around if they want. Since I'm a firearm guy as well (or moreso), I often go to local sporting goods stores and tactical stores. Tactical stores sell gear, but not firearms. The biggest tactical store around here is 5.11. They pretty much exclusively sell Benchmade knives. I've seen many people look, only to not buy when they see the price. Regular people (meaning not knife people or brand fans), aren't as stupid as you think they are.

Oh Cold Steel fanboys, never change.

As someone who's owned dozens of knives from both companies, the actual fact of the matter is that both companies have things they do well, as well as things that could be improved. BOTH companies knives' are too expensive for what they are, if we're being honest, which really goes to show that worth is really relative. We all know Benchmade's egregious price increases have made them a lesser "value" proposition (if they ever really were), but they do have some things going for them. There are a few factors to consider:

Benchmade:
- US made: let's be clear, they are made here, which is something Cold Steel/GSM can't claim. If CS knives were made here, they would be more expensive, there's no doubt in my mind. And argue all you want, being US-made still matters to some of us.
- Fit & Finish: Cold Steel Knives tend to be more rudimentary in form and function than Benchmade knives are. That's not claiming that CS knives are trash, they just are not as polished as most Benchmades tend to be.
- The Axis lock: It's not as strong as the Triad lock, but it is FAR easier to manipulate in one hand, and for many, that's a huge selling point. Me, as I get older, I find myself preferring knives with locking mechanisms I can manipulate where my fingers aren't in the path the blade travels in order to close. For me personally, that ease of manipulation faaaaaarrrrr exceeds the durability of the Triad lock in importance. If you need that lock that badly, then you should be using a fixed blade. My CS knives are essentially two-handed closers to me, and I don't love that. The AD10 with an Axis lock would be a perfect knife to me (I wish the AD15 with its Scorpion lock weighed less, I'd carry it more).
- Benchmade has offered knives in pretty much all of the popular steels: M390, S90v, M4, CruWear, Magnacut, list goes on, it's great.

Cold Steel:
- Taiwan made: Cold Steel knives tend to cost less becaue of where they're made, which is great if you're wanting a decent knife on a what USED to be a budget. I have never had an issue with them being made in Taiwan, though others might. But honestly, Cold Steel knives used to be an excellent deal, back when you were able to get a knife in S35vn or XHP (man, I miss those days) for under a hundred dollars. These days, they are no longer the cheapest ways to get decent knives in those steels. Just is what it is.
- Fit & Finish: CS knives tend to look and feel pretty rudimentary, with minimal choices of scale materials, or blade steels. For most of their knives, you can have any color you want, as long as what you want is a black handle with a stonewash, or black coated blade. BMs offer that too, but they also offer their models in a wide variety of choices.
- The Triad Lock: An excellent lock, and an industry icon. It's not my favorite lock, for the reason I've explained above. I DO like the Scorpion lock, and their new lock that's essentially CS's version of the Demko Shark Lock (because like the Axis crossbar lock, you can manipulate those knives without adjusting your grip, or having to use two hands to close the knife safely). I have never in my life used or abused a knife so hard, the lock disengaged, and I don't see that ever changing. When I need strength like that, I carry a fixed blade, others' miles may vary.
- Cold Steel offers (well, has offered) a few tried and true great steels overtime. The aforementioned XHP. then they went to S35vn, but they've never had that depth of bench on their steel offerings that BM has had.

I still have several CS knives, and I tend to use 'em as camping folders, but there are a few BM knives in my EDC rotation, they're just better for what I need and prefer.

I'm actually more of an Ontario Knife Company fan. They just lack Cold Steel's massive collection, and now they got sold and closed the factory. Luckily, I bought many of their best knives a few years ago (although there are some I wish I had purchased). Ontario knives were priced very reasonably for being US made in a liberal state with very high taxes. Ultimately, I think that's what caused them to fail. Not sure who's driven through upstate NY, but it's not exactly a paradise due to ridiculous property taxes. Like Benchmade, Ontario's QC started getting bad in the past 2 years. The lack of profitability and bad QC, are what caused the factory to close. Benchmade should look at what happened to OKC, move out of that liberal hell hole, and setup shop in a state with favorable taxes. That would be the correct business decision. There are many people willing to pay more for US made, but it only goes so far.

 

[91bravo]

Actually, intelligent people are typically smart enough to know that they can't possibly know everything. I believe it's called the Dunning-Krueger effect. The less intelligent a person is, the more they value themselves in the workplace, because they're not smart enough to realize they don't know everything. I certainly wouldn't give anyone medical advice, because I'm a mechanical engineer! You do realize spacecraft engineering often involves using very high end metals, for high strength to weight ratio. Making knives is certainly different. But, when we design a spacecraft, we have to choose which manufacturers we trust to make simple 6061-T6 aluminum, because not all manufacturers heat treat then the same. It's the same type of research that one does in the knife research world. As an example, I recently stumbled upon an individual knife maker who heat treats CPM-3V blades differently, and they're much stronger and tougher (and probably harder to sharpen). He calls it Delta-3V. Even though I don't need one, I might buy one of his knives when he makes a new batch. Such a knife would actually be worth $500.

Delta 3V is some of the easiest steel to sharpen in my experience.

 

[DDDYLN]

That's good to know. I figured it would be difficult due to the toughness.

 

[mitchnola]

Actually, intelligent people are typically smart enough to know that they can't possibly know everything. I believe it's called the Dunning-Krueger effect. The less intelligent a person is, the more they value themselves in the workplace, because they're not smart enough to realize they don't know everything. I certainly wouldn't give anyone medical advice, because I'm a mechanical engineer! You do realize spacecraft engineering often involves using very high end metals, for high strength to weight ratio. Making knives is certainly different. But, when we design a spacecraft, we have to choose which manufacturers we trust to make simple 6061-T6 aluminum, because not all manufacturers heat treat then the same. It's the same type of research that one does in the knife research world. As an example, I recently stumbled upon an individual knife maker who heat treats CPM-3V blades differently, and they're much stronger and tougher (and probably harder to sharpen). He calls it Delta-3V. Even though I don't need one, I might buy one of his knives when he makes a new batch. Such a knife would actually be worth $500.

Your hilarious, ya killing me smalls

“Your smart enough to know you don’t know everything” classic!!

One thing you sure do know is worth huh!

Nothing better than a know it all with some credentials! Especially Stanford credentials

 

[DDDYLN]

Benchmade can certainly turn things around if they want. Since I'm a firearm guy as well (or moreso), I often go to local sporting goods stores and tactical stores. Tactical stores sell gear, but not firearms. The biggest tactical store around here is 5.11. They pretty much exclusively sell Benchmade knives. I've seen many people look, only to not buy when they see the price. Regular people (meaning not knife people or brand fans), aren't as stupid as you think they are.

I'm actually more of an Ontario Knife Company fan. They just lack Cold Steel's massive collection, and now they got sold and closed the factory. Luckily, I bought many of their best knives a few years ago (although there are some I wish I had purchased). Ontario knives were priced very reasonably for being US made in a liberal state with very high taxes. Ultimately, I think that's what caused them to fail. Not sure who's driven through upstate NY, but it's not exactly a paradise due to ridiculous property taxes. Like Benchmade, Ontario's QC started getting bad in the past 2 years. The lack of profitability and bad QC, are what caused the factory to close. Benchmade should look at what happened to OKC, move out of that liberal hell hole, and setup shop in a state with favorable taxes. That would be the correct business decision. There are many people willing to pay more for US made, but it only goes so far.

I don't disagree with your assessment of Cold Steel. They have certain products I like, and certain ones I don't. They definitely don't offer enough steel choices. I'm personally not a fan of their San Mai 3 steel, but many people like it. I actually bought a knife made out of it once, and it was razor sharp (sharpest knife I've ever received out of the box). For my intended use for the knife, San Mai 3 chips too easily, so I returned it. It's more of a marketing gimmick IMO. Why not just make the knife out of a higher quality stainless steel? They offer higher quality stainless steel on their folders, but not their fixed blades. It is annoying. I also wish Cold Steel would improve their handles, add jimping to knives that need it, and add finger guards that aren't just hard rubber. That said, I see so many high priced fixed blade brands, that completely lack finger guards. I like to have something to keep a sweaty hand from slipping onto the blade. I suppose it's because I buy knives more for survival and hunting, rather than bushcrafting. The bushcrafting community seems to like the lack of handguards. I imagine it's easier to maneuver the knife for carving.

 

[mitchnola]

Benchmade can certainly turn things around if they want. Since I'm a firearm guy as well (or moreso), I often go to local sporting goods stores and tactical stores. Tactical stores sell gear, but not firearms. The biggest tactical store around here is 5.11. They pretty much exclusively sell Benchmade knives. I've seen many people look, only to not buy when they see the price. Regular people (meaning not knife people or brand fans), aren't as stupid as you think they are.

I'm actually more of an Ontario Knife Company fan. They just lack Cold Steel's massive collection, and now they got sold and closed the factory. Luckily, I bought many of their best knives a few years ago (although there are some I wish I had purchased). Ontario knives were priced very reasonably for being US made in a liberal state with very high taxes. Ultimately, I think that's what caused them to fail. Not sure who's driven through upstate NY, but it's not exactly a paradise due to ridiculous property taxes. Like Benchmade, Ontario's QC started getting bad in the past 2 years. The lack of profitability and bad QC, are what caused the factory to close. Benchmade should look at what happened to OKC, move out of that liberal hell hole, and setup shop in a state with favorable taxes. That would be the correct business decision. There are many people willing to pay more for US made, but it only goes so far.

Have you ever been to bladeshow where you can touch and experience higer end knives you will never see at a “tactical store”. You may want to do that before coming on to bf espousing your expertise in worth!

 

[The Grendels]

I've currently got a dozen Benchmade knives (8 Folders and 4 Fixed) and I really like them. I'm also glad I bought them before this year, because where the pricing is now I'd probably only end up with a couple Benchmades in the long run. Part of the problem with the current pricing is that they've closed the gap with the next tier of knives to the point where it makes more sense to wait and buy those for just a little more. There's still a few I'd like to get, but they priced themselves into long-term instead of short-term acquisitions.

I’ve always liked benchmade, particularly the axis lock. Maybe I’ve been lucky but haven’t had any problems with mine at all. I particularly love griptillians. They’re excellent edcs and I actually like the ergonomics of the handle. The plastic doesn’t bother me at all and is very grippy.

Can’t argue that they’ve been and are slightly overpriced compared to spydeco but for the longest time they were the only place to get an axis lock. Maybe now that the patent is up they may have to become a little more competitive.

I must admit that over the years spyderco has surpassed them in my preference and collection.

Benchmade is experimenting more with steel lately than they used to (I jokingly speculated that they found an aircraft hanger full of CPM-S30V that they've been mining). I'm buying more Spyderco recently too, but for several reasons. The first is that Spyderco haven't jacked their prices up as fast and furiously as Benchmade when inflation hit. The other is that they offer a lot of variety of steel for a lot of different models. The third reason is that I put the brakes on buying a lot of Spyderco knives for the last few years, so I could have more knives from other brands, so now I find myself circling back to Spyderco.

Hamilton is a good watch every bit the equal of Omega (yes I can back up that opinion). They are owned by the same parent company, Swatch Group. Look at Tudor if you want some decent value in the Omega price range, the Pelagos is one of the best bang for buck luxury dive watches out there. Omega watches aren't bad, I have two that I was able to get good deals on. They just noticed that at a certain level a higher price can raise demand and went for it.

In knife terms it would be like Benchmade deciding they wanted in on that Chris Reeve/Hinderer/Spartan money and decided to increase prices to those levels hoping people would bite. It might work. They aren't bad knives, I'm just not impressed at what they offer for the money.

Like knives we're at a golden age of luxury watches. I'd love to have an Omega Speedmaster Moonwatch (I'd get the sapphire or sapphire sandwich crystal, instead of the hesalite, because I'm unlikely to be taking it to space anytime soon), but at least I have a Bulova Lunar Pilot watch. I don't have many watches, but I'll probably get a Hamilton Field watch at some point down the road.

 

[ShaiHulud]

Maybe benchmade will chime in and clear up all the back and forth with an explanation of theirs, if something needs explaining

 

[Chronovore]

Maybe benchmade will chime in and clear up all the back and forth with an explanation of theirs, if something needs explaining

Did they ever respond to the fiasco over their one-sided political donations?

 

[ShaiHulud]

Did they ever respond to the fiasco over their one-sided political donations?

Couldn't tell ya, I was joking mostly

 

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Did they ever respond to the fiasco over their one-sided political donations?

Easy tiger!

 

[DDDYLN]

Have you ever been to bladeshow where you can touch and experience higer end knives you will never see at a “tactical store”. You may want to do that before coming on to bf espousing your expertise in worth!

Why? I'm not a folding knife guy. I don't need to hold a fixed blade to know whether it's a good knife. I just measure my hand size, and read reviews. BTW, I have XXL hands in width. My palms measure almost 11" in circumference. That's probably part of the reason that small folding knives don't appeal to me. I literally have trouble holding them.

 

[Blues]

Knock off the personal insults and the back and forth sniping. Or get a room...somewhere off this site.

 

[DDDYLN]

Easy tiger!

Your hilarious, ya killing me smalls

“Your smart enough to know you don’t know everything” classic!!

One thing you sure do know is worth huh!

Nothing better than a know it all with some credentials! Especially Stanford credentials

You must be very popular around the office, and with the ladies! I hear everyone loves pompous people.

Did they ever respond to the fiasco over their one-sided political donations?

I believe it was a half ass response. I suspect if they want to remain in Oregon, they have to make those political donations. It's a poor business decision from my perspective.

 

[Blues]

It only takes a few knuckleheads to ruin it for the rest of the folks.

Closed.