James Keating's Fighting Axe & Tomahawk #1 Review

Just finished watching the video yesterday so here is my review. First, I didn’t read any one else’s review first. Second a little about me. I have no martial arts training and no knife training. Most of my “self defense” training is firearms related. I am not sure exactly what I was expecting from this video. I think what I wanted was an introduction on strikes, targets, what to do if you miss the target and you are off balance…..things like that. This video basicly jumped in to what seemed to me to be advanced stuff. Actually “chopping” a bad guy with the thing was almost an afterthought after you parried and twisted around. It was liked he expected the viewers to be trained knife fighters and this was a video to adapt the same techniques to hawks. If that was what it was advertised as (I don’t know) then perhaps it was what the purchaser would have been looking for.

There was no discussion of the pros and cons of handle length, head attachment, edge grinds, spike versus hammer versus round poll, or anything I would have found useful. I view the tomahawk or hatchet as a powerful kind of field or garage expedient weapon (unless you are in some military type combat which I have no experience with.) I would never carry one concealed as he suggested because in Ohio you can get a permit to carry a concealed weapon but my jurisdiction does NOT extend that to knives let alone concealed tomahawks. If I am gonna carry that much concealed weight it will be a firearm. I was looking for a little more of how to defend myself with one if it was all I had. I am realistically not going to train extensively with it and I have no intention of getting that close to someone armed with a knife when I have a long tomahawk. I know my limitations. So the majority of his video was useless to me.

Also, in all the Rendezvous I have watched and competed in (only a couple), I have never seen anyone throw a hawk that way. It looked way too “All right bad guy, stand still while I get squared off, wind up with both arms, and throw at you” to me. My uncle taught me to “Pull your arm back and throw the thing like he is getting ready to shoot an arrow or throw a spear at you.” It also made me mad that they were throwing at what appeared to be a live tree.

Just my opinions as I am no expert at all, just a lover of the history of hawks and hatchets. Thanks for the opportunity though FSCJedi. Now I will read what you more knowledgeable guys have to say.
 
that was a very good review Messer454! i think you made some very valid points. considering what you were hoping for in this video i think you would like the cold steel dvd set which can be had for about $50 from various retailers. i'm still waiting on Jedi to review it but considering it is about 6 hours long that might be asking too much. lol
 
Messr: I enjoyed your review....gave me some more ideas of what training material is needed. I second on Lynn Thompson's (Cold Steel) dvd set The Fighting Tomahawk . Does a pretty good job of covering all the basics. Now, just so you'll know some people can't stand Lynn Thompson or anything he does. Why, I really don't know because he is one of the few distributors that actually tests and trains on his products. They bad mouth this video unjustly because it is good quality and easy to follow. He uses the ole style pitch of talking to the camera and that bothers some people, I guess. He teaches a stance that I really don't particulary like but it is functional. The work on Reverse Grip Hawk is unusual to say the least, BUT I've worked with some of it and it's functional. Just stange...
The thing to remember about today's tomahawk training is that most instructors are going to 'color' their techniques with elements of what their core martial discipline was... it's just natural and human nature. That's what you see in Jim Keatings work...and there is nothing wrong at all with doing that. One just has to know what you are getting. There is really nobody that 'holds the market' on authentic tomahawk methods. Although people will argue with this, there is really no authentic, historical techniques that were grouped into a specific training system. Rodger's Rangers precepts are the closest that anyone comes. Indian war-dances might also fall into that category. Here is the deal, don't let this or that 'system' or approach get in your way of working with and enjoying training with the tomahawk. Take it for what it is worth, use it, or throw it away. I think the jury is still out on the best way to throw a tomahawk. Back when I was working on that book, I did a lot of experimenting with throwing at different ranges (out to about 50 feet). I did not start 'sticking' the hawk till I thought of it as a toss and how gravity acts on that heavy head. Understand of the feel for one or two turns of the hawk before impact is another thing that takes practice. It's basic ballistics I suppose. For me tactical throwing (i.e. move & throw or throw & move) is a lot more interesting than basic target throwing. Practicing this on uneven ground also gets interesting. This approach gets you into estimating range which is really the key on throwing. I saw an interesting video years back when I was going to the School of the Longhunter at Pricketts Fort. It showed some longhunter types in period costume on a course thru the woods.
They would fire the flintlock rifle, then move while drawing the hawk and throwing. They also had a knife target if memory serves.
Well, sorry to jump in here, but I've been doing some research in this now and could not help commenting.

My Best
Dwight
 
Dwight,
Thanks for your insight I am gonna have to look for Cold Steels video. Once when I was a teen I went on one of those "woods walks" with my grandfather. We used percussion and not flint but it was much as you describe. I remember we had to cut a string from an unknown distance with our hawk and stick a rattlesnake that was painted on a tree section with the knife. My uncle and I used to run (okay I'm big we jogged :) )and throw at differnet targets. Brings back memories.......
 
I watched and sent the dvd out a few days ago but this is the first time I've had a chance to write this down.
Let me start off by saying that I have not read any other reviews so if I say something that someone else has already, sorry. I wont talk about the production values as I'm sure every one else has already.

Alot of these moves seem for the most part impractical. I dont think this is a good dvd for a beginer to learn from. It is based on FMA and I think that someone who has studied FMA and is looking to broden their horizons woulde have a good start with this dvd. It may help them to start thinking about how to adapt the skills they already have to the axe, tomahawk, shovel, crow bar, or tire iron.

Two things about the dvd, the axe throwing was worthless, and he says that a 'woodpecker attack' is not useful. This is a lie. If the axe is sharp you should be abel to cause some real bad damage at close range when theres no room to use the full leverege to your advantage.


In closeing if you are skilled in FMA,or some like art form, and want a little help thinking out side the box of the stick and knife, this dvd will probably be of some use. If you are a beginer who wants to learn the art of the axe you should probably go somewhere else.

Thanks FSCjedi for letting me take a part in this.
 
One more thing, a tomahawk or axe can be used to stab with aslong as it has at least a small 'upsweep' to the edge.(extreame example is the norse hawk)
 
My review is going to be short since I'm extremely novice on the subject and so many other good things have been said that I'm not sure I can add anything more of real value.

1. The DVD seemed cheaply made which is fine if all you're looking for is fighting tactics but on an entertainment level it really provides nothing appealing

2. Having no experience with knowing anything about fighting with a tomahawk I found his tactics extremely enlightening but also somewhat difficult to grasp, it seems to me that he assumes that anyone who watches it is familiar with other martial arts, more particularly knife fighting. Not knowing anything about these particular disciplines I found it difficult to grasp some of the concepts he put forth, although it probably wouldn't be too hard to figure out if I actually had someone in front of me sparring with me.

3. Personally I find with martial arts that there are things that look cool and things that work. For instance, karate and kung fu look really cool and are fun to watch but it seems to me that unless you study and practice these disciplines religiously for years you probably won't be terribly effective with them in an actual confrontation. Jiu Jitsu, however, is extremely boring for me to watch but having practiced it even a very small amount I feel comfortable enough that I could effectively execute a Jiu Jitsu move on an opponent in a confrontation. Likewise, the tactics that he showed looked extremely cool but unless I knew the martial arts behind them I'm not sure that I would feel comfortable executing them. Disarming an opponent and using his weapon against him in a real situation, as cool as it would be, seems like a low odds move to me.

Overall it was a nice introductory presentation for me but as a newbie to the world of tomahawk fighting I would have liked to see some more aggressive offensive moves that would diffuse a confrontation quickly in a self defense situation. I was also dissapointed in the throwing section at the end, in his explanation right before it it seemed that they were going to instruct in some throwing techniques but all it showed was him and one other guy throwing about a half dozen weapons each.
 
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