Is Boker doing a disservice to it's customers?

[Kadmos]

Absolutely they are doing a disservice.

It's at the least confusing, and essentially deceptive.

But it also is doing themselves a disservice.

I, for one, just don't buy Boker knives.

Why should I have to keep an old catalog for years to prove where the knife was made? Or why should I have to do serious legwork to buy a used knife that says "Germany" but was really made in China?

It's total nonsense in my humble opinion.

Getting some materials from a different country is one thing, like South American wood, or bone. (like Case does).

But having the whole thing made elsewhere and then basically boxed in Germany and marked "German made" is ridiculous.

The sad thing is, unless they actually start stamping them "Made in USA" or "Made in Germany" or "Made in China" then I won't be buying one, they've already muddied the waters to much to simple put "USA" or "Germany" on them.

 

[Stich2442]

I find it interesting that folks will join a knife forum, spend time setting up a account, then time posting and reading threads about knives, but won't take the time to type "Boker" into a search engine spend maybe five minutes to know what you are purchasing. I do find it also interesting the resistance to purchase knives made in China, myself included, but all of us are using computers, smart phones, and tablets that are made overseas, but that's a whole other discussion.

As far as Boker's business practice, I revived a new old stock knife that was made with one carbon blade and three stainless blades, I contacted Boker via email, I was soon contacted and told:

"Hello Peter,
The knife you have came from the last run of 5452s ever made. They were made with mixed blade steels, and the tooling had started to wear out at this time. If you want to send it in, I can exchange it."

I was sent a knife that was twice the value of the one I sent, top notch customer service, hassle free, they made a wrong a right, and stand behind their product.

It's too bad a lot of you won't take the little time it takes to know what you are purchasing, you are missing out on a nice product, with a decent price point, but that's fine just leaves more for me.

Pete

 

[pmew]

I find it interesting that folks will join a knife forum, spend time setting up a account, then time posting and reading threads about knives, but won't take the time to type "Boker" into a search engine spend maybe five minutes to know what you are purchasing. I do find it also interesting the resistance to purchase knives made in China, myself included, but all of us are using computers, smart phones, and tablets that are made overseas, but that's a whole other discussion.

As far as Boker's business practice, I revived a new old stock knife that was made with one carbon blade and three stainless blades, I contacted Boker via email, I was soon contacted and told:

"Hello Peter,
The knife you have came from the last run of 5452s ever made. They were made with mixed blade steels, and the tooling had started to wear out at this time. If you want to send it in, I can exchange it."

I was sent a knife that was twice the value of the one I sent, top notch customer service, hassle free, they made a wrong a right, and stand behind their product.

It's too bad a lot of you won't take the little time it takes to know what you are purchasing, you are missing out on a nice product, with a decent price point, but that's fine just leaves more for me.

Pete

Here here. Although, not ALL for you Pete!



Stamped 'Solingen' - made in Germany, purchased nib from our very own exchange.

paul

 

[Stich2442]

Here here. Although, not ALL for you Pete!

View attachment 423566

Stamped 'Solingen' - made in Germany, purchased nib from our very own exchange.

paul

Nice Paul Boker really shines with the congress pattern:thumbup:

 

[leghog]

IF Boker chose to do so, Boker could make determining country of knife origin/parts origin as clear as day, and it would be simple matter for them to do so. Boker should just put country of origin in each knife's product listing. Click on a knife and there is no doubt about its origin.

On it's home page, Boker should mention it sells knives from several countries, but there isn't even a mention of non-German manufacture. In the contrary Boker leads Joe Average into believing their product range is from Germany. From Boker's homepage:

"Pocketknives, Hunting Knives, Kitchen Knives and Straight Razors from Solingen, Germany
The famous knives with the tree-brand are manufactured in the German blade-city since 1869. Since then, no knife left our production without this sign of quality. The history of Boker has been affected by eventful times, but two things remained: our passion and enthusiasm for extraordinary knives.

The international success of our product line, as well as the long tradition of our factory production gives us a reason to continue designing and producing high quality and innovative knives. Our knives have been manufactured and designed in Solingen since 1869, providing blades and handle materials of unmatched varieties."

Boker should just strive to be clear and not misunderstood. Nowhere on the homepage is it even hinted that Boker uses non-German manufacture. The uninitiated is led to believe Boker products are German, and yes, that is a disservice to customers/potential customers.

 

[jkulysses]

I find it interesting that folks will join a knife forum, spend time setting up a account, then time posting and reading threads about knives, but won't take the time to type "Boker" into a search engine spend maybe five minutes to know what you are purchasing. I do find it also interesting the resistance to purchase knives made in China, myself included, but all of us are using computers, smart phones, and tablets that are made overseas, but that's a whole other discussion.

As far as Boker's business practice, I revived a new old stock knife that was made with one carbon blade and three stainless blades, I contacted Boker via email, I was soon contacted and told:

"Hello Peter,
The knife you have came from the last run of 5452s ever made. They were made with mixed blade steels, and the tooling had started to wear out at this time. If you want to send it in, I can exchange it."

I was sent a knife that was twice the value of the one I sent, top notch customer service, hassle free, they made a wrong a right, and stand behind their product.

It's too bad a lot of you won't take the little time it takes to know what you are purchasing, you are missing out on a nice product, with a decent price point, but that's fine just leaves more for me.

Pete

I hear what your saying but it's not really a valid comparison and I don't like it when people use it to argue why it's dumb to refuse to buy knives, guns etc that are made in China. I have a choice to buy my knives, guns etc from U.S. manufactures or German etc but name one computer company that produces laptops in America. I have much more to argue on that topic but this isn't the place for it and I'm going to stop there. Yes you could search and find out which Boker is made where but I think the point of this whole thread is you shouldn't have to. Most manufactures have a line made in China or Taiwan these days and they clearly have China or Taiwan stamped right on the blade. Boker should be doing the same thing as anything else is deceptive.

With all that being said I carried my yellow bone Boker stockman I posted a picture of on the first page in this thread yesterday and have been carrying it at least 3 times a week for the last several weeks and I really do love that knife. Excellent fit and finish and with the rounded bolsters it fits perfectly in my coin pocket of my jeans. They really do make a great knife at a reasonable price and so far I have had better luck with their QC than that of modern Case stockmans.

 

[bonzodog]

I got this because I wanted a German made knife

 

[Stich2442]

IF Boker chose to do so, Boker could make determining country of knife origin/parts origin as clear as day, and it would be simple matter for them to do so. Boker should just put country of origin in each knife's product listing. Click on a knife and there is no doubt about its origin.

On it's home page, Boker should mention it sells knives from several countries, but there isn't even a mention of non-German manufacture. In the contrary Boker leads Joe Average into believing their product range is from Germany. From Boker's homepage:

"Pocketknives, Hunting Knives, Kitchen Knives and Straight Razors from Solingen, Germany
The famous knives with the tree-brand are manufactured in the German blade-city since 1869. Since then, no knife left our production without this sign of quality. The history of Boker has been affected by eventful times, but two things remained: our passion and enthusiasm for extraordinary knives.

The international success of our product line, as well as the long tradition of our factory production gives us a reason to continue designing and producing high quality and innovative knives. Our knives have been manufactured and designed in Solingen since 1869, providing blades and handle materials of unmatched varieties."

Boker should just strive to be clear and not misunderstood. Nowhere on the homepage is it even hinted that Boker uses non-German manufacture. The uninitiated is led to believe Boker products are German, and yes, that is a disservice to customers/potential customers.

I think they should be more transparent on the knife itself, but Boker does state where their knives are produced, I think the problem is with vendors, bigger box that sell every type of knife and the auction sites, either intentional trying to deceive and also unintentionally just using the stock info they have always used, not adapting to the currant market etc.

This is right from Bokers site

 

[leghog]

I think they should be more transparent on the knife itself, but Boker does state where their knives are produced, I think the problem is with vendors, bigger box that sell every type of knife and the auction sites, either intentional trying to deceive and also unintentionally just using the stock info they have always used, not adapting to the currant market etc.

This is right from Bokers site

And where does tree brand fit?

Point is Boker could be MUCH clearer, and it would be a simple thing for them to be so. I'm can't believe the company and their marketers are unaware of the confusion.

You can defend Boker's marketing strategy until the cows come home, but this very thread shows there is unneeded (by consumers anyway, but perhaps needed/wanted by Boker) confusion (and consider this thread is filled with knife enthusiasts). The bottom line remains unchanged --- that confusion, whether deliberately caused or not, IS a disservice to those whom Boker hopes to make customers.
I carried a Boker 8288SS pen for a decade. I have since passed on Bokers I was interested in simply because I wasn't confident in the true country of origin. That was Boker's loss, not mine.

Come on, when Boker produces a knife with a shield stamped Germany, and the knife doesn't originate there/isn't German, it's a reach to say such isn't a marketing gimmick and untruthful.

 

[leghog]

Tell me where this one originates. The average consumer would be hard pressed to tell me using only Boker's website unless the stumbled across the page (by clicking "About us" then clicking "FAQ") you aptured above and put the two together.


http://www.boker.de/us/pocket-knife/boker-plus/classic-pocket-knife/01BO020.html

 

[Stich2442]

Tell me where this one originates. The average consumer would be hard pressed to tell me using only Boker's website unless the stumbled across the page (by clicking "About us" then clicking "FAQ") you aptured above and put the two together.


http://www.boker.de/us/pocket-knife/boker-plus/classic-pocket-knife/01BO020.html

It's a Boker Plus = Taiwan or China, the average Joe doesn't really care, don't forget we are knife nuts, by the way, I'm playing Devils advocate, I think it should be more transparent, if you go back through my post you will see that, but the devil is in the detail the knife you posted has the Boker Plus line logo right on the blade.
By the way in the manufacturing forum there is a Boker forum, with Boker reps, do you guys think we should move this? Maybe a mod could ? It would be interesting what they have to say.

Pete

 

[PURPLEDC]

honestly its not just boker. I think ALL manufacturers should be required to disclose COA and if any part of that product is manufactured in a foreign country in relation to its headquarters location should have to disclose what percent of the product is imported and from what country. While Boker in recent years has really started to blur the lines of their product lines and where it is made I have to give them credit since the information while getting harder to come by is available. Many companies really dont want to discuss where their products are made period and wont label their knives at all.

 

[wolf-man-12]

It got so bad on telling what is what that I decided to solve the problem.!**
I had 27 Bokers and a guy in Tampa,Fl. wanted them all ~~ so I sold them to him and he is very happy and so am I ..!!!***
Will not buy any kind of Boker in the future == problem solved.^^
Now wasn't that easy.?? I know I feel better.** YEAHHHHHHHHH

 

[Hammer67]

Honestly, I didn't have to click the link, or take more than a cursory glance to know that the knife above was a Boker Plus, and thus Asian-made. But, as already pointed out, people like me are not the average consumer.

There are two very simple solutions if you truly believe that Boker is being 'deceptive,' and you don't want to do a few minutes of homework - 1) Don't buy a Boker, or 2) Buy from a reputable dealer. Either way, problem solved, quite easily.

But what I find a little odd is when someone buys a Boker (or any knife) from the "Big Box Store of Outsourced Junk," or from "Billy Bob's House of Knives and Stuff" with a website with a bunch of blurry photos and hardly any details provided, and then is shocked to find that their knife was made in Asia.

Maybe it isn't as straightforward as some people would like, but really, with a minimum of homework, I still believe that a Solingen-made Boker is a great value. Here's one (of several) that I have been very happy with, and that was half the price of the average GEC:

 

[Stich2442]

Honestly, I didn't have to click the link, or take more than a cursory glance to know that the knife above was a Boker Plus, and thus Asian-made. But, as already pointed out, people like me are not the average consumer.

There are two very simple solutions if you truly believe that Boker is being 'deceptive,' and you don't want to do a few minutes of homework - 1) Don't buy a Boker, or 2) Buy from a reputable dealer. Either way, problem solved, quite easily.

But what I find a little odd is when someone buys a Boker (or any knife) from the "Big Box Store of Outsourced Junk," or from "Billy Bob's House of Knives and Stuff" with a website with a bunch of blurry photos and hardly any details provided, and then is shocked to find that their knife was made in Asia.

Maybe it isn't as straightforward as some people would like, but really, with a minimum of homework, I still believe that a Solingen-made Boker is a great value. Here's one (of several) that I have been very happy with, and that was half the price of the average GEC, with great attention to detail for the price:

Exactly :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:

Pete

 

[leghog]

There are two very simple solutions if you truly believe that Boker is being 'deceptive,' and you don't want to do a few minutes of homework - 1) Don't buy a Boker,...

I no longer will (nor will I recommend them) and precisely because I do believe Boker's marketing to be deliberately confusing, spurious, and specious.

 

[Lee48]

Stich, the page from Boker's website you reference is misleading. The page indicates "Boker knives" are made in Solingen, Germany. But they are not all made there. That's deceptive. When Boker puts "Germany" on the shield of the knife made in China or in Taiwan or any place other than Germany, it's deceptive.

Most of us know by now how to figure this mess out but the majority of people who aren't really interested in knives but want to buy a Tree Brand knife like their grandpa used can easily be misled by such marketing tactics. Unfortunately, that appears to be the intention.

 

[Hammer67]

I no longer will (nor will I recommend them) and precisely because I do believe Boker's marketing to be deliberately confusing, spurious, and specious.

Duly noted. Luckily, we live in a glorious age in which we can concern ourselves with such things, and in which there are so many other good options to choose from.

 

[jkulysses]

By the way in the manufacturing forum there is a Boker forum, with Boker reps, do you guys think we should move this? Maybe a mod could ? It would be interesting what they have to say.

Pete

I'm actually very surprised it hasn't happened already & I think that is the best place for it. It would actually be very nice to hear something from the people that can actually get our opinions & feedback to the higher ups as well.

 

[knarfeng]

By the way in the manufacturing forum there is a Boker forum, with Boker reps, do you guys think we should move this? Maybe a mod could ? It would be interesting what they have to say.

Pete

Not happening. There are some strong comments in this thread which I would hope the posters would have the common politeness not to make if the thread were in a manufacturer's forum.

If someone wants to start a similar thread in the Boker forum, that's up to them. And I would trust that such a question in a manufacturer's forum would be phrased as an interrogatory and not as an accusation.