Knife Values / Prices

R

rwn2000

Joined
Jan 6, 2003
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I am doing my first knife show September 21. Right now it looks like I will have at least 20 knives completed, maybe closer to 30, depending on how productive the next 3 weeks are. I have sold several knives in the exchange here and always just "guessed" at an asking price. I just looked at a bunch of fixed blades in the exchange to get an idea of what other makers charge for similar knives and for 6 inch to 8 inch fixed blades there is a wide range from $80 to $150+. So I am asking for advice on pricing my knives. I am not going to post pics of specific knives unless Stacy says it is okay.

A lot of what I make are 6 to 8 inch working grade full tang knives out of 1084 or O-1, hand sanded blades to 1500 grit, simple leather sheaths, with different handle materials. If I have 2 similar 7 inch Nesmuk style blades but one has micarta scales and the other has stabilized wood scales, how much should I charge for the stabilized wood one if I think the micarta one is $85.00? And what about the same sized blade with a hidden tang , stainless guard, stabilized wood?

Any advice is appreciated.

Randy
 
I also struggle with this same thing. Especially as an unknown maker it's very hard for me to determine where to be in price range so that I can sell the knives and not have to sit on them, but not lose money or work for free in the process.
 
I think the challenge comes when we have to judge fit and finish from a small picture on the Internet. To get the better pricing, you need to develop a reputation for good work. Fit and finish separates the great knives from the good knives. Repeatable results ie hardness testing is also important. I am not at a point where I am selling yet. But will likely be in the next 3-6 months. I think about this a lot. I have also learned with other hobby businesses that the majority of people want the best price, and don't know the value of quality. The better you make a knife, the fewer the number of people who are willing to pay what it is really worth.
 
Willie71 said:
I think the challenge comes when we have to judge fit and finish from a small picture on the Internet. To get the better pricing, you need to develop a reputation for good work. Fit and finish separates the great knives from the good knives. Repeatable results ie hardness testing is also important. I am not at a point where I am selling yet. But will likely be in the next 3-6 months. I think about this a lot. I have also learned with other hobby businesses that the majority of people want the best price, and don't know the value of quality. The better you make a knife, the fewer the number of people who are willing to pay what it is really worth.
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My fit and finish is as good as I can get it: no visible glue lines, no proud pins or tang, grind lines as even and sharp as I can get them. My plunge lines are not "Nick Wheeler perfect" and probably never will be but they have improved a lot since I started using a Bruce Bump file guide on them. But i know what you mean, still hard to judge from a pic.

thanks for the comments,

Randy
 
One maker used to do a quick walk around to some of the other sale tables to see what others were charging before he put his price tags on. Frank
 
Randy- if you ever get this figured out, please let me know! :eek: ;)

Trying to come up with a base price for our knives, based on what other guys are charging... doesn't usually end up working very well. But I think we ALL do it.

We usually ask our fellow makers too... which is kind of funny because I think knifemaking must be one of the only crafts where a guy asks his market competition for pricing advice. Ironically though, most of us really do try to give our friends an honest answer. :)

There are very few guys that don't put in a lot of time, blood, sweat, and tears before they can start charging what is a fair price. Of course the internet has sped that up (or even completely removed it from a handful of guys path! :eek:).

I think the easiest approach is to mark them on the lower side and sell them all, so that you get as many of your knives in peoples hands as you can. But don't GIVE them away.

I remember the 4th show I went to--- I had an ATS-34 full tang hunter, Bos heat treat, hand sanded to a super clean 600X, 416 dovetailed bolsters, black micarta handle, and a pouch sheath. I had $90 on it. One guy came and picked it up, looked at it from every conceivable angle, and set it back down. He looked at me and said, "If that knife was $250, I'd buy it right now."

I really didn't even know what to say to that. My Dad was with me, and he chuckled and asked the guy why. He said, "Because a knife that looks that nice, but at that price... I can't help but feel there's something wrong with it."

And he was dead serious. I thought it was a silly cop-out at the time... but fast forward quite a few years to when my hunters were selling for $300, and he started buying from me. ;) :)

One bit of advice, I wouldn't hand sand the blades to 1500X. For the demographic you're targeting, most of those folks won't care how long it took you to hand sand a blade to a pristine 1500X. If you can lay down a SUPER clean 320X finish, it will look fantastic, take you significantly less time, and leave a finish that is super nice, but not so fine that people will be afraid to use them. Just my $0.02 :)

Best of luck at your show!!!! :)
 
Thanks, Nick. That makes sense on pricing them on the low side and getting them out there, hoping for repeat customers or word-of-mouth advertising later. That is kind of how I approached selling here on the exchange.

Good advice on the hand sanding. I don't take all of my knives to 1500 grit, just the fancier ones. I stop at 800 grit on a lot of my working knives and sand all of the grits in the same direction, giving an even scratch pattern. And you're right, that does save a lot of time and still looks good on a user.

thanks

randy
 
I'm right up the road from you. I've been to quite a few knife shows, I've looked at a lot of people's work and I have a very critical eye. If you want someone to critique (judge) your work you can bring it over and I'd be happy to give you my opinion.
 
Thanks, Nathan. I would really appreciate that. I stopped by there one day to pick up one of your radius platens so I knew you were close. I will PM you my number. Thanks again

Randy
 
I say that when you are just starting out but your knives are passable..price and sell them so that they move. Sell them and buy more materials to make more knives. Eventually you will reach a good price point. But practice is what everyone here needs including the very best makers. If you can't buy materials for future knives..you can't make better knives...simple as that.
 
If it sells fast, it's priced too low. If it doesn't sell at all, it's priced too high.
 
Right now the way I price mine is by factoring in all costs then adding A small portion for time. For me currently its more important to get knives in people's hands than it is to make a bunch of money. If I can sell a knife for enough to buy materials for another 1.5 knives I am pretty happy. That being said, I may be a bit low considering the last guy who came to pick up a knife left with three. However it's easy enough to increase price as demand grows for future knives it's a lot harder to drop prices after you have quoted a potential buyer and they say its too high
 
Great feedback on this one, Thanks Nick and all.
Know your audience. Like the tip on how fine to finish it, there are lots of things that buyers simply don't care about.

It takes a while, but the people who come by will let you know what they like if you engage them in conversation.

One really helpful thing is to find something fairly easy to make that sells- it's good for confidence, and gives your budget a little cushion.
You can get really efficient at making something if you're making fifty- it's the one off things that are time consuming...and great fun.
Fortunately, no matter how good you get, there's always another mountain to climb.
 
rwn2000 said:
Thanks, Nathan. I would really appreciate that. I stopped by there one day to pick up one of your radius platens so I knew you were close. I will PM you my number. Thanks again

Randy
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That will be good. I'm pretty much always here and the dogs don't bite (much) so come on by when it suits you. I look forward to it.
 
Nick Wheeler, your comment on how high a grit to polish is spot on. I have several blades I am working on made from CPM S30V. I took them to 320 before sending them to Peters for heat treat, with the intention of sanding them up to 600 grit when they came back. Bad idea. I have literally put 5 hours of hand sanding into one blade having to start back down at 220, and then 320. I am still going to take this one up to 600, but I have a long way to go. The 320 does look really good, but I want this knife to be a show piece. I cannot be spending this kind of time ha sanding blades or I'll never get them done. 320 is more then sufficient for a knife that people are going to use.
 
NickWheeler said:
One bit of advice, I wouldn't hand sand the blades to 1500X. For the demographic you're targeting, most of those folks won't care how long it took you to hand sand a blade to a pristine 1500X. If you can lay down a SUPER clean 320X finish, it will look fantastic, take you significantly less time, and leave a finish that is super nice, but not so fine that people will be afraid to use them. Just my $0.02 :)

Best of luck at your show!!!! :)
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I have never felt comfortable handling a blade that is highly polished. They make me paranoid. It's just a terrible feeling loving a knife and wanting to use it but being too afraid to mar the finish for said love of knife. Thanks for validating my paranoia- I'll skip the high polish. :)
 
I have ZERO experience in pricing knives but being an insurance adjuster, I have a lot of experience in estimating and negotiating pricing.

I really like the link the Jason Fry posted because it is a very practical way to go about it.

Bringing the auto damage perspective into it, you need to estimate the number of man hours that goes into the knife. You need to figure out how much is an hour of your time worth. When you are figuring hours, you need to put it in the perspective of being an average experienced knife maker. If an average, experienced knife maker can grind a blade in 30 minutes, a world class master knife maker can do it in 20 minutes (I'm pulling these numbers out of the air because I'm not a knife maker) and it takes you 45 minutes to do it, you should use the 30 minute figure at the hourly rate you feel is fair. This way, as you get better and faster, you make more money per hour you put into knife making without having to raise prices because you are increasing your output.

This is how we do it in the auto repair business. When you are estimating the number of repair hours, you figure how long it would take a competent, experienced tech to do the work. If the tech is inexperienced and it takes him longer, that is the price he pays for being inexperienced. If the tech is a master at his craft and can do it faster, that is a bonus to him for his skill and experience but the average tech should take the amount of time estimated.

Then when you are ready you can figure in for all of the additional fit and finish stuff that raises the bar in quality and price. In my industry, some shops will go the extra mile for a quality job and get paid summarily for it.

I'm not sure if this helps any, I was just thinking of the number of parallels between the two businesses.
 
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