Let's see your Scout/Camp knives

Those are awesome Duncan!!!! I had that very thought in the back of my mind when I replied...my Camillus BSA looks exactly like the Ulster BSA's. :)

Camillus made knives for everyone...:thumbsup:
 
Im not too sure to thank you or curse you my friend as there's another Knife for me to look out for lol
 
Camillus / Sword Brand 97 Camp knife
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Campbellclanman said:
Ok...cool thank you SAK guy - If anyone would know Michael ( Codger) would! And it makes perfect sense as there are PLENTY of Ulster Scouts out there- and funnily enough- I compared a few Camillus Scouts of mine to an Ulster scout of mine- they are absolutely identical in every way - which leaves me thinking Camillus made these for Ulster as welll- which of course Camillus did a lot of contract knife making for nearly all other Cutler firms, I am lucky enough to own a Peach-seed Cattle Knife that is stamped Ulster- but its highly likely Schrade made for Ulster.
the only differencE is that the Left hand and later modeled knife on the right has an extra ( 5th ) tool added which is the Phillips screwdriver you see.

Pictured below on the left the two Camillus Scouts on the right an Ulster stamped knife....

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After my posts last Friday in this thread (#s 145,148 & 149) I, too, noticed that my mint last U.S. Camillus Official BSA knife seemed identical to the four earlier and well-used Ulsters. I think this, though, was a little more than that Ulster "contracted" to Camillus for its BSA knives. I may be preaching to the choir here, but the common link to these exact copy knives, I think, is Albert M. Baer. According to @bernard_levine in his 4th Edition Guide ("Imperial, Ulster, Schrade, and Camillus," pages 123-125), Albert Baer became a salesman for Kastor Bros., parent company of Camillus, in 1922. He left Kastor in 1938, but kept a major interest in the company in shares he bought in 1932 from August Kastor upon the latter's retirement. In '41-'42, Albert Baer bought Ulster from Dwight Devine, Jr. In 1943, in a joint venture with Imperial, Baer formed Kingston Cutlery Co. In '45-'46 Kingston (Baer) bought Schrade Cutco and renamed it Schrade-Walden. In 1947, the Kastor name was dropped in favor of Camillus, and with the death of Alfred Kastor in 1963, ownership of Camillus passed to Albert Baer's two daughters. So, since Levine's chronology/relationship of these companies and individuals doesn't discuss specific knives, I'm kinda left wondering which of these two BSA scouts came first, the Camillus or the Ulster. And if it was a contract deal, it was more or less Albert Baer contracting with himself!
As I inspected and compared the "new" Camillus with the older Ulsters, I did notice three different punch styles. Hopefully, these differences can be seen in the photos below. The top knife is the newer Camillus. The second is the Ulster I mis-identified as bone (really Delrin) in my earlier post. The punch on these two is narrow and flat but with a more pronounced back curve than the third knife, another Ulster. The fourth has a fatter punch that is concave on the nail-nick side and correspondingly curved on the back side. The second pic is the reverse of these knives in the same order, so apparently Ulster mixed scale colors on some knives.

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If memory serves me, I think the biggest difference between the Camillus and newer Ulsters is that the Ulsters used Swinden Key construction. No true pivot pin. I'm pretty certain that the Camillus knives used steel pivot pins.
 
Buzzbait said:
If memory serves me, I think the biggest difference between the Camillus and newer Ulsters is that the Ulsters used Swinden Key construction. No true pivot pin. I'm pretty certain that the Camillus knives used steel pivot pins.
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I just keep readin' and learnin' here when I should be getting ready to sell knives this Saturday at an Arlington, VA, flea market! I've seen reference to the Swinden Key construction, but didn't know what it was. A little searching and I have now learned that construction tidbit. I closely inspected all of the knives in my previous post and cannot see the round pin end on any of the Ulsters, but do see it on that much newer Camillus. It can actually be seen in my top pic. So, is the progression that the Ulsters were made in the Schrade/Ulster Ellenville plant using the Swinden construction, which Schrade favored, and Camillus later appropriated the exact handle jigging and blade shapes, but used through-pin construction?
 
It don't really know what agreements were in place between Camillus and Schrade. It all gets very blurry sometimes. I guess it's even possible that Camillus provided blades to Schrade, and Schrade assembled the blades onto their own frames using Swinden construction.
 
I thought the Swindon Key was strictly Uncle Henry and "Schrade" branded. (and of course the Buck contracted 300 series)
I am not an expert, but it was my understanding the Ulster, Hammer Brand, NYKC, Imperial, and Old Timer all got the pins.
 
Well I may just take apart the pretty roached out Ulster shown in my first post of Official BSA knives (#148) in this thread, and find out. It's already missing the bail and the handles are in bad shape anyway. But his brings me to the fact that, in all my recent handling of them, another one has had the bail come detached from the pin on the shield side of the knife. Since I don't see any pin head, just a hole, I guess the pin itself sheared at the wear point. If you take a look at my post #172 above, you can see it was either already gone or starting to go when I took the pic. It's not a matter of it slipping off a worn head. Thinkin' I might just be able to punch it on through and replace it with some 1/16-inch nickel silver stock I have. I'm not very good at peening.....
 
afishhunter said:
I thought the Swindon Key was strictly Uncle Henry and "Schrade" branded. (and of course the Buck contracted 300 series)
I am not an expert, but it was my understanding the Ulster, Hammer Brand, NYKC, Imperial, and Old Timer all got the pins.
Click to expand...
I have seen both Uncle Henry and Old Timers with Swindon key construction often.
 
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