just out of curiosity

MustardMan said:
I'd be happy selling organs to finance my INFI habit.
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I hear you man. :)

I am just tired and fed up with all the BS that goes on these days in the work place. :rolleyes:

When you are in Management it's like being a babysitter and I never really liked it, but I am very good at it and always ended up back in it.

The problem is that there is always someone with a big head that's on a power trip and wants to make life harder for the people under them.
 
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Stay positive MM! You are obviously a smart guy. You'll land on your feet and be just fine. Your future career may or may not be in the field you have studied. I'm sure that sounds like sacrilege right now... but think about it. Find something that makes you happy.

I have a degree in International Economics. My current career has absolutely nothing to do with it. Keep that in mind. Be flexible. The times require it. :thumbup: Good luck!
 
MustardMan said:
Heh. Not really.


The typical academic career path is driven by research. Purely teaching focused jobs generally make less than 50k a year. Now, I could live on that, but we're talking about spending more than a decade in college to work long weeks, spend all your free time grading, and make what people who chose a sane major can make with a bachelor's degree. In fact, a BS in physics is likely to net you more in an industry job than a teaching-focused job with a PhD. How messed up is that?


A typical research focused academic job in physics gets 300+ applications. At least a hundred of those will have multiple years of postdoctoral research experience. A typical postdoc pays about the same as a middle manager at a grocery store. So, to get one of the high paying university jobs in physics, you have to do a four year undergrad, typically five to seven years as a PhD student, then at least two years, and probably more like 4-6 as a postdoc.

So now you're 35 years old, and have been living on a pittance since you were 18, and likely have a large pile of student loans to pay off. Finally, after working 60+ hour weeks for terrible money, for a decade and a half, you are potentially within the top 100 applicants to a position. If you are incredibly lucky, and have chosen quality postdoctoral assignments and an excellent PhD advisor, you might have enough good publications and outstanding letters of recommendation to stand out from those 100 applicants enough to be one of the 5-10 invited for an interview. After the interview, you get to look forward to two to three months to wait to find out whether you have a job.


Oh, Have I mentioned that the typical job application process for a university professor in the hard sciences lasts roughly 8-10 months? So if you DON'T get a job, you get to enjoy the fact that you waited almost a year to find out, and you get to try it all over again next year.






Remember I said I ran screaming away from academia? There is a reason. To steal a quote from a well known astrophysicist - "I've known more people whose lives were ruined by getting a PhD in physics than drugs"
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I love MM's witty and pithy way of describing this ....:D:D:D ... and good luck in finding an Industry placement...

I am at the end of a sabatical I took for shooting in the F Class (Long Range Rifle with telescopic sights ) World Championships where I was the Vice Captain for our team. Fortunately we won it and also the European Championships which makes the time off worthwhile but it does'nt have prize money etc that can pay the bills.....

My background is ex-military and then qualified as a lawyer ... I specialised in Company/Commercial work .... mainly Mergers and Acquisitions and PFI Projects but with the credit crunch/recession .... work in this sector has mainly dried up .....

I am presently getting by with a part time Military role and am trying to look into specialising in a new area of law for private security companies doing their contract work for things like Maritime Asset Protection or Oil and Gas facility protection .... it's in it's infancy though .... and am also considering applying for a Sec 5 Firearms Dealers License to do the logistic side of things to move weapons around for the same clients ....

Anyway ... we will see how it goes .... if it were not for my divorce the "capital" needed would'nt be an issue ... even lawyers get scr**wed by divorce lawyers :D:D:D

Like many here in their mid 40's I am finding that you have to do something yourself as being hired is harder to acheive as you get older .... but my previous speciality has a need for the "large" firm structure and they are laying off people not hiring ..... hence the new "direction" .... so good luck to all who are looking for work :thumbup:
 
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fitzOdaggers said:
What a coincidence... i am a driver for a hotel in Tempe.... and a student at ASU:)
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That's awesome! I work at a resort over in Scottsdale, but I live right by Tempe, my girlfriend actually is an art major over at ASU. What year are you?
 
kdstrick said:
Stay positive MM! You are obviously a smart guy. You'll land on your feet and be just fine. Your future career may or may not be in the field you have studied. I'm sure that sounds like sacrilege right now... but think about it. Find something that makes you happy.

I have a degree in International Economics. My current career has absolutely nothing to do with it. Keep that in mind. Be flexible. The times require it. :thumbup: Good luck!
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I actually am not worried at all - I've got a lot of different good career prospects. I just have a vendetta against the academic research system, after being told for more than ten years about how great it is to be a professor, and only recently having anyone break the cone of silence and tell me just how miserable it is to actually try to land one of those jobs.

I'll be a lot happier outside of academia, and in fact, one of my happiest moments recently was when I walked in to the lab of my academic research postdoc and said "take this job and shove it!" That felt gooooooood, bad economy or not :D :thumbup:
 
Lil' Foo said:
ASU Alumni here too. :thumbup: :)
Class of 91.


.
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Look all the AZ love!!

Wayne, AZ to MA:eek:!?! WTF bro?? Are you nutz!? My wife is a MA transplant (no accent, thank gawd), and I'm from Detroit. We never want to leave AZ...

But to stay on topic.... I work at a marketing firm in Phoenix. My first house which is a rental property now is in Tempe, a 10 minutes drive from ASU, FUN times there:D
 
Very diverse group.

I was a pharmaceutical rep for over four years. Over 3,000 of us were laid off last year.

So, I started a healthcare communications business with my cousins who are physicians.


We are just now launching in the Central Washington area. So far, so good.

Jack Shen and Arcli9ht could probably appreciate the need to improve communications within a medical community.
 
Longknife3 said:
Look all the AZ love!!

Wayne, AZ to MA:eek:!?! WTF bro?? Are you nutz!? My wife is a MA transplant (no accent, thank gawd), and I'm from Detroit. We never want to leave AZ...

But to stay on topic.... I work at a marketing firm in Phoenix. My first house which is a rental property now is in Tempe, a 10 minutes drive from ASU, FUN times there:D
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:p :D

I grew up in the north east...
The 5 years in AZ were great, but I think it was Christmas time in year 5
that I saw a cactus decorated in chilipepper lights.
It was about then I really missed the north east. :o

Now that I've been back up here for 18 years... :foot: :eek: :D


Probably just my winter blues, itching for some good ol' spring!

.
 
MustardMan said:
nfortunately, I'm limited to the Denver area right now, and in fact will be leaving to drive out there on Friday. Well, not really unfortunately, my fiance has an awesome job lined up out there, and I love the area. But it does limit my choices, and physics ain't exactly the easiest career to just find a job wherever you feel like it.
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Believe me, I grew up in Colorado Springs and understand the draw of the region. Have you looked at the NREL? I have no idea if they have openings, but many years ago, back when they were just SERI, it was a pretty cool place. http://www.nrel.gov/

MustardMan said:
20 years ago, academia was a wonderful place to work, with lots of freedom to make decent money while exploring topics you genuinely enjoy.
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I read an interesting op-ed piece the other day that implied this was due to "the decade of greed" and the morals-sucking maw that Wall Street became, luring people out of Academia and into high-paying business ventures. The best of the best used to teach. Now they jockey for an eye-popping IPO and their first million.
 
finding work in Denver-metro/front range, and especially anywhere near Summit County, is especially competitive and difficult for obvious reasons. many people want to live and work here, but (generally) only those who work extra hard at finding it and keeping it (and are great at what they do and interview well and so on) do so, IMO.

expect it to take 2-3x as long as you're used to, and that every professional job in desirable areas may be 5x more competitive than you're used to. and whatever you do - network, network, network... you'll need inside/local info and leads so work whatever professional organizations and such you have in your career field.

these are just opinions, of course, but they're pretty informed - after leaving a perfectly great job in Austin and moving here myself without first securing a great job, and having several friends of various vocations that've had similar experiences when relocating here and needing to work and support themselves (and maybe families).

nothing revolutionary, but I found these things are especially important here in CO...

it's an amazing place to live, but most things are a bit more difficult... a worthy cost IMO.

also, be aware - many many people from all over the world take lower/easier jobs just to work and live here, so there's a disproportionate amount of competition sometimes, even for easy/lesser jobs. it's crazy, like (and I'm making this up for the sake of conversation) having ex VPs and PhDs applying for Starbucks gigs... my point, I guess, is that assume your competition is awesome and plan/act accordingly. nearly everyone wants to live here...
 
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Lil' Foo said:
:p :D

I grew up in the north east...
The 5 years in AZ were great, but I think it was Christmas time in year 5
that I saw a cactus decorated in chilipepper lights.
It was about then I really missed the north east. :o

Now that I've been back up here for 18 years... :foot: :eek: :D


Probably just my winter blues, itching for some good ol' spring!

.
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I hear you brother!! When my wife and I visit her family back in MA or mine in Detroit in the spring and fall the trees and color changes always pull my heart strings. But being the slacker I am, I hate shoveling snow and raking leaves:o:D
 
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