Knives Made in China thoughts?

No problems with knives made in China, they just have to do a better job of quality control. I especially like the collaborations between big manufacturers and custom knife makers, if it gets the designs out there for a lower purchase point- I'm all for that.

Unsolicited knock-offs on the other hand, that's another issue- won't support that.
 
A few Rough Rider slipjoints I've had, that were made in China, were actually pretty good. Seems they tumble their blades because the lines are not to sharp and snappy looking but construction was pretty good. I've had alot more problems with Case and Buck in the last few years. That too has been hit and miss though. One of my Spydercos that have the absolute best F&F is a Sage 2 and it was manufactured in Taiwan. I'm sure Sal is working with some of the best manufacturing shops there.
 
I had bought my daughter a blackcherry saddle horn trapper from Steel Warrior and could not believe what they were able to produce for 12 dollars. It was better than some of my big name American made stuff and I did not go through a bunch to find a good one. I took the first one the lady handed me.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk
 
flarp said:
Which brings up warranty... The big US knife companies all appear to offer the same warranty on their knives regardless of where they are made. Combining a good QC process with a good warranty from a reputable company, consumer confidence is increased. You can buy one of those knives and have a fair degree of certainty that you get a good product. And if it isn't, you have some recourse through the company to get it corrected. On the other hand, with the native Chinese companies, they pretty much have no warranty, or the warranty is so cost-ineffective to try executing against (eg. international shipping costs, long turnaround, poor customer service, etc.) that it's as good as non-existent.
Click to expand...

Yes, the lack of "local" warranty service is a major downfall for the "Made in China by Chinese only-operating-in-China companies" product. China Post is cheap for the Chinese. USPS to China? LOL Just buy a new product in most cases, shipping will kill you. Same problem applies to things like Fenix or Olight flashlights...they have a warranty, but it has to go to China for repairs or replacement. Then again, a lot of US companies are starting to implement "pay shipping both ways," and even a "service fee" to get warranty service. Not among knife companies, at least not yet, but some old(er) US companies are doing this.
 
dark impaler said:
Unsolicited knock-offs on the other hand, that's another issue- won't support that.
Click to expand...

It's important to make a distinction between imitation and counterfeit. Imitation has similar features. Counterfeit is attempting to deceive the buyer into believing they're getting the real thing. All progress in technology has been based on borrowing and imitation. Even the king of "intellectual property," Steve Jobs, admitted as such (he admitted borrowing many, many ideas - IIRC, he even used the word "stealing" - while vehemently defending his own patents & copyrights). For example, I respect Spyderco and their quality products, but, come on, no one "owns" the idea for a hole in the blade.

Imitation is, of course, the sincerest form of flattery. :D If the imitation is a respectable one, I'm game for trying it.
 
flarp said:
As for steel, most of the Chinese manufactured knives seem to use 8Cr13MoV (or some variant, like 8Cr14 or 9Cr13). With proper heat treat (which goes back to QC), I haven't had any of these perform noticeably worse for my EDC use than other steels of that class (eg. Sandvik 12C27 & 14C28N, AUS-8, etc.) with respect to taking an edge and retaining it through various use cases. They also don't typically offer the premium, more exotic steels, but that's also not the class they are competing with.
Click to expand...

Since materials and labour are so cheap it's not cost-effective for the Chinese to bring in premium steels unless it's at the behest of other companies. Both Browning (tactical hunter) and Boker (epicenter) have models made in China with VG-10 steel but these are pretty well the exception.
 
Some companies and knives are really starting to emerge out of china. They play diry and don't respect the western rules of no 1 to 1 imitations and such, but the quality of some of their imitations and materials are unbeleivable, and that's not only my personal opinion but the facts from the number of people buying them. I'm pretty sure there are a minimum of 100 people on this forum who got some of the latest Stider smf's that are 1/8th of the price, around 7/10 quality of materials and 0/10 honor.

Let me tell you they don't match custom work for art or innovation one bit, but mass producing 2-3k of work knives they can do superbly. The next step will be for china to get bored with mass producing and going creative with good materials and so on, for a fraction of a price. And all of this just because they don't have 5 company (owners/top bosses) sucking all the money and profit out of their companies not referring to specifics here just illustrating the point that the chinese business model is what the American business model used to be.

Average urban Chinese model is presently, 1-2 owners earning max of twice what the skilled workers earn in return for their innovation/investent, American business model is grab as much chash as fast as you can, so you can have god knows what....same model applies to big chines cities.
 
I've owned knives from almost every country that exports to the USA and over the last few years,as the our economy has been in decline,I have made every effort to buy American.Nowhere has this been easier than in knives.I am to the point now where I have just a few folders left in the collection that are imports and I am quickly trading or selling those off.By spring I will not own a knife produced outside this great land of ours.My folder collection will soon consist only of USA made Kershaws and my '02 Emerson Commander(I've pretty much quit carrying folders for EDC anyway) I have been building my fixed blade collection from my trades and do not own and,more importantly,WILL NOT own any fixed blade not made in USA.It's just a matter of personal and patriotic pride with me.
Every American made knife that I can buy supports and creates jobs right here for fellow Americans.Nothing could be more important to me now than contributing as much as I can in every way possible to the economy of THIS country.Now when I walk the aisles of the grocery store or clothing store of sporting goods shop or shop online,the first piece of info I want on a product is "where was it made?" I go out of my way to buy American as much as possible.And not to bash China or Taiwan or Japan or Germany or wherever, but I'm more worried about making this country great again,not supporting the economies of communist or socialist countries or other counties in general.They have citizens, let their people buy their goods. Attached is a pic of my latest locally made custom knife by Luke Smith.Got it in a trade,but the price tag said $200.Now why would I pay the same price or more for some imported,mass produced,inferior quality,cheap steel knife when I can support a local business,and all the American businesses he supports by making and selling knives. I can just as easily drive 20 minutes down the road,meet a great guy and get custom quality and know that an American family is eating and staying warm and clothed because I spent my dollars with him instead of some foreign conglomerate.
Admittedly,I didn't used to care about such things.I didn't care where my money went or what countries economy or ideology it supported,as long as I was happy with the product I got. I care now.I care because I look around and watch and read the news,and I see how tough it has become just to get by in this country,and it shouldn't be that way. I care because I want America to still be AMERICA when my daughter grows up.Land of the Free,Home of the Brave,Cradle of Democracy and the Greatest Country on Earth. I care because I love my country and my fellow Americans and the products they make and the values We stand for.I care because as an American I should care. I should have pride that my knife or truck or jeans or boots or produce or whatever,were made and sold right here in MY COUNTRY. And as an American,you should too.

DSCF6064.jpg
 
lots of inexpensive knives from all over the globe. Haven't one mention of the 1980's and 90's Pakistan knives I had a few and beat the heck out of them back on the farm. how many folks here have a 10 or 20 dollar Mora? Ove Thanks giving my family went to Springdale Arkansas and stop by A.G.Russel's store and I bought a Spyderco Resilience big huge great knife, made in china 40-50 bucks, if made in USA , probably pushing a buck and a half or more. I got to talk to Mr Russel. He got to talking about having knives made and would love to have USA or German knives but to be competitive. he ended up in China, his business doing what he has to stay in business.


I would blame American Big Store Retailers more then China, 10 years ago Wal mart was saying they would do whatthey could to help keep jobs in America, but they don't have much American made stuff.
 
voidaq said:
Some companies and knives are really starting to emerge out of china. They play diry and don't respect the western rules of no 1 to 1 imitations and such, but the quality of some of their imitations and materials are unbeleivable, and that's not only my personal opinion but the facts from the number of people buying them. I'm pretty sure there are a minimum of 100 people on this forum who got some of the latest Stider smf's that are 1/8th of the price, around 7/10 quality of materials and 0/10 honor.
Click to expand...

Yes, the "honor system".

If you believe that exists in Western manufacturing without the threat of legal consequences I've got a bridge to sell you.
 
I have no problem with most of my Chinese made knives, particularly if they're from a respectable U.S. manufacturer who ensures certain standards are met. I have Benchmades, Kershaws, and Gerbers (among others) made both in the U.S. and in China, and I've appreciated the quality of them all.

I will say this, and it's been a minor disappointment; but recently, several of the Chinese knives I've received were finished much better than their considerably more expensive U.S. counterparts... and that's something I hoped I'd never be able to say. For example, I got knives (folder and fixed) from 2 makers (I won't list which), and the U.S. ones were not sharpened evenly on both sides or well, while the Chinese-made knives were even and uniform from tip to ricasso and the same on both sides.

I'm not sure what to make of a knife that's U.S.-made and costs $130-$150 but has sharpened edges of such differing widths from 1 side to the next that it's immediately noticeable right out of the box. I get a "lesser", Chinese-made knife from the same company that costs less than a quarter of that, $30-$40, and it's immaculate and precise. Maybe QC is a problem in more than 1 country for several companies.
 
I'm so glad to frank told friends, I am a Chinese, I love the sword, for the sword of the our country the only benefit is cheaper price, quality can only say general, all hand knife except... We here mass production of dao is SRM, very cheap, as long as the few dozen yuan a...... I'm more like a spider and butterfly brand you, but I know there are a lot of the sword of the United States is in China foundry, because we here relatively low labor costs? As one of my knife knife to the fort on the love, is the brand, in Cambodia production. Thank you.
 
czombie said:
bingo.....
Click to expand...

this is the crux of the matter.
craftsmanship v profit.
nothing makes this more obvious to me than rough rider knives with names like "the ol' kentuckian"-sort of thing.
why don't they just call them the "ol guang zhouian" and be proud of what they do? not having a go at china -its business isn't it?
 
themandylion said:
It's important to make a distinction between imitation and counterfeit... I respect Spyderco and their quality products, but, come on, no one "owns" the idea for a hole in the blade.

Imitation is, of course, the sincerest form of flattery...
Click to expand...

Thought it was pretty clear what unsolicited knock-offs was referring to, but let me be more clear. It is the imitation of a product, in this case a knife, without the permission from the original designer. Thus, a counterfeit.

By the way, the Spyder hole is trademarked. Other manufacturers such as Anso knives, Burchtree, Mick Strider, and Brad Southard get the license from spyderco to use the spyderhole in their knives.

I'll bite that progress in technology is based on borrowing, let me elaborate: It's at times borrowing from elements initially without relevance to each other, but through design, an entity(technology in this case) is created that is neither an imitation of either single element.

Somehow, progress and imitation in the same sentence bothers me. Progress and imitation seem antithetic to one another. Although, I can see how one may think that imitation is a sign of progress since there are advancements needed to be made in order to duplicate the original, but then again, that's all relative. I know you meant that imitation is a point of departure for progress.

The highest form of flattery is to ask someone if you could use their design, not just imitate it without permission. That's called stealing or would counterfeit be applicable to that?

...But yah, I'm all for Chinese made knives- at a certain price point.
 
Last edited:
Lool what? Hell no! There is no such friggen thing! I was referring and talking about the strutting and posing that makes the buyers of said products feel better....

lol honor! that stuff makes you dumb and gets you killed. No thanks I try to deal as much as I can in reality(hitting my head against brick wall) and try to disregard all that honor mumbojumbo(loving god says to kill you first born) kind of stuff.
 
voidaq said:
Lool what? Hell no! There is no such friggen thing! I was referring and talking about the strutting and posing that makes the buyers of said products feel better....

lol honor! that stuff makes you dumb and gets you killed. No thanks I try to deal as much as I can in reality(hitting my head against brick wall) and try to disregard all that honor mumbojumbo(loving god says to kill you first born) kind of stuff.
Click to expand...

I was referring to your rather disingenuous assumption that it's only Chinese companies that play dirty and copy designs. This is rather blatantly not the case as has been shown by the recent Microtech/Kershaw fiasco.
 
dark impaler said:
Thought it was pretty clear what unsolicited knock-offs was referring to, but let me be more clear. It is the imitation of a product, in this case a knife, without the permission from the original designer. Thus, a counterfeit.
Click to expand...

"Imitation" of a knife not pretending to be the actual copied thing is not a counterfeit.


dark impaler said:
By the way, the Spyder hole is trademarked. Other manufacturers such as Anso knives, Burchtree, Mick Strider, and Brad Southard get the license from spyderco to use the spyderhole in their knives.
Click to expand...

I'm aware that it's trademarked, and find that patently (LOL) absurd. If Spyderco made the hole in the shape of their characteristic arachnid, yeah, sure. But a round hole? This is a clear illustration of why so-called "intellectual property" statutes need to be seriously reworked.


dark impaler said:
I'll bite that progress in technology is based on borrowing, let me elaborate: It's at times borrowing from elements initially without relevance to each other, but through design, an entity(technology in this case) is created that is neither an imitation of either single element.

Somehow, progress and imitation in the same sentence bothers me. Progress and imitation seem antithetic to one another. Although, I can see how one may think that imitation is a sign of progress since there are advancements needed to be made in order to duplicate the original, but then again, that's all relative. I know you meant that imitation is a point of departure for progress.
Click to expand...

No, imitation of a good idea is indeed progress. A good idea comes into existence, it is disseminated, and as the body of knowledge builds, new adaptations of it spring into existence. Progress comes in multiple stages, not merely purely new ideas or interpretations of something. The dissemination of an unchanged idea is also progress, since it gives rise to the potential for new interpretations therefrom.


dark impaler said:
The highest form of flattery is to ask someone if you could use their design, not just imitate it without permission.
Click to expand...

That's an opinion.


dark impaler said:
That's called stealing
Click to expand...

That's also an opinion, and one I vehemently oppose. My position is one that has deep roots, including being one held by Thomas Jefferson. To paraphrase him, lighting one's candle from his in no way diminishes his candle flame.
 
themandylion said:
...I'm aware that it's trademarked, and find that patently (LOL) absurd. If Spyderco made the hole in the shape of their characteristic arachnid,yeah, sure. But a round hole?...No, imitation of a good idea is indeed progress...

That's an opinion.
Click to expand...

Yes, a round hole because it is an intentional design. Just because an element is so simple does not negate its value as a well thought out solution, I wouldn't buy a knife with something so gaudy or kitsch as a spider cut out of its blade.

Let me make it even more clear...an unsolicited knock-off in the context of what I was speaking of initially was indeed referring to a counterfeit. I will now extend that to knives without the mutual understanding of all parties involved- a voluntary collaboration. Does that solve the ambiguity of imitation? I will not buy such a knife, made in China or elsewhere.

The point is missed..."I know you meant that imitation is a point of departure for progress." I didn't think I needed to explain this, but ok...when one imitates something, you make a copy, be clear if it's a direct copy or one infused with other ideas so as to create a hybrid. Now whether or not that needs to be stated...I really don't know or even if it matters. Yes, I understand the value of breaking down an idea, replicating it and reinterpretation of said idea into a new entity. Which can only occur if a new element is brought into that equation. A mere reinterpretation of anything does not necessarily constitute progress.

Imitation of a good idea is not progress- again, it's a...point of departure for progress. Imitation in of itself cannot be considered progress, as you have even stated and I do agree that there are stages in the evolution (we'll use your original example) of technology.

No need to state what is obviously an opinion because what had initially been stated was disseminated and re-envisioned into a statement that emanates from an individual that holds respect in high regards for an original designer. Case in point, give credit where credit is due and practice some common decency instead of just copying. However, I also understand that that is what happens when a previously accepted opinion such as, imitation is the highest form of flattery, is reworked into a different angle, the threat of one's ego is under fire and a defensive stance is taken and labeling ensues.

Deeply rooted in ethnocentric dogma or not, what's an opinion- is still an opinion. Discussions are full of opinions (as well as facts at times), but that is the color that adds the beauty to it all.

But really...this racks my brain and I'm only functioning with only a couple of brain cells left so before this gets carried away, let's stick to the original topic by the op...yes I would still buy a Chinese knife if it was made decent enough and at a low price point.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top