Just Asking. What’s Up With Everything “Bushcraft” Nowadays?

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Arathol said:
Steel matters only to the extent that it makes a serviceable blade, nothing more....
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Sure, I'll hear you out if you're willing to take the time.

Does that apply to all aspects of the knife then, that it's "just serviceable," or is better than "it works" desirable for other things, just not what the blade is made of?

What do you consider serviceable and under what conditions? Any performance expectations, ignoring that geometry, heat trestment, etc. also affect some of these attributes because we're isolating only steel here because your position, that steel matters very little and it's the least important characteristic of a knife is what I find wrong.

Pin material or adhesive are probably the bottom specs for me.
 
bikerector said:
Double down on the agreement. Good. We agree.
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Huh? Not sure if this is a jab at me or not.

If so, I invite you to quote where I said it does not matter in any post I have made in 11 years here.
 
Without going into the history or etymology of the word/phrase I have never really thought about it. I rough/wild camp, work with green wood do all the normal things with knives and like to try different shapes/steels/grinds etc... because I'm curious and love tools and knives and working with them.

I have certainly noticed here in the UK though (and I'm sure elsewhere) makers charging 4-500 for a 4" "bushcraft" knife in 01 or the fact that since certain names have got attached to various brands of knives or Axes the prices rocket. But I guess that's the world we live in.
 
Dav1 said:
I have certainly noticed here in the UK though (and I'm sure elsewhere) makers charging 4-500 for a 4" "bushcraft" knife in 01 or the fact that since certain names have got attached to various brands of knives or Axes the prices rocket. But I guess that's the world we live in.
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Exactly the point I (and others) have been trying to make.

It is Marketing 101 and it creates perceived and inflated value by implying it is something more than what it is, and commands an artificial premium and opens the wallets of the gullible and naïve.

Look, if you like a certain knife - buy it. But not because it is a "bushcraft" knife. There is no such thing.
 
shane45-1911 said:
No, but common sense does.
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www.logicallyfallacious.com

Appeal to Common Sense

Asserting that your conclusion or facts are just “common sense” when, in fact, they are not.We must argue as to why we believe something is common sense if there is any doubt that the belief is not common, rather than just asserting that it is.
www.logicallyfallacious.com www.logicallyfallacious.com
 
Dr Rez said:
Huh? Not sure if this is a jab at me or not.

If so, I invite you to quote where I said it does not matter in any post I have made in 11 years here.
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There's nothing to quote. We are in agreement that knife steel matters when selecting characteristics for a knife because it must be adequate, so at leaat better than bad. Doesn't need to be great, but it can't be crap.

I simply stated that we agree on that by bolding it to emphasize the part I was referring to. Your next statment pointed out that obviously it matters. I pointed out that we still agree.

I never even attempted to assert anything else. I never said anything about geometry or blade design, those were topics you added in reponse to my response to Arothol, who stated blade steel mattered "very little" and is the lowest priority if consideration when selecting a knife for yourself.

My only point has been that knife steel matters more than "very little" when selecting a knife. Even non-knife nuts care if it's stainless or not. It was a very simple thing to point to without digging into deeper, drawnout discussions about how stain resistant it is, how good the edge retention is, how tough it is, how well it resists deformation, how easy it is to work with, and other such discussions. I was trying to make it simple, and apparently it was too simple.
 
Dr Rez said:
www.logicallyfallacious.com

Appeal to Common Sense

Asserting that your conclusion or facts are just “common sense” when, in fact, they are not.We must argue as to why we believe something is common sense if there is any doubt that the belief is not common, rather than just asserting that it is.
www.logicallyfallacious.com www.logicallyfallacious.com
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You obviously fall into the camp of "I bought a knife, because it was advertised as a bushcraft tool."

Just admit it and stop trying to defend your naivety.

ANY knife can be a bushcraft knife - there is no fallacy in that assertion.
 
bikerector said:
Sure, I'll hear you out if you're willing to take the time.

Does that apply to all aspects of the knife then, that it's "just serviceable," or is better than "it works" desirable for other things, just not what the blade is made of?

What do you consider serviceable and under what conditions? Any performance expectations, ignoring that geometry, heat trestment, etc. also affect some of these attributes because we're isolating only steel here because your position, that steel matters very little and it's the least important characteristic of a knife is what I find wrong.

Pin material or adhesive are probably the bottom specs for me.
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Serviceable means it will be able to do what you want it to do when you need to do it. Anything capable of taking a good edge that can be easily restored with minimal effort. No more, no less. Simple carbon steel as has been used for centuries is just fine. It doesn't need to be the latest super steel, and you need to accept the fact that the knife might get damaged or broken or even...
4lAle1bt.jpg
.....dirty.
 
bikerector said:
That's just not true. If that were the case, we would be using any steel available, and we don't. Even you've gotta admit there's a big difference between simple carbon steels and stainless steels, to keep this conversation very basic.
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Yes, it is true.

When choosing which knife you want to bring into the woods to mess around with, this is a suggestion for a list of priorities:

1: ergonomics
2: edge geometry
3: grind
4: heat treat
5: steel choice ( choose any steel between 420HC and let's say Magnacut, any you will have a perfectly good knife. Provided the heat treat checks out)

I would MUCH rather bring a comfortable knife in O1, than an uncomfortable knife in Magnacut.

Keep in mind, the only people on the world, for whom steel choice matters just a little bit, are Bladeforum members.
 
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Rasmus80 said:
Yes, it is true.

When choosing which knife you want to bring into the woods to mess around with, this is a suggestion for a list of priorities:

1: ergonomics
2: edge geometry
3: grind
4: heat treat
5: steel choice ( choose any steel between 420HC and let's say Magnacut, any you will have a perfectly good knife. Provided the heat treat checks out)

I would MUCH rather bring a comfortable knife in O1, than an uncomfortable knife in Magnacut.
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I agree but I’d swap the placement of grind and heat treat. Imo, heat treatment is more important than grind. I’d take a well heat treated knife in any grind before I took a poorly heat treated knife in my preferred grind.

But apart from that, I agree with your priority ranking.
 
Rasmus80 said:
Yes, it is true.

When choosing which knife you want to bring into the woods to mess around with, this is a suggestion for a list of priorities:

1: ergonomics
2: edge geometry
3: grind
4: heat treat
5: steel choice ( choose any steel between 420HC and let's say Magnacut, any you will have a perfectly good knife. Provided the heat treat checks out)

I would MUCH rather bring a comfortable knife in O1, than an uncomfortable knife in Magnacut.

Keep in mind, the only people on the world, for whom steel choice matters just a little bit, are Bladeforum members.
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Those are the only 5 things you consider? No sheath or handle materials? Locking mechanism? Fit and finish?

And why not ergonomics AND a better steel?

I don't understand wht steel gets the special qualifier and while the rest don't. Steel's last as long as it's at least "this" good, then I don't cae anymore. Can't we say thr same for the rest? Like, I don't want hot spots and anything better doesn't matter anymore?
 
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Arathol said:
Simple carbon steel as has been used for centuries is just fine.
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This is really the answer I figured you were getting at, just not a fan of some technology improvements. That's fine, more for me.
 
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bikerector said:
This is really the answer I figured you were getting at, just not a fan of some technology improvements. That's fine, more for me.

Well, the education wasn't useful but I'm sure glad you almost tried to be nice about it.
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While I agree with what you are saying for the most part no need to be condescending to the guy. We are all on here because of our love for knives and can disagree without being rude.
 
bikerector said:
Those are the only 5 things you consider? No sheath or handle materials? Locking mechanism? Fit and finish?

And why not ergonomics AND a better steel?

I don't understand wht steel gets the special qualifier and while the rest don't. Steel's last as long as it's at least "this" good, then I don't cae anymore. Can't we say thr same for the rest? Like, I don't want hot spots and anything better doesn't matter anymore?
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You can add a multitude of considerations to that list. As long as "steel choice" comes last.:p
Well, maybe fit and finish is less important.
 
Dr Rez said:
While I agree with what you are saying for the most part no need to be condescending to the guy. We are all on here because of our love for knives and can disagree without being rude.
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I agree, and I was just coming back to edit my post. I should have just ignored it. Clearly his view on life varies greatly from mine.

I'm not a subscriber to "this is how we've always done it" because it ignores too many possibilities for improvement, like acting like a jerk because that is my tendancy, when I don't need to.
 
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