Just need to vent a little :grumpy:

I would be in for that if I had a way to dispose of knives that I don't want. Unfortunately I can't ship out knives because of some arbitrary policies in our local airport.

But I'd say that that is a good idea. Just doesn't work for me.
 
Doughnut said:
Now, the way RevDevil describes his Steel Head club is all sprint runs. I think everyone else is thinking only the sprints that involve an alternate steel than the normal production model.

Either one will work, but which do people prefer?
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I'd definitely prefer the latter option (in bold). As I mentioned above, what interests me about many sprint runs is the new/premium steels, not the fact that they're sprint runs per se.
 
The problem as I see it:

If you say it will be a 600 piece run, speculators will buy up as many as they can to resell at a profit based on that low number, and you have unfilled pre-orders. If you produce another 600 pieces to fill the unmet pre-orders, it is no longer a 600 piece run, which means you have a lot of angry customers because you lied about the numbers and diluted the value of everyone's knife, collectors and speculators alike.

If you say it will be a 1200 piece run, the speculators figure it will be too common to bother investing in since they won't be able to make a huge profit on each piece, and you end up stuck with excess inventory. The customers are happy because they get to buy them cheap when you clear them out at a loss to get rid of them, until you go bankrupt. Then they're unhappy because you won't be making any more knives.

Speculators are a fact of life. Is it fair that some people have more money available for knife purchases than others? Maybe not, but I find the current system preferable to the alternatives, and I've got shallow pockets. How can you solve the problem? You can't. Even if Sprint Runs were sold exclusively through the SFO and limited to one per customer, people will find a way to buy extras. I've seen it happen with a couple of the Mules.
 
Sal Glesser said:
We have to determine how many we're planning to make when we order steel. Often 9-10 months before delivery.

sal
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The idea that I have to get this now, or I will never have another chance, drives the speculative market. If people know they may have another opportunity to get the sprint, even if it's a year out, that would put a big damper on the speculation. Simply reserving the right to do another run, if warranted by demand, would make speculating riskier, and less attractive.
 
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RevDevil said:
I would not think that the normal production models really go away. They just get produced in batches according to scheduled factory time, at least this is the impression I've gotten from reading here and there. Sprints though, once they are gone, that is it.

Japanese produced Spyderco knives are made from Japanese steel, importing US steel would be avery time consuming and expensive endeavor. The exporting of japanese steel is also complicated, basically it isn't done on a large scale. Taiwan though seems to be easier to deal with as far as exporting steel and other materials to them, this can be seen reflected in the cost of the finished products.
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No, I mean if we are going to make a specific collector's club, we need to define what it includes. A "Steel Head" collector's club I think would include only the sprints that have a non-production version steel. If a Persian is made with VG-10 and there is a Sprint with VG-10, I think it would not be part of a "Steel Head" collector's club because if they want it, they can just buy a production version.
 
1200+ Knives for sprint run would be very very nice. However, id raise or lower that number depending on how well the production version of the knife sold. The regular Paramilitary 2 for a long time was a hard knife to find so raising the amount of possible sprints past 1200 knives would make a lot of people who enjoy using Spydercos happy, rather than just the few people who just managed to get one. I too am sick of scrambling for the sprint runs that come out because some people don't even get a chance on getting one.
 
Doughnut said:
No, I mean if we are going to make a specific collector's club, we need to define what it includes. A "Steel Head" collector's club I think would include only the sprints that have a non-production version steel. If a Persian is made with VG-10 and there is a Sprint with VG-10, I think it would not be part of a "Steel Head" collector's club because if they want it, they can just buy a production version.
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That makes sense. I did misunderstand your post. I was reading a little too much and not comprehending enough. That definition of the Steel Head Club is more accurate.
Thanks.
 
I guess I'm in the minority in that I don't usually buy a knife I won't use so I tend to use the sprint run knives.(I will admit to buying one of the Damascus Delicas though.) I do find it disappointing that I can't always find the sprint runs I'm interested in trying.

I didn't get the carpenter steel Paramilitary but I did get the carbon fiber one. I carry it a good bit and love it. Naturally I now want to try the carpenter steel but can't find it for a reasonable price.

Perhaps if people wouldn't buy from the speculators then the prices would come down and the problem would solve itself but I know that won't happen.

I'm not sure how the club would function but I think a preorder directly from the Spyderco forum might work. Spyderco could then add some computed additional knives for other dealers and call it a day. Hopefully that would cut down any extra stock.
 
Doughnut said:
That's interesting, I've been watching the Blue Manix 2 sales, and they were selling for $250 ish for a while. Recently they've been going for $200-225 and I think sometimes even less than that.

What is a reasonable price?

Along with your other questions, couldn't you buy enough for a double run and based on how many sell do a second run of the first knife or do a run of a different knife?

Does Spyderco in golden buy steel for the Japan facilities or does Japan buy their own steel? (I know they only use Japanese steel.)
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If you consider that they were initially sold for $124, and it's S30V not some exotic steel, then even 200 does not sound reasonable considering what you get. A fine product nonetheless, but $180 tops is what i would say is reasonable, that is my opinion however.

The problem with the sprint runs and pre-orders is that some dealers take way to many pre-orders for a knife, and in the end many people end up empty handed.
 
I pre ordered mine from knifecenter Nov. 20th. I still havnt recieved it but got one from the exchange for 225. Its a awesome steel and at 225 its a steal.
 
spydusse said:
I pre ordered mine from knifecenter Nov. 20th. I still havnt recieved it but got one from the exchange for 225. Its a awesome steel and at 225 its a steal.
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Yes but wouldn't you like to get it at closer to dealer price when they were first released?
 
Yes i would have but like this thread shows there is no perfect solution.I learned my lesson and next time will hit pre order the first day it is up.Now back to the real problem ......who the hell chose this color grey?? And can I buy black scales!?
 
I am thinking orange military. Lots of people got upset but lots of people got to buy, carry, and use it.

Did Spyderco lose money on the orange millie?
 
singularity35 said:
I am thinking orange military. Lots of people got upset but lots of people got to buy, carry, and use it.

Did Spyderco lose money on the orange millie?
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I can't speak for Sal with any certainty, but I'm going to guess that even if they didn't lose money on it he and Spyderco wouldn't be keen to turn what happened with the Orange Military -- which, as you said, had the result that "lots of people got upset" -- into regular practice. Seems like the very opposite of what Spyderco is about.
 
spydusse said:
who the hell chose this color grey?? And can I buy black scales!?
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Hi Spydusse,

I guess I'm the culprit that chose to use gray G-10. Sorry if it's not working out for you, my bad. We don't offer scales. I guess you don't like the "used hard" look? There are limited numbers in colors for G-10 and we wanted to use a different color for differentiation. Didn't occur to me that it would get really dirty. Please let us know if you find something that cleans it well.

Hi Singularity, I don't know that we lost money on the orange Military, but there was inventory for longer than we like for a sprint. We yielded to the requests for more and it turned out to be a headache. I'm glad that those that wanted one, got one, but we don't like making changes like that. We try to be consistent in our production.

sal
 
Not wanting to derail this thread, but since the gray G-10 is getting a lot of flack, I'd just like to mention that I love it on my 20CP Para 2 (and S110V Strider SnG, for that matter). I especially like the "used hard" look that Sal mentioned -- as I've said elsewhere, it gives the knife character. :D
 
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Sal Glesser said:
Hi Singularity, I don't know that we lost money on the orange Military, but there was inventory for longer than we like for a sprint. We yielded to the requests for more and it turned out to be a headache. I'm glad that those that wanted one, got one, but we don't like making changes like that. We try to be consistent in our production.

sal
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Thanks for the answer Sal. I don't really want something that will eventually be bad for Spyderco. I guess you will either find an innovative solution like you guys always do or if the current system is the best that can be managed, then we will have to make do. And thanks for the fine knives that you keep turning out.
 
It's been pretty easy for me to pick out the sprints that are going to be big sellers. They are going to be super premium steels, runs of very popular models in different colors, etc. Mostly the very high performance, or new, talked up steels. 20CP was a no brainer as it was talked about since the CTS steel information was released by Carpenter. The buzz about it was pretty consistent since then. Reading this and planning for an extra hundred or two could really help. The B75 steel ( BG42 analog) will be similar and sell well.

I've had to put pre orders in as soon as I hear about these with dealers I've developed realationships with to stand any chance of getting one. Sometimes it takes two dealers to get one. If the second one comes up as well, selling it hopefully not at scalping prices is an option.

Anyway, reading and predicting demand is about all Spyderco can do.

Unless there is a reason I'm unaware of running a sprint of S90V of less than 600 shouldn't really be considered. It causes too much discord from people not getting one.
 
Sal,
Would you consider creating a Steelhead Club? Or is that just out of the question.

@ Spydusse
A toothbrush, a few drops of Dawn dishsoap and some warm water can clean up that G10 pretty quick. If it really is that much of a PITA, I recommend you dye the handles with some Rit Dye. The Spyderco factory forum has several threads explaing how this can be done. Granted it was first done on FRN, but G10 was also successful. Give it a try.

@ The Mastiff
I agree with anything being produced in the future with S90V would be nice to have a few extra available. The new B75 steel is going to fly out of the stores, I know that I will be looking for at least 2 of those knives (the main user and the spare). That next Military in CTS-XHP is also going to fly off the shelves. It's too good to just sit there for any length of time.
 
Thanks for the response Sal.
I was thinking about the rit dye . The only thing that's keeping me from doing that is the worry of messing up the friction fit of the laynard hole. I'm guessing the dirty look annoying me will fade over time . Similar to that first good scratch you put on a new blade....devastation, annoying stairs in different lighting and finally acceptance.
 
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