Knife locks: Strength, Reliability and Spine Whack tests

Mind telling us what models failed?

I don't have a dog in this fight but I don't think anyone was being hostile. Orthogonal could have possibly worded his reply better but I don't think it was meant to be negative just that the knife has a problem and would be fixed by the company. Maybe he was being tongue in cheek or even a smartass but didn't sound like he was putting you down to me.

Also I don't think a blanket statement that all AXIS locks are bad is correct or fair. There are lots of knives out there using that lock and they wouldn't be as popular as they are if they had some sort of "design flaw."

And I'm also curious what you use your knives for? Are you a fireman or participate in some sort of rescue duties? I wish I had more reason to push my knives hard.
 
I live in a very rural area, think middle of nowhere. A few anecdotes to get my point across three weeks ago my kids were confronted by a black bear while playing in the local park, 6 months ago all the parents of the kids at the village school were called to come pick up their kids as there were two bears on school property and it was unsafe for the kids to be there. Believe it or not the Ministry of Natural Resources and the police refused to deal with the bears. I have been confronted by Coyotes while putting my garbage out in the morning and many pets have gone missing in the area the past year. I spend a lot of time in the woods with my kids 5 and 10 years old and am volunteer search and rescue in the area. My knives MUST be reliable. "Design flaw" was a poor choice of words, I will admit that, but I have no patience for aggressive internet know-it-alls. Again, I like Benchmade. Don't know how else to say it. I think that someone who thinks his new Rukus is the Cat's Ass doesn't like to hear that it may be flawed. "MAY" be flawed (probably put my foot in it again):rolleyes:
 
Both Axis lock springs and liner lock/frame lock are never at rest. They just present less spring pressure in the deployed position.
 
I prefer a snipe-tap test, rather than a full-force spine-whack. I tap about as hard as you would if you were setting a nail into some wood.

People don't realize how little metal is actually involved in the contact of some lock types. When you stop to consider that a typical liner lock or frame lock, especially production models with few exceptions (Sebenza, Hinderer as two) then you realize just how quick and easy it can be to indent the lock contact right quick if you get carried away with it. Oh believe me I've heard the arguments that come. "I have spine whacked my liner lock and it never hurt a thing." Believe that if you want. The fact is the liner lock is made to self adjust from wear so what typically happens is after its indented it will move in further because now it can. So in effect it can and often does lead to premature/faster wear. Some have written me asking why the lock binds so terribly on some models. I've had some that did this also. Most all of em contact about this way here with very little lock actually physically contacting the blade. So that small foot print digs in. Guys say they noticed after whacking it no longer stuck. I say of course not. Its been indented in now and can't wear in a normal way.

Anyway, thinner liner locks can be affected a lot more obviously from severe sudden shock but when its repeated at regular intervals its really just setting your knife up for repair needs in my opinion.

Do what you want though. No one can tell you what to do or how to treat your own property. Here is the link to a pic I snapped showing a typical contact on most production and a lot of custom liner and frame locks. It is my hope that this will visually aid some of you into thinking twice before beating the crap out of your folder lock next time you go to do it. If not, hey I tried!
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=135734&d=1245285404

This is what it looks like when opened but you can't see it of course on most folders both due to the curvature of the lock contact which blocks light and also since there is a scale over it on liner locks. Oh and by the way. This is a technically correct contact. There is nothing wrong with this at all. Its how they are done. Everyone does them this way to some degree of a plus or minus for contact surface area with the only difference being how much actual lock comes into contact with the blade from one to another. Thats basically what you pay more for in a higher quality folder I think, like the production Gen III XM-18 by Rick Hinderer or the Sebenza which both have a bigger foot print contact that wears more evenly, lasts longer, sticks less and of course costs you more to get, as it should. It takes extra planning, effort and time to make a folder so it functions and wears the way these do so therefore you pay various amounts more for it depending as well as suffer public demand issues at times also. Now not all are done quite this well granted, and I won't kid you some kind of do it well sometimes and with others of the same model well, they are not as consistent but the thing is either way its still a correct lock that is solid.

I think based on my own experiements that mainly the diff is how long the lock would wear before crossing the tang and how bad it binds and sticks when locked up. This is particularly true on some models that require a good long break in when new. I'm sure everyone here has had at least one liner or frame lock folder that stuck and binded up terribly needing the number two lead pencil trick. Some just hit the blade pretty much in such a way as to make it stick in there and wedge really bad until the lock wears to make itself mate up correctly. There is not substitute or better way to break a lock in than by "normal use" but if one sticks really bad I'd say send it back to the manufacturer or maker before attempting to fix it yourself particularly if your fix is beating the snot out of it on a table top or board spine whacking it. :D

OK. I've said my peace. Wasn't going to but finally could not resist just one post and thats all I'm making here. This one has been beat to death countless times already anyways.

STR
 
When I spine whack my liner locks I do the test against my kneecap, this will tell you how much force I am using, when it starts to hurt and the lock holds-pass. I take the test a little further with 'stronger' locks. Against a soft pine fencepost hard enough to leave 1/16" indentations in the wood about 5 times provided there is no travel in the mechanism or odd noises. When the infamous 'yobboslock' was repaired I did 20 hits w/six inch travel and not 1 millimeter of movement. Yes this was excessive but I was pissed off and honestly just felt like experimenting. The adjustment of the omega springs was a success and restored my trust (mostly;)) in this particular lock.
 
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