leather making 101

Burchtree

KnifeMaker & Moderator
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Alright, I've read the tutorial on pouch sheaths, and took a trip to Tandy Leather during my lunch break. I got black edge dressing, a bigl ol' piece of 6-7-ounce "shoulder piece" (whatever that means), and some sinewy thread, bone groover, dye and I have some stuff at home.

Are there any tips, or other tutorial links you guys can give me besides the one on CKD? I've also got one of those awl stitchers, but have no idea how it works. How do I stitch? What kind of knot to use?

Thanks for any help.
 
Stitching awl makes the knot for you (it makes it quite easy actually) and there should be instructions with it if it came from Tandy.

Bruce Evans has a good pouch sheath tutorial on his website. I should know, I made my first lined pouch sheath based on his tutorial and it turned out great - despite my attempts to screw it up. ;)


IIRC, shoulder is tougher than belly - which is softer for tooling.


You should also get some beeswax or mink oil for final finishing.



edited to add link:
http://www.homestead.com/beknivessite2/pouchsheath.html
 
That's the tutorial I read, but it didn't really say how the stitching was done. The Awl I got from my father, so no istructions.
 
It's probably a regular awl, then, right? No spool on it, I assume.

If so, you'll need a leather needle and the S-curve ones are fairly easy to use - can be picked up at a fabric store.

Otherwise, if it has the spool on it (you can thread the end of it), then you just push the needle through from one side to the other and then pull it halfway back. This will make a loop. Send the other length of thread down the loop and pull both ends.

Be sure to try to center the knot in the leather or you will end up using one side much faster than the other.

(you start by sending half of the sinew through the first hole)

Make sense?
 
Yeah, it's got the spool, I think I got the picture (maybe) on how the threading should be done. I'll be trying it out tonight. Thanks for the info.
 
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Below are links to three tutorials I have written that may be of help.
Been doing it long enough I figured I'd pass aloong a bit of what I've learned.

Mexican Loop Sheath Tutorial Link
How to Make a Stitching Pony
Leather Stitching Tutorial

IIRC, shoulder is tougher than belly - which is softer for tooling.
Sorry pendentive but that's incorrect info sort of. IMO - Belly leather is just plain crap period! Too soft and spongy most of the time and therefore does NOT tool real well. I know that they are sold as "tooling bellies" but.... Good tooling leather must have a good, tight grain or it will "wash" out.

Here's some info on the various types and grades of cowhide.
Price reflects quality in two ways - where it was tanned (generally either USA or South American/Mexican - there are European tanned hides as well and they are normally premium quality) and the grade. Of the two most commonly tanned hides, USA tanned (Wicket & Craig, Herman Oak, Howes, Wes-Tan, etc.)is normally the best tanning, but you can get good SA/Mex. Grade is based on how "clean" the face of the hide is i.e how free of range marks and brands as well as how tight the back or flesh side is.(just as important as a good face.) No hide is totally free of range marks and frankly as long as the hide is not badly scarred I like them as they add "character". Brands can be cut around, but they do take up space, but hides with brands are normally less expensive.

leathercut.jpg


1) IMO don't even bother with bellies. On the chart above cuts F/H and G/I are the bellies.

2) Shoulders/premium shoulders: Same animal basically. Probably the most used Veg-tan leather for sheath/holster making - the most bang for the buck normally due to size and lack of belly leather along the edges. Difference between the two is quality based on grade as explained above. BTW Demers Leather (1-800-336-3772), carries some of the best double shoulders I know of. They split 12 oz hides down to thickness for a very tight/clean back. Referring to the chart above: Double shoulders (average 14-16 sq ft) = parts A, B, C, F, & G. Trimmed shoulders have parts A, F, & G trimmed off. A single shoulder is half of a double shoulder.

3) Nature-Tand, Oak Leaf, etc. - proprietary names for various lines of veg-tanned hides.

4) Saddling/Skirting: heavy weight (10+ ounces) veg-tan sides normally used for making saddles. It is finished by the tanneries with a bit more oil so that it retains it's flexibility. It is thicker than necessary for most knife sheath work, although for big Bowies or swords it can be the thing to use.

5) Kip is a hide from a large calf rather than a mature cow. Usually comes in lighter weights only and I have noticed when using it that the grain is usually not quite as tight as cow hide.

6) Sides: The most common cut/size of leather sold average 20-24 sq ft. A side is half of a full hide split longitudinally along the line between B/C, D/E. Trimmed sides have the belly sections cut off.

7) Back or Bends: The cleanest most even (and therefore most expensive) part of a hide consists of sections D & E. Hope this helps.

Carving or stamping requires the best quality hide available.

If you can afford it get the best leather possible. For my own use I buy almost exclusively from Wickett & Craig (www.wickett-craig.com or 1-800-826-6379 ext 216) and I usually buy "b" grade backs - virtually no belly leather. The double shoulders from Demers (1-888-336-3772) are excellent also and may be the best overall buy for sheath makers.
If you are just starting out, don't have a lot of spare cash, and are unsure of what to get I'd recommend the single shoulders in 6/7oz weight from Tandy/Leather Factory. They average about 6-8 sq ft and sell for $4.99 a sq ft. Best for blades under 6".

Happy Trails - Chuck
 
I appreciate that -- the links don't work though. ;)
 
Wow, that was a ton of information which I think will help a lot when I try making this holster(s).

But yeah,k the links didn't work.

Thanks for all theinfo on the leather though at least. :)
 
Chuck,

Thanks for clarifying. I meant to say "side" as in shoulders are thicker/heavier than sides. Am I still off-base? :footinmou

A belly can still be a decent sheath, but only because it's much cheaper. $20 for a belly (H or I) vs. $100+ for a side or shoulder. I've done both and they have their pros and cons.

Thanks for fixing the links. I'll have to print those out.
 
Bookmarked the links,a nd soudnded like printer jsut finished spitting out your info on the cuts of elather. Thanks Chuck.
 
I meant to say "side" as in shoulders are thicker/heavier than sides. Am I still off-base?

Well sort of. The cut i.e. side, shoulder, back, etc doesn't really determine the thickness. Most saddlemakers for instance ordinarily use much heavier leather than sheath makers (12/14 oz as compared to 7/9 oz) and they almost always use sides since to get the size they need. Veg Tan sides come in thicknesses from 2/3 oz up to 15/16 oz. Shoulders are normally in the range 4/5 to 9/10 oz. Tha main advantage to using shoulders or backs like I do is the yield/size. Less Belly for one and the cost is less due to the smaller size - 14 sq ft for shoulders compared to 24 sq ft for sides.

As I first said bellies just don't cut it for me. Yes I have seen some nicely made sheaths made with it but it is still on average too soft and punky to offer the protection that I require in a sheath. Remember on a fixed blade knife that the main purpose of a sheath is to not only protect the blade but also and even more important to protect the person that is wearing it. If the sheath is too soft and/or flexible or badly designed the blade can and will pierce the side especially during a fall or other rough and tumble activity. It's for that reason I "harden" even my good leather and test out my designs. Over the years I've had a ton of sheaths in my shop for repair so I've gotten to see a lot of the good, the bad, and the ugly.:rolleyes:

Also I am the moderator of the Sheath Gallery forum on CKD and invite you to check it out. This was set up to be a display of many different makers works. Just make sure you look back past the first 30 days using the parameter button at the bottom.

Sheath Gallery
 
Here is a pic of the stitching tool I use;

attachment.php


You put about equal amounts of thread on both sides, then push the needle through, pull back a little to make a loop, slip the thread through the loop and pull down tight so that the knot is about in the middle of the leather.

Near the end, not the last hole but the next two holes, enlarge them a little with an awl, so that when you get to the end, you then have room in those holes to back stitch at least two places to secure the end of the stitching, I then snip off the top/good side of the sheath's thread, then SLOWLY CAREFULLY pull that little bit into the hole and then trim off on the back side.

Good luck and enjoy!
G2

ps, 7-3-03
edited to add that you'll notice the spool of thread missing on the tool...never used them, what a pain in the...neck, so what I do is figure a folded length of thread a little longer than twice the length of the hole pattern, then thread the thread through the hole so an equal amount is on both side when you start sewing...
 
Thanks everyone for the information. I didn't get into it last night. I looked at all the tools and leather, then went out to the shop instead. :D I will practice tonight though. ;)
 
Wow! As noted, a ton of info here.

I've seen a gent use a spade (no better word to describe it) to punch the leather for the stitching then use needles and waxed thread in a double stitch. The spade looked like a four pronged fork with flat tines that are nasty sharp on the ends and quite thin. The tines were roughly 1/8" thick and 1/8" apart. This was used on an assembled sheath to set the holes. Then a single pronged piece for going around bends.

Chuck, This any better or worse than using a threading awl?

Thanks,

Dan
Bearpaw Knives
 
I suspect that is what is listed in my Tandy catalogue as a thonging chisel. I think that is what Tim McCreight suggests to use in his books, IIRC.

I've never used one. I use a stitching wheel and a 1/16 drill (oh, the shame, the shame :D). I just can't get used to trying to use a singlepoint awl to punch for my stitching - either I can't get it through 4-5 layers of 8Oz leather, or the blade sticks (and then pulls out of the handle), or I have to clamp the leather so tightly I worry about marking it...

I've got a lockstitch awl as well, but I've only ever used it for repair work on bags & jackets.

Peter
 
I used to use a thonging chisel - but now use a stitching awl, which is more flexible (layout is easier for curves) and quicker than punching all the holes. Since I gouge the run for the stitch, and don't include the welt in the stitch, sewing it up is fairly quick and easy.

Just for fun, I made 2 sheaths last night for my fishing trip today. One for a skinner - to use as a kitchen knife. The other a multi-use sheath holding pliers, my bait knife, and a "pencil-style" sharpener.

If anyone's interested, I'll take some pics.

No loops, because these are going in pockets.

Lots of fun, took about 4 hours from design layout to stitching to wet-forming to oiling/waxing.
 
I started doing some stitching last night for a Swiss Champ sheath. It didn't turn out too well. :D
 
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