Kukri in 3V, K890, or CruWear

[David Mary]

Why do my selections require compromising on geometry?

Because higher carbide steels have larger grains and are stiffer and less capable of absorbing shock, and will thus be more inclined to chip with hard impacts than something like AEB-L which is finer grained and tougher, and more likely to flex and shrug off damage.

 

[ShaiHulud]

AEB-L is an amazing steel because not only can it be used in a thin knife but also be suited in a thicker knife for chopping and excel at both

 

[David Mary]

Haha all good points, but I was looking for suggestions as to knifemakers who would be willing and able to make a high performing kukri in one of the steels I mentioned. I’m guessing if Carothers has plans to make one, it’s doable.

Sure it is. And Carothers is a great company that makes amazing high quality tools. They didn't reach their level of success by doing things wrong. They don't make their high carbide knives with the same geometry I would use on an AEB-L knife, and for good reason. My hand made stuff is imperfect, and lacks the level of precision and finish you get on a Carothers piece. An AEB-L knife will definitely bite deeper than a high carbide steel knife, however, assuming two knives of comparable design both at a geometry as thin as can be responsibly attained.

 

[TC]

Browse through the "Fixed Blades" thread. Lots of large, custom made choppers to be found there. I'm sure you can convince someone to make it a kukri shape.

 

[Teesac81]

I do not require particularly thin edge geometry. I want it to be hefty and have a geometry which will be a middle ground between what is needed to both chop and split wood.

 

[Crag the Brewer]

Haha all good points, but I was looking for suggestions as to knifemakers who would be willing and able to make a high performing kukri in one of the steels I mentioned. I’m guessing if Carothers has plans to make one, it’s doable.

Anything is doable......

The blades that they win All their trophies with are ground thinner than the blades that go out to everyone else. Stock production.
Their team is highly skilled and know how to use their knives.

Their stock stuff is made thicker, so it isn't at peak performance, but is tougher so the average Joe doesn't damage them/warenty work.
-still awesome knives, I'm just saying their race blades are different than their production.

A custom maker will go to more performance side of things. If you ask them to

I believe I've read that Nate said his AEBL is tougher than his 3v? (A little bit)
Someone will come along shortly and correct me, if I'm wrong

 

[David Mary]

And we haven't talked about ease of maintenance. If you chip a carbide steel in the field, especially a recurved blade like a khukuri, you're going to have a bear of a time fixing that until you get home to your grinder. A thinner blade can do everything you need it to do, and better, and will also be easier to maintain in the field. If it is also a low alloy steel, that even further compounds the ease of maintenance.

 

[JJ_Colt45]

Haha all good points, but I was looking for suggestions as to knifemakers who would be willing and able to make a high performing kukri in one of the steels I mentioned. I’m guessing if Carothers has plans to make one, it’s doable.

Nathan's Delta 3V is a totally different creature than standard 3V ... is has better fine edge stability. So you can't look at run of the mill 3V in quite the same way.

 

[David Mary]

Nathan has said that Delta 3V is a tweak. It's better than standard 3V, but marginally. And requesting a high temperature temper like the Delta protocol requires the maker to do lots of extra prep work to a blade before it goes into heat treatment, adding even more cost. I believe it works for Carothers because they have a process in place and do things in batches which can help keeps costs down. My guess is someone looking for this to be done as a one off is going to add significant cost to an already needlessly expensive project.

T Teesac81 you haven't actually said why you are so set on one of these steels. If it is purely a status symbol thing, fill your boots. If it is about performance, then I think you are throwing money away chasing a misguided understanding of knife engineering that will ultimately get you something that performs no better than the much less expensive option Crag and I are encouraging you towards.

 

[Teesac81]

Nathan's Delta 3V is a totally different creature than standard 3V ... is has better fine edge stability. So you can't look at run of the mill 3V in quite the same

Nathan's Delta 3V is a totally different creature than standard 3V ... is has better fine edge stability. So you can't look at run of the mill 3V in quite the

Nathan has said that Delta 3V is a tweak. It's better than standard 3V, but marginally. And requesting a high temperature temper like the Delta protocol requires the maker to do lots of extra prep work to a blade before it goes into heat treatment, adding even more cost. I believe it works for Carothers because they have a process in place and do things in batches which can help keeps costs down. My guess is someone looking for this to be done as a one off is going to add significant cost to an already needlessly expensive project.

T Teesac81 you haven't actually said why you are so set on one of these steels. If it is purely a status symbol thing, fill your boots. If it is about performance, then I think you are throwing money away chasing a misguided understanding of knife engineering that will ultimately get you something that performs no better than the much less expensive option Crag and I are encouraging you towards.

Delta 3V is my top choice because it is the toughest steel I know of that still has some stainless properties. David Mary how do you heat treat your AEB-L kukri and to what hardness?

 

[hugofeynman]

Then it's misguided because these high carbide wear resistant steels are never going to be as stable as low alloy tough steels at thinner geometries.

I think nowadays people are obsessed with pm steels. They think the pm process will make the steel cleaner and "better" than the ingot steels. Even Busse is working with 3v, now, they needed to "enter the pm steel party".
Just out of curiosity, the steels that won Forged in Fire: knife or death where 1075 and 80crv2. Seems their edge retention (and toughness) is more than good enough ...

 

[David Mary]

Delta 3V is my top choice because it is the toughest steel I know of that still has some stainless properties

Not any more. AEB-L is at least equally as tough if not more, and definitely more ductile leading to higher durability due to impact absorption. This has already been stated by more than just myself.

David Mary how do you heat treat your AEB-L kukri and to what hardness?

I use third party heat treatment services who specialize in heat treating blades. I have them run AEB-L for big knives at 60-61 HRC.

For example this one I made for a customer recently, the "Triumph" chopper, with Suretouch handle scales:

 

[bikerector]

I don't have experience with k890, but I would go whichever you think is easier to sharpen.

So probably 3V gets my vote, of those 3, as long as it's heat treated well. The D3V protocol by CPK seems to sharpen well for 3V, but I know some others than sharpen like there's a lot of large carbides in the steel and harder to get a keen edge.

 

[Teesac81]

Not any more. AEB-L is at least equally as tough if not more, and definitely more ductile leading to higher durability due to impact absorption. This has already been stated by more than just myself.



I use third party heat treatment services who specialize in heat treating blades. I have them run AEB-L for big knives at 60-61 HRC.

For example this one I made for a customer recently, the "Triumph" chopper, with Suretouch handle scales:

Can you make a super thick kukri with a fat belly for chopping and an overall profile that will also do well at splitting small logs for firewood at more like 62 HRC, with removable canvas micarta scales???

I don't have experience with k890, but I would go whichever you think is easier to sharpen.

So probably 3V gets my vote, of those 3, as long as it's heat treated well. The D3V protocol by CPK seems to sharpen well for 3V, but I know some others than sharpen like there's a lot of large carbides in the steel and harder to get a keen edge.

Oops

 

[Teesac81]

I don't have experience with k890, but I would go whichever you think is easier to sharpen.

So probably 3V gets my vote, of those 3, as long as it's heat treated well. The D3V protocol by CPK seems to sharpen well for 3V, but I know some others than sharpen like there's a lot of large carbides in the steel and harder to get a keen edge.

Is D3V something you’re able to make into a kukri?

 

[David Mary]

Can you make a super thick kukri with a fat belly for chopping and an overall profile that will also do well at splitting small logs for firewood at more like 62 HRC, with removable canvas micarta scales???

I could if I were taking new custom orders at this time. I didn't post here because I want to make this knife for you. I posted here to hopefully help steer you down a better path.

 

[bikerector]

Is D3V something you’re able to make into a kukri?

It's just CPM-3V with a different heat treat to get different performance from it.

You can make a kukri from any knife steel, technically, it's just going to perform differently.

Because of the impact use case for kukris, and the blade profile, I elect dor easy to sharpen steels on mine, especially if I'm trying maintain the concex edge (I usually abandon that quickly for flat edge bevels though for ease of sharpening, for me).

The biggest kicker with the 3V or Cruwear will be if you get a knick, dent, or chip from chopping. It's a lot more work to get it corrected. Also, the added edge retention often doesn't add a lot of benefit for chopping.

The need for a keen edge has a limit, since you're not going kitchen knife thin on a brute force tool, so any of the steels are probably fine there. I'll counter what others have said. For a kukri, I like a keener edge close to the handle for finer work, but the main chopping area is a chopper grind, meaning I want some meat behind the edge. Especially if I'm chopping into anything dry, like wood for fire prep tasks, or digging for fatwood.

In theory, the knifemaker can heat treat the steel on the softer side of the ideal range and you'll be good to go for the given steel chosen. For a kukri, at least the kind I use (not combat styles), toughness and ease of maintenance trumps edge retention, within reason of course.

 

[Teesac81]

It's just CPM-3V with a different heat treat to get different performance from it.

You can make a kukri from any knife steel, technically, it's just going to perform differently.

Because of the impact use case for kukris, and the blade profile, I elect dor easy to sharpen steels on mine, especially if I'm trying maintain the concex edge (I usually abandon that quickly for flat edge bevels though for ease of sharpening, for me).

The biggest kicker with the 3V or Cruwear will be if you get a knick, dent, or chip from chopping. It's a lot more work to get it corrected. Also, the added edge retention often doesn't add a lot of benefit for chopping.

The need for a keen edge has a limit, since you're not going kitchen knife thin on a brute force tool, so any of the steels are probably fine there. I'll counter what others have said. For a kukri, I like a keener edge close to the handle for finer work, but the main chopping area is a chopper grind, meaning I want some meat behind the edge. Especially if I'm chopping into anything dry, like wood for fire prep tasks, or digging for fatwood.

In theory, the knifemaker can heat treat the steel on the softer side of the ideal range and you'll be good to go for the given steel chosen. For a kukri, at least the kind I use (not combat styles), toughness and ease of maintenance trumps edge retention, within reason of course.

Will you make me this kukri?

 

[bikerector]

Will you make me this kukri?

Sorry, I can't. I was just sharing my opinions for educational or entertainment purposes.

Making or designing a kukri are well out of my realm of expertise, I've just tried and used maybe a dozen or so, and many, many more choppers, so have some experience on the steel and other characteristics standpoint. More than some, a lot less than others.

 

[SharpBits]

I’d suggest searching the Custom and Handmade forum and the Knife Makers market forum and search for khukri (or any of the spelling variants) to see what makers have made them in the past. Then send a PM to each to see if they are interested in making one for you.
Keep us updated if the project is picked up. Good luck!