Is bugging out a romantic fantasy?

I have miles and miles of BLM land out my back door. In the unlikely event that I'll have to leave my house (out in the country), I have a large backpack with all my hiking gear, plus 7 days worth of food for 3 (my wife, kid, and myself), and guns/ammo for the wife and I. She gets to carry the kid, I carry everything else. We have wooded mountains with plenty of game and fresh water that go on for miles.
 
In a localized problem you can move out of harms way a bit. We had a wee fire problem in San Diego last October and had to run with half a million of my closest pals. OK - take a few things and go a few miles down the road or try sheltering in place. In a worst case - huge area disaster my question is bug out to where? I'll shelter in place rather than try to escape on the SoCal freeways with wife and kids in the car.

That is probably THE good question to raise. VERY many survival books, etc. contemplate only a few, and very different, survival scenarios. I like Kochanski's books (and R.H. Graves') a lot, but they focus more on the Canadian north woods and Australian bush, respectively, and the materials on moose and Australian vines are likely never to be an issue for me. Cody Lundin, who lives in my state of Arizona, is instantly more applicable. (And, actually, his stuff is probably more-broadly-applicable than most, just because Arizona's landscape ranges from low-altitude dune desert through grassland and coniferous forests to alpine permafrost in the highest mountains.)

But a gasoline crisis or dirty-bomb attack will be very different from a race riot or forest fire or hurricane or tornado. And I think we need to think through all of these--at least all that might potentially apply to any area where we might spend any significant amount of time.
 
I used to plan for when the SHTF, but I gave up years ago. It was easy when I was single, as my whole universe was a 3' radius around me. Now that I have a family, it's a waste of time to plan for bugging out, or even sheltering in place.

Most of the replies so far make a dangerous assumption that you are either at home, or can get back home quickly. This is almost never going to happen when the SHTF.

You just walked out of a meeting with only a notepad and what's in your suit pockets. Even your briefcase and jacket are in the car. You left the car in an underground parkade, and now that the power is off, you can't get back to your car. Your wife just dropped the youngest off at daycare, and was in the supermarket when the power died. Your oldest kid is on a school field trip, and you have no idea where she is.

It seems all the food hoarding and ammo stockpiling won't help you now. No BOB, no guns, cell phone network down. Just you, your SAK, and the other 100,000 bewildered people standing out in the streets wishing they were at home.

BB
 
Has no one here ever walked railroad tracks?? They go many places you want to be...

3 ATV's , one two wheeled cart, map of tracks for mid atlantic(they cross rivers too), unoccupied family farm in very rural setting just waiting- tracks run within 3 miles of getaway and within 1 mile of my home.

2Door
 
There is no way to bug out from South Florida. There are no side roads and very little wilderness. In addition to that, I have a wife and three kids. I'm bugging in. I agree with Beeperboy somewhat, but it certainly doesn't hurt to be prepared. It may take me two days to walk home from work, but I'll get there.
 
First, thanks to Mercop for the awesome title and post. One thing I notice about people when they talk about bugging out is that they do get ridiculous and romantic.

(Disclaimer: LONG post. I will have a condensed summary at the bottom of this post so you don't have to read so much- only 2 paragraphs. (I'm so nice! ;)

Disasters can be divided into 3 for me: inconvenient, impending, and catastrophic. Inconvenient is an outage without other factors or an ice storm. Impending is a hurricane or something that is predicted ahead of time.

The vast majority actual experiences (in fact, I can't think of any that don't) fall into the 2 I just mentioned. But, what of the catastrophic? Earthquakes, dirty bombs, actual nuclear war- all are catastrophic (scratch that earlier part: the Asian Tsunami. I will get into that event further on, as it is the only event I can discuss). Catastrophic generally means that the epicenter of the event is dangerous or deadly, and it comes with essentially no warning. The rest of the post concerns my beliefs about catastrophes.

What is different from the other 2? In both cases, people may wish to escape, but either it is not vital or there was a lead time to get ready and go. Absent from the first two is the mass amounts of people in a Catastrophe- maybe there were mass evacuations and backups for Katrina, or Rita, but if you REALLY wanted to get out at the first sign of danger, you could have. Not so with catastrophes. In these cases, you are competing with EVERYONE- not just unprepared people, or even prepared people, but those who are more prepared than you as well.

What this means? Well, highways will be jammed up, obviously, but let's say you DO get on a backroad or whatever. Even if there are not massive amounts of people like you, you have to think. You got out before other people. BEFORE. That means other people will eventually follow you. People get desperate in a way that you've probably never seen before.

On a particularly good website, survivalblog, the author talks of "the golden horde" in reference to Californians after a catastrophe. In short, California in general is a bad place to bug out, because there is SO many people, they will probably overwhelm basically everywhere in California in their fleeing, and most certainly will overwhelm the most desirable places for long term survival (good farmland, etc.).

This applies everywhere though: if there is a large amount of people, and they or you aren't killed initially, you have to contend with other people. Because we are so efficient in our distribution, any major kink in the distribution will mean it is devastating for anyone not prepared, and there is nowhere near enough to sustain the amount of people in cities ANYWHERE without either aid or a non-destroyed infrastructure. People don't just accept death. One lesson you learn in life guarding is if a person is drowning, it's not a good idea to swim to them empty-handed to attempt a rescue. They'll claw and grab and drag you down with them. Just because you have a good location doesn't mean refugees won't come to YOU.

Add in a wife, kids, dog- whatever liabilities to this scenario. The world will be anarchy if there is no salvation forthcoming. This will happen very quickly- more than likely before you can get out of dodge, but even if you do, they will follow. If you have a bug out location, people will find you there. Priests in Siberia thought they would be safe from the Black plague in the Middle Ages, but the plagued even made it out to these remote monasteries, and despite the best efforts of priests, brought those fleas of death as well.

Basic point is: there will be much mayhem and violence on an incomprehensible level. I think a good way to view this is to mix the Asian Tsunami and Katrina. The people who escaped the Tsunami were poor, and they had to rely on foreign aid. Their homes destroyed, they fled to the mountains, and set up there. Massive tent cities, but even more without. Winter came and snow fell; the UN had trouble getting helicopters with necessary supplies (tents), and other complications. Still, an admirable response. However, remember: if you truly are facing a catastrophe, the government(s) won't get there for a while, if ever. So, how about this: anyone and everyone else will look for the strongest swimmer, and cling to them until they both drown. Do you think a well-equipped SUV or motorbike with crucial supplies will look like a strong swimmer? I do.

Basically, bugging out is something that is good for the first 2 scenarios. In a catastrophe, though, there's a lot of luck involved, no matter how planned you are. Remember, the president is supposed to get Delta force to protect him after a nuclear incident. Secret service goes out the window, he gets Delta. This is in addition to all the awesome shelters he has. Without already being located in a very heavily fortified position far away from other people, or without even more massive an escort, which, I'm sorry to say, none of us (unless you are the president, in which case hello Mr. president!) has a good option for a catastrophe. Sorry to say, but being lucky will count for more than any BOB, route, planning, or any other preparation.

Cliff notes (no pun intended on the banned member):
In a catastrophe, the most impending problem is people. These people, if unprepared and uncared for, will fall into mob behavior. They will continue to loot, raid, and take whatever they can for themselves until they don't need to, and perhaps not even then. Any plan that ignores this is extremely foolhardy. They will clog any and all ways out of a location. They will compete for scarce resources. They will come to your bug out location, before or after you get there, and help themselves to your careful storage if you cannot prevent this. People, as stupid as they may be, will rediscover their latent survival instincts and do what it takes to survive. Nothing in America is built to accommodate a massive collapse of infrastructure. If this were to occur, then remember, everyone is competition. Any liabilities (non-survivalist wife, young kids, dog) are just that: liabilities. They will make survival harder.

If this is a long term situation, remember that there will still be way too many people to survive off the land. Thus, your area with "plenty of game" will likely be depopulated, if not stripped, by other people. Most likely, the best you can do is survive in your location for a while (preferably off of extensive food stores that can't be overhunted), and then search for areas that were not so impacted by unsustainable amounts of people- you are awaiting a massive die off. Most likely, though, your biggest problem will be in evacuation. You will face riots, mobs, and all sorts of trouble along the way. Unless you are tipped off ahead of time, you must prepare for the fact that evacuation will be one of, if not the most treacherous experience of your life. The aftermath, if less dramatic, will only be so because it is stretched over a length of time. One thing will count for more than all you can pack, plan, design, or set up. It's luck of the draw. In an Apocalyptic, end of the world scenario, this is the reality. This is not to say you should give up. This does mean to say, though, that you must realize in a situation like this, you will not have anything like the certainty and control you have now. Adjust your expectations, and prepare accordingly.

Cheerful, I know. I'm as much fun as a funeral in the rain.
Zero
 
Cliff notes (no pun intended on the banned member):
In a catastrophe, the most impending problem is people. These people, if unprepared and uncared for, will fall into mob behavior. They will continue to loot, raid, and take whatever they can for themselves until they don't need to, and perhaps not even then. Any plan that ignores this is extremely foolhardy. They will clog any and all ways out of a location. They will compete for scarce resources. They will come to your bug out location, before or after you get there, and help themselves to your careful storage if you cannot prevent this. People, as stupid as they may be, will rediscover their latent survival instincts and do what it takes to survive. Nothing in America is built to accommodate a massive collapse of infrastructure. If this were to occur, then remember, everyone is competition. Any liabilities (non-survivalist wife, young kids, dog) are just that: liabilities. They will make survival harder.

If this is a long term situation, remember that there will still be way too many people to survive off the land. Thus, your area with "plenty of game" will likely be depopulated, if not stripped, by other people. Most likely, the best you can do is survive in your location for a while (preferably off of extensive food stores that can't be overhunted), and then search for areas that were not so impacted by unsustainable amounts of people- you are awaiting a massive die off. Most likely, though, your biggest problem will be in evacuation. You will face riots, mobs, and all sorts of trouble along the way. Unless you are tipped off ahead of time, you must prepare for the fact that evacuation will be one of, if not the most treacherous experience of your life. The aftermath, if less dramatic, will only be so because it is stretched over a length of time. One thing will count for more than all you can pack, plan, design, or set up. It's luck of the draw. In an Apocalyptic, end of the world scenario, this is the reality. This is not to say you should give up. This does mean to say, though, that you must realize in a situation like this, you will not have anything like the certainty and control you have now. Adjust your expectations, and prepare accordingly.

Cheerful, I know. I'm as much fun as a funeral in the rain.
Zero

Really great post - very realistic thinking given the extreme level of collapse (apocalyptic) being considered. The only thing I would add is that while mob behavior will be the first order of the day, gang warfare will be the second. People's latent survival instinct is fundamentally based on the tribe or gang - a hierarchical structure with a strong central leader. Most people's chances of survival, although largely dependent on luck of the draw, will also depend greatly on their ability to function and operate within the context of a gang.

But I think your basic point is well taken - you should be prepared to die and then get to work. If you expect to live, you're just going to die disappointed.
 
Mercop,
Sorry I infringed upon your sensibilities. Feel free to stick to the highways.


Bugging out with the family IS a romantic notion. It is an option for me in some scenarios and I plan to keep my options open. The site I mentioned is the family birthplace and a few of the family members have discussed making this our rally point in case of events that might bring about civil disobediance. Security in numbers and a somewhat isolated location would give a better chance than staying in our home locations. Most situations are planned "stay at home" responses. I have fully considered routes to take to get home should roadyways become congested. I also have determined routes to get home that take floods into consideration since I have experienced several of thoses here. Fashionable or not I like to feel independent of established roadways.

2Door
 
I like where this is going. Some say, "Stay put." Others say, "Bug out." I say, prepare for any move or non-move you may have to make.
 
Ever hear of hurricanes?
Plenty of warning time thanks to satellites to bug out.

I lived through Andrew in Miami.
Katrina also.
Cat 5 comes my way again I'm gone.

Nuclear war,terrorism or accident might get me to load up my RV as well.
However Hurricanes are my main concern.
 
Brian, That just made me laugh and I made a fart at the same time. The fart was machinegunning out at the same frequency as the laugh due to the juggling of the gut from the laughing, which made me laugh harder. You succesfully started a chain reaction that ended with me and a coworker of mine almost throwing up from laughing so hard.

Generally agreed, and good thoughts, all.

I am, however, still interested in filing away some information about the dual-sport bike idea. Part of it is that I commute miles from the wife and kids, from the suburbs to big-city downtown, each day. Could see that providing a way of getting home to them, if things went awry. And, second, I could see it becoming part of a bigger plan under some circumstances. Or, say, you saw the disaster coming, packed the wife and kids off to a safer, out-of-the-urban-area area, but still wanted mobility. You might be really happy to be able to go out on a good-mileage, maneuverable bike and look for supplies, hunt, go back for the purse your wife forgot and left on the kitchen table:o--whatever. Or say things got bad in a large town, but not quite bad enough to qualify for the apocalyptic. You could see a situation where it was good to keep your job, but also to pack non-essential personnel out of the city. I could see the bike idea having application there, even for a family man.

You say you're a bike dealer, and you seem to know about these things. (You certainly know more than I do--the most I've done is run a moped around an island off Mexico a few years back.) For those of us who don't know a Harley from a Vespa, could you elaborate a bit about what modifications you think are desirable by way of emergency prep for a dual-sport or off-road bike? I'm also curious to know about the range of those things, and general mileage.

Thanks.

The first thing to keep in mind is that having the best exhaust system and jetting is ideal for normal use to increase the power and throttle response. This is NOT the case when you're considering it for a SHTF situation. Any of those pipes are going to make you WAY more audible from far away. Generally, the stock exhaust on one of those bikes is quiet enough that at idle, you could be sitting within 100 ft of someone in the woods and with normal ambient sound, they can't hear you. Donovan and I both stuck with the stock pipes so we could travel across people's land and behind neighborhoods without alerting anyone. It's much nicer and more convenient to be quiet. For us, that outweighed the power gain.

The second thing to take into consideration is the tires. On almost all of the dual sport bikes in that cc class, they're rolling on tube tires. Thats a big plus. On a tubeless tire you do have the option of patching it if you run over a nail or something like that, but it will just be a quick fix. No matter what, with dirt tires, you'll at the very least keep a slow leak. With tube tires, you can keep an extra front and rear tube, two tire tools, and a CO2 inflator kit in your gear. If you pop a tube, you can completely replace it and not have to worry about anything. The actual tire won't be damaged enough to need to be replaced quickly. Generally speaking, they all come with pretty decent tires from the factory. Just pick up the extra tubes, inflator kit, and tire tools.

The third thing you want to deal with is storage. They have no storage other than a small tool kit box from the factory. There are plenty of companies that make rack systems that will fit these bikes. You want to use a rack system, not just a set of bags. The racks will allow you more places to anchor to and also make it more stable in the event of crashing. The rack system I used allowed for two large containers on the sides and one large container over the rear of the bike. I also took a 5" diameter piece of PVC sealed on one end and threaded for a cap on the other, approx. 12" long, and with a rubber o-ring at the base of the threads for the cap to have a watertight seal. In there, I kept my tire repair stuff and a complete tool kit for the entire bike that would allow make to make repairs on the fly. I also have a Clymers service manual, extra headlight bulbs, sparkplugs, etc. in there.

The fourth step was increasing the range of the bike. It came with a tank that was about 2.5 gallons. That would normally get you about 180 miles without going into the reserve tank. I wanted to get more range so I found a company on the internet that made spare fuel tanks that had the dimesnions of approx. 3"x12"x16". This allowed me to carry a couple more gallons. I found an electric inline fuel pump, a length of fuel line, a fuel petcock, and an inline filter. I drilled a hole for the petcock in the upper side of the tank near the handlebars and installed the petcock there. The I ran the line from the petcock to the rear bottom of the right hand side of the extra fuel cell with the inline pump and filter installed. Then I just wired the pump to the headlight wire and to a switch that I mounted on the handbars. That way, if I needed more fuel, I could just open the secondary fuel petcock on the tank and flip the switch and it would pump all of the fuel from the rear cell to the tank. Worked like a charm. That put the range at about 380 miles before the reserve tank.

Next was masking the headlight, taillight, and blinkers. You don't want to cover them up, just make them less obvious. I found a perferrated tape made for masking trackbike headlights. That way, you're not casting a huge glare off your lights all the time. Same concept as masking a scope.

Last but not least, strip the decals and bust out the rattle bombs. The stock paintjobs are meant to be super visible. Cover that crap up. I went with flat black and flat od green. Turned out awesome. There's more that you can do, but that is the stuff you want to get out of the way right off the bat.

Not to mention all of it looks damn cool once you get done. It's like the stealth motorcycle. I was always getting compliments and people checking it out. I ended up selling it set up like that to a guy that came into the shop about 3 months ago for $5000. He loves it.
 
Dylside,
I am looking at modding my Honda Rancher 400 up this year. It came in fairly flat green and has become my favorite toy- less nimble and less range than your bike but I can easily transport my 8 yr old on back.

2Door
 
cool.. a trail bike that if you make it to cool looking running thru the big disater of your choice ..some mofo will jack it...I keep everything plain jane ,not to stand out in a crowd or herd...Ps the farting /laughing short saga before hand ...made me laugh aloud...
 
As in war, it always seems like people prepare for the last disaster. There's always a bit of folly involved-what makes something a disaster is that pretty much everyone is unprepared for it. That would include the scenarios even hardcore survivalists didn't anticipate.

My vote is for flexibility. Sometimes bugging out makes sense. Other times, it may mean suicide. Hope to have the wisdom to have enough good judgment if/when such an occasion comes about.
 
cool.. a trail bike that if you make it to cool looking running thru the big disater of your choice ..some mofo will jack it...I keep everything plain jane ,not to stand out in a crowd or herd...Ps the farting /laughing short saga before hand ...made me laugh aloud...

Unfortunately, with the necessary gear for doing the trips Donovan and I were doing and the possibilty of using it as a bugout bike, the result was being very cool looking and attracting attention in public. The trick is that if you use it in the SHTF situation, don't be in public. If you are, leave quickly. Chances are, anyone who wants it won't be able to keep up unless they already have some form of A.T.V. of their own, in which case, just hope you're faster in the woods. Also, ANYTHING capable in that situation is going to be sought after by everyone without one, it's just the risk you take by having it. Kind of a smeer the queer type situation. In my trips that I've taken on that thing, there were a couple of times, riding railroa tracks, that I came across small groups of fugitives and thugs that no doubt wanted that bike. Donovan and I never had a problem evading or finding a diiferent route before they had a chance to force us to shoot them. You run into that alot on railways if you stay on them long enough. Also, we could move through property, not far away from people, without being noticed. I think that as long as you stuck to the shadows so to speak you're no more at risk than if you were traveling with any kind of gear. In the situation to be worried about being jacked for your supplies, I don't think it's going to matter how skilled or well stocked you appear. I think everyone is going to be fair game and everyone, geared up or not, is going to have to deal with soon to be dead people.
 
As in war, it always seems like people prepare for the last disaster. There's always a bit of folly involved-what makes something a disaster is that pretty much everyone is unprepared for it. That would include the scenarios even hardcore survivalists didn't anticipate.

My vote is for flexibility. Sometimes bugging out makes sense. Other times, it may mean suicide. Hope to have the wisdom to have enough good judgment if/when such an occasion comes about.

I cannot self terminate.
-T101
 
I used to plan for when the SHTF, but I gave up years ago. It was easy when I was single, as my whole universe was a 3' radius around me. Now that I have a family, it's a waste of time to plan for bugging out, or even sheltering in place.

Most of the replies so far make a dangerous assumption that you are either at home, or can get back home quickly. This is almost never going to happen when the SHTF.

You just walked out of a meeting with only a notepad and what's in your suit pockets. Even your briefcase and jacket are in the car. You left the car in an underground parkade, and now that the power is off, you can't get back to your car. Your wife just dropped the youngest off at daycare, and was in the supermarket when the power died. Your oldest kid is on a school field trip, and you have no idea where she is.

It seems all the food hoarding and ammo stockpiling won't help you now. No BOB, no guns, cell phone network down. Just you, your SAK, and the other 100,000 bewildered people standing out in the streets wishing they were at home.

BB

You have made some very astute observations here.

For sure, a preparedness level that leaves one's gear in one's suburban home while one is 15-30 miles away downtown is going to be no match for an instant, unexpectable apocalyptic-level grid crash.

But there are many different directions the fan can be aiming when the "S" hits it. And even "S" comes in a variety of viscosities, scents, and a rainbow of colors. And while there are many potential disaster scenarios in which reuniting with my family members would be difficult, there are many in which it would not.

Right off the bat, I sleep at home. Even on long workdays, I spend more than 50% of my total hours there. So, though a worst case might see disaster striking when I'm downtown, a lot of potential problems might see me right there with my family. And that's assuming there was no warning. For many disasters, I have tried to cultivate a better-than-average situational awareness. The very fact that we are talking through this stuff probably puts us between a half-hour and a month ahead of the mass of other people out there. The fact that I already KNOW that, if the power goes out, I'm going to be in a desert with really-limited water and 3 million other people wanting it means that I already have canteens to carry it, canteens which I keep full, purification devices to make usable whatever I find, and a running list of places I've noted in my daily routine where water could be had in an emergency. More broadly, it also means that I've pointed out to my kids when water-loving birds have flown overhead, and noted for them where they are going, pointing out that this is a great indicator of unseen water sources. They're little, but they're learning fast. Are they a liability in a disaster right now? Probably. But their marginal helpfulness is increasing month by month.

There are dozens of potential disasters--some of which would make a bugout advisable, some of which would not--which one ought to think through. For me, a few disasters really shaped my current thinking. First was when a pair of tornadoes went through the center of the city where I was in law school, about a week before final exams. I think the report of a violent storm front coming in from the west may have had something to do with my decision to drive to my off-campus apartment BEFORE it hit--which, in turn, kept my car out of the path of the trees that ended up falling on many of my classmates' cars. When the tornadoes approached, I had just enough time to scout a good shelter under my building. Good, but better would have been a battery-powered radio and a flashlight within blind reach. My part of town spent 3 days without electricity, and a few hours without even access to news to find out the extent of the damage or the prognosis for recovery--some of us had to rely on hearsay from passing motorists to learn about buildings collapsed, etc. When I finally made it to Wal-Mart for batteries and candles, I found these all bought off the shelves. This was a wake-up call. For all my survival study and training back with my family and (fortunately very outdoor-oriented and emergency-preparedness-oriented) Scout troop back home, I had let my preparedness lapse while I was in law school. It was time for a change.

I began assembling what I needed for disasters. Laid in extra batteries. Bought a full-sized axe for clearing away fallen trees (lots in that town).

September 11, a few years later, was another such incident. After that, I got very seriously into preparing "go" bags for my wife and myself, stocking them with food, tools, shelter, and things we'd need for the kids. At that point, I began cultivating the situational-awareness aspect of emergency preparedness much more seriously.

This led to more layering. Now I keep serious survival equipment at home, a somewhat-less-comprehensive array of gear, food, water, etc. in each vehicle, a small hip-pack of survival gear (plus about a week's worth of food) in my office, and a good deal of other necessary stuff within arm's reach of my desk.

At the same time, I've had to realize that preparing for ONE disaster can mean ignoring another. Preparation for a tornado may leave you unprepared for a citywide fuel shortage. (This happened a couple of years ago--my metro area of 3 million people or so turned out to be served by just one or two gas / petrol pipelines, and when one of these rusted and leaked and had to be shut down, we suddenly had fuel lines for days, with prices up 100% or more in some places. I'll say, the situational-awareness habit had at least developed enough by then that I was able to buy the last two portable gas cans from the local store.) Preparation for a terrorist attack may be one thing--something which you can't see coming, except in the most general terms--but a killer flu may be something you can see coming a week away. (If that happens, maybe you want to "bug in"--not a bad idea to keep some bleach and gloves onhand, think through in-family quarantine procedures, set up to telecommute via e-mail if your work will permit, and maybe give some thought to home-schooling the kids for a semester while all their classmates are trading viruses until the school district gets wise and shuts the schools a week too late.)

This is why I think a fatalistic "nothing I can do about it as a family man" reaction is a little more pessimistic than we need to be. Sure, if some Taliban sympathizer detonates a homemade atomic bomb in my basement, there's no preparation that could help. But for every such problem for which one cannot effectively prepare, there are probably ten for which some preparation would help.

There are even some long-term disasters, and it's good to give some thought to those, too. Not a bad idea to keep an eye toward the horizon in social and political ways; any potential disasters of that kind? I don't mean to suggest paranoia, but I do have to note that members of my own ethnic group were targets of a deliberate and systematic effort at genocide during the last century, subjected by an occupation government to food rations calculated to be at a daily caloric level incompatible with long-term survival--and I've thought long and hard about what that must look like when it's coming, and what illusions of "it couldn't happen here" kept people from fleeing until it was too late. I've wondered: what would it have been like to be, say, a Jew in Germany in the time before those atrocities got into full swing? And I ask myself, until what point ought one to stay, and cooperate from within the system in an effort to get along, and at what point does one seek out greener pastures?

It need not be quite so stark as that, either. I have noticed with concern that the fact that my city is in a desert--3 million people in a place with insufficient water access and food access, except while the grid is up and humming nicely--means that if things blow at any seam, this may not be a very good place to be. I mean, just think of it at the level of property values. Not usually one's first concern on a survival forum, but if water suddenly (or even gradually) got a whole lot harder to get enough of, that house one's been paying a mortgage on for a decade or three could suddenly (or gradually) become valueless. I think the prudent thing is to keep one's eye on the horizon, on many levels, and with a sober regard for the risks from many quarters.

In recent years I've actually begun looking into what crops the Indians in my own area used to grow for food, and for some years running now I've been trying my own crops of desert-adapted corn, beans, squash, cotton, and the like. There's been some trial and error in that, but I now know the basics of how to do it--and my kids do, too, as I've brought them along in it. They can tell beans from weeds, know when to plant them, know basics of how to parch corn and cook beans and spin cotton. Not a bad start.

I've also found, to my delighted surprise, that the hands-on creative activity involved in learning and practicing survival skills is just about the best entertainment my kids could have. They love building shelters, cooking outdoors, planting crops, making things with knives, hatchets, and paracord, etc.

So, I'm not of the opinion that my new and wouldn't-have-expected-it-ten-years-ago status as dad of all these kids means giving up on emergency preparedness. In a way, it is even a strong call to more of the same. I now have kids whose idea of a GREAT afternoon is making a match-free fire in the backyard and cooking dinner. I also now have kids who love to wander off in the woods, and whom it would be good to make sure know what to do when they get lost.


As to the post above in which it is pointed out (also astutely) that a major disaster of urban-wide or nationwide or worldwide scope would rapidly lead to large numbers of desperate, aggressive people seeking out exactly the same limited wilderness resources you are (and/or looking to your survival gear as their own best hope, potentially with an eye toward eliminating you and taking it), that's also good to consider--though I think the conclusion was a little stark. Mercop's initial observation that one's car stuck in a massive evacuation traffic pileup would be a good display of one's stuff is, I think, well taken. But the lesson to take from this, I think, is just this: (1) bear in mind that there will be other desperate people--many of them--who will want what you have; and (2) bear in mind that you may have to hide your preparations from such people, who may come in numbers or with strength which may be impossible to fight off.

This is a really important consideration--but not one to make one throw up one's hands, on the one hand, nor to resolve to become an amoral loner, on the other. Working this into your plan can pay off. In the past, I've run low on water because I've given some of mine to those who underestimated their needs. So I have taken to carrying more--and to advising others accordingly. Maybe you carry a few extra knit caps, in case you find yourself in a group of others underprepared for cold. Maybe you split your emergency supply of food and gasoline between your garage and some out-of-the-way place out in the woods.

In any event, I'm grateful for this thread, and for everybody's very-thought-provoking responses.
 
Back
Top