Is it just me or is Benchmade really falling behind.

[Yo Mama]

Do you really believe that?

Uh yeah or i would not have said it. Every spyderco, kershaw, and most bucks ive bought are perfect under the 100 dollar range. Benchmade has issues and its been clear for years with their reputation for lacking great fit and finish.

So why can my kershaw link be perfect at 40 dollars but not a bm at 3 times the cost? Both are made in America btw.

 

[Yo Mama]

Yea...good luck with that.

Ive had great luck with that:

buck marksman
Buck vantage
Buck 110
Spyderco endrua (i have 2)
spyderco manix 2 (i have 4)
spyderco native
Kershaw link
Boker Kalashnikov xl
Victorinox one handed trekker


All these sub 100 dollar blades i own and were perfect fit and finish........so i guess "good luck with that" right back at ya!?!?

I have a 3 Benchmades and i love them but to discount that bm doesnt have a rep of missing key issues is just wrong or naivete. Out of the three I own two had to go back immediately to be sharpened as they were dull as rocks. Great attribute in a blade to be sharp ya know.

Btw I only listed the sub $100 blades but those are not really as expensive as most Benchmades. If you want me to go through that list it just kind of blows Benchmade out of the water at that point with the quality you can get for the same money at a different manufacturer.


So....... next time somebody gives their opinion maybe try to provide some kind of tangible response.

 

[jkarp_53]

Yes. Then you have someone buying a Benchmade because they've heard good things about them. They own Bucks and Kershaws but wanted something better. Then they get their Benchmade. Out of the box it's off center with an uneven bevel, and they can't adjust the pivot because it's a Barrage and that pivot's buried. What do they do? Buy another Buck 110 at half the cost (or less...) and it's prefect in every way. What happens is Benchmade loses in the transaction, and that hopeful customer never comes back - and they don't go online to register their complaints, they just move on. This piece is my own thoughts on paper, hope it helps!

 

[BMCGear]

Ive had great luck with that:

buck marksman
Buck vantage
Buck 110
Spyderco endrua (i have 2)
spyderco manix 2 (i have 4)
spyderco native
Kershaw link
Boker Kalashnikov xl
Victorinox one handed trekker


All these sub 100 dollar blades i own and were perfect fit and finish........so i guess "good luck with that" right back at ya!?!?

I have a 3 Benchmades and i love them but to discount that bm doesnt have a rep of missing key issues is just wrong or naivete. Out of the three I own two had to go back immediately to be sharpened as they were dull as rocks. Great attribute in a blade to be sharp ya know.

Btw I only listed the sub $100 blades but those are not really as expensive as most Benchmades. If you want me to go through that list it just kind of blows Benchmade out of the water at that point with the quality you can get for the same money at a different manufacturer.


So....... next time somebody gives their opinion maybe try to provide some kind of tangible response.

My apologies, here's a tangible response: Go buy 20 of each of those knives sight unseen and report back on how many of each were perfect. I've owned those brands and most of the models mentioned and have had issues with some. I've had Endura's with blade play that couldn't be worked out, 2 Manix LW's that were off center; one was rubbing and because they're pinned I wouldn't get them straightened out either. Buck is about the worst in fit and finish that I've experienced.

I'm not saying Benchmade doesn't have some QC issues; I'm saying that this thing happens with any production company. Even CRK isn't immune to fit/finish issues and they have the tightest tolerances in the game.

When you buy massed produced knives you run the risk of an issue here or there. At first I thought this was only a Benchmade problem until I started buying larger samples of other brands. I had already sampled Kershaw (had 2 different Blur's that I could unlock with just bumping the blade; I did have a Chive however that was perfect in everyway) and Buck (never found a knife that I felt was decent other than the 110).

So in sum, yes each knife company can put out a perfect knife. There are many here who are shocked that Benchmade puts out a knife with issues because they've never experienced that. When you start buying a larger sample of each manufacturer you run the risk of getting a knife.

 

[Scott321]

I love my Bucks (110's &112's), but I can't adjust the pivot, there's issues with some: off center grinds, slight blade play over time, one had a strange clicking in the handle which I returned, another developing a weird roll or chip in the blade (I think it's from touching the inside when closing), and even over sharpening from the factory taking years off of the life of the blade. I still love the knives though. Check the Buck section to see how many boxes collectors go through at Cabelas to get that "perfect" Alaskan Guide 110.

I only have a few Spyderco knives but they are all over $100. One had a slightly uneven grind, and another had a thumb hole which would wear apart my winter under gloves before I sanded it.

Of the 3 Esse Rat folders I had, one had defects on the blade under the washers which caused gritty opening. I've also had issues with some LM blades, but don't carry my Vics enough to notice any flaws.

My one CS knife had an off center grind and an oversized pin in the handle I had to grind down so the handle scales sat flat on the back spacer.

I have around 15 BM knives and only sent one back for repair. Another I sent in because I messed up the blade. Their CS was awesome. A couple have grinds that are about 1/2 mm off, but nothing a good sharpening didn't cure. Personally, factoring the added expense of labor for the more intricate inner workings of the Axis lock, an American factory, excellent CS, and upgraded options both in gold class and dealer exclusives, I don't believe they are overpriced or falling behind in design. If anything, I think they are lacking non-Axis lock manual offerings, but that is also one of their claim-to-fames.

Nowadays I always place in the comments to knife dealers to check for blade centering and lock up before shipping any brand out. I also like to take my knives apart and thoroughly clean and oil them when I first get them (didn't Spyderco use red loctite on their screws until recently?). Maybe I just need to collect more of the other brands to get a better sampling, but at this time, I don't see quality control lacking in comparison to competitors... at least in my experience.

 

[basmca]

As someone who doesn't have knife stores to visit and buy from benchmade QC is a big factor that stops me from buying.

The second would be the pricing.
Everything they make seems to be priced a grade above what it is. 110$/130€ for a griptillian with budget materials. at 60$/80€ it would be great, but in that higher price range there's much better stuff around.

Those 2 combined make for a really hard time buying them.

 

[sharkattacksw]

As someone who doesn't have knife stores to visit and buy from benchmade QC is a big factor that stops me from buying.

The second would be the pricing.
Everything they make seems to be priced a grade above what it is. 110$/130€ for a griptillian with budget materials. at 60$/80€ it would be great, but in that higher price range there's much better stuff around.

Those 2 combined make for a really hard time buying them.

I agree, although I do have a great knife shop about 45 minutes away. I can go see the knives in person before buying, but it's the cost I can't justify. I really want to get a 943, but they are about $180 or so. That just seems like a lot for what I'm getting.

 

[banana-clip]

It seems to me there are a few major issues plauging Benchmade right now.

1. Poor QC: I've heard lots of promises on this very forum that BMs QC issues will be resolved. So far I have seen no move to actually address this.

2. Discontinuing all their best models: Yeah great move BM. Why don't you disco all your most beloved models that hit it out the park, and attempt to release a bunch of new models that will be loved. Why BM?

3. Blade steel: Yeah enough of the S30v. Not that it is necessarily a bad steel and I have a few blades where they seemed to get the heat treat right. On the other hand I have so many blades in S30v thay I just hate. There are so many better steels available now.

I agree with everything you said especially about discontinuing their most popular models. I just don't get that at all. Why not just improve them with maybe a different handle material, make an LE model or different blade steel?

 

[HJK]

i used to be a big benchmade fan and still have, use and love some of my earlier BM knives. Quality, value and a bit of style and innovation are what attract.

 

[Lo/Rez]

I just received a 940-1501 and it appears to be a very good knife. The grind looks symmetrical, the blade is almost dead center and the fit and finish appears to be spot on. I will pass judgement on the blade after I sharpen it with the Wicked Edge. I don't like the pocket clip and will be requesting a replacement.

 

[microtech85]

With respect, i think it may be just you so to speak. i think the past 2 years have shown some great thinking, design, and some notable improvements in quality control. I think the proper is a sweet concept and i intend to buy one. the new grip series is what many grip owners have been pining for. The new versions of 940 have much to offer; super light weight and strength and even one at a lower price. Plus they seem to be moving up to s30 as a standard steel. i know some poeple shrug off s30v, but the way benchmade heat treats, it is truly a great steel for edc.

 

[microtech85]

Also, i wouldnt be surprised if benchmade begins to slightly cut into spydercos market share. In other words, i think benchmade may just be beginning to give spyderco a run for its money. I think the bugout is going to be a new top seller for benchmade. spyderco went the way of highly specialized and collector type knives the last few years and i think thag has maybe hurt them a little.

 

[microtech85]

In response to steel choice, spydercos best sellers are obviously the delica, and para 2, and the main steel on those is vg10 and s30v. I think if spyderco thought s30v was in any way "inferior", "low end", or "outdated", they would have replaced it as the main prodcution model already. Steels like s110 and s90, and m390 are really specialty options that do not appeal to the mass market as they do to steel collectors. i for one like s30v a lot. My favorite is m390. But i personally would buy an expensive knife even with 14c28n because i think it is the lowest i want to go in edge retention but it has other great properties such as easy maintenance and has an ultra fine grain and will take a super fine edge so easily and can be heat treated to rc 62. my most carried knife is 940-1, followed by delica with vg10.

 

[Sunyata]

On another forum a guy wants a knife with a very specific set of criteria. He gets recommended the Valet. He gets it in the mail and the knife has blade play. He sends it back to be replaced and the replacement also has blade play.

He sends that one back and buys two other companies knives to replace it. It's things like that that have made it hard to keep people recommending Benchmade

 

[Pinnacle64]

Production knives in general seem to always be a bit more risky QC from my experience. I've had imperfect ones from BENCHMADE,Spyderco, ZT and others just to name a few. The majority of them I've purchased have been good overall QC it's really like a 10% issue rate for me. Things like blades being slightly off center, Grind marks and etc etc.

My main issue with Benchmade is I just feel like they are a little overpriced in general compared to other options out there. I appreciate their made in USA and the fact they use higher end steels in a lot of their models. I also think MAP pricing hurts their overall sales numbers, fact is the 940-1 at the average cost of $260+ Is near what some good custom knives cost. Without MAP a guy could maybe save 30-40 bucks with aggressive dealers looking to more more product.

I guess anything man made will never be Truly perfect. I would just expect QC staff to catch some of these imperfections at the factory vs a customer having to take the time to return the item.

 

[fq55]

Also, i wouldnt be surprised if benchmade begins to slightly cut into spydercos market share. In other words, i think benchmade may just be beginning to give spyderco a run for its money. I think the bugout is going to be a new top seller for benchmade. spyderco went the way of highly specialized and collector type knives the last few years and i think thag has maybe hurt them a little.

FYI, Benchmade has about 4 times the yearly revenue of Spyderco. BKC makes and sells ways more knives than Spyderco and always has.

I think we sometimes forget how big of a company Benchmade actually is which to me makes their level of warranty support and customer service even more impressive.

 

[Pinnacle64]

I didn’t realize benchmade renvue was so much higher than Spyderco.

That brings up another point all things equal a company that sales 4 times more knives should have four times as many returns in fairness. It’s just how the numbers add up if everything is compared fairly.

I would hope that BM would strive for a lower return percentage than their competitors though

 

[NJBillK]

I have posted the text below in the "Benchmade Blem" thread, but I feel that this thread is probably a bit more suited to the posts content. So I am posting it here and removing it from th "Blem" thread.
-----
Now, I am going to pick this number out of thin air, but say 1 out of every 100 have a flaw significant enough that ZT, Spyderco, (insert brand here) does mark them as such, and prices them accordingly to cover manufacturing costs, and make their profit from the "correct" models.

Which means that a few things are possible, regarding Benchmade, they include things like they;
A) are some form of mass production mega-machine that the likes of which has not been seen, within the confines of the knife industry. And they just don't have the employee volume to check the massive volume they produce.
B) have a smaller second production plant or at the very least, a productions shift worth of personnel thats entire job revolves around the disassembly and reassembly of QC rejected knives.
--The next one is (hopefully) less likely, though it does have the most circumstantial evidence backing it--
C) QC was directly told to be more lenient with what passes their standards.
D) Item "C" would be backed up by a higher warranty likelihood, and would result in the company being more lax when it comes to denials of warranty replacment/repair due to acknowledgement of "C" and their requirement to do so, otherwise risk reputation.
E) Item "D" would then make the company look better in the publics eye; since the general public would view this as the company having a "Good Warranty" when all it Could Be is (not definitive) the company hoping that knives with issues are bought by customers that;
F1) don't know better
F2) don't care enough
F3) care but don't want the hassle
F4) are willing to accept the knife as QC Passed, therefore it must be OK.
F5) won't purchase from the brand again.
G) this would result in more knives making it out of the plant that are sub-par by our standards, and (unfortunately) considered OK by company standards.
E) All of this second portion would result in us knife nuts saying that Benchmade has to make up ground for a lesser than expected (at this price point) F&F standard.
------
I know that this is all conjecture, but it all seems to be a bit too convenient...

 

[microtech85]

Yea, i have always been told benchmade was the larger of the two but never knew by how much. I wasnt aware that either companies posted their revenues though. I believe both are privately held companies. It seems like benchmade has more real life word of mouth and reputation where it seems that online spyderco gets a lot more attention.

 

[Scott321]

Yea, i have always been told benchmade was the larger of the two but never knew by how much. I wasnt aware that either companies posted their revenues though. I believe both are privately held companies. It seems like benchmade has more real life word of mouth and reputation where it seems that online spyderco gets a lot more attention.

Although I can't vouch for the references, you can Google for analysis of the companies with approximate revenue. That being said, I would suggest that QC probably is a concern with every company... especially ones with reputable CS strategies. Both reputation and returns/repairs covered under warranty are a drag on a company's bottom line. Considering its in any company's best interest, I would assume that any chronic F&F issues would be a priority for BMKC.