Low ball offers

[knifehunt]

As I stated and you quoted, unless the price is already reasonable or the item is actually collectable I'd offer 50% of the asking price. In your specific example I wouldn't offer you a dime, I don't knowingly buy knives made by people like Mick Strider.


We or at least I'm talking about buying used knives, not something that normally appreciates in value. I don't buy "collectable" or "art" knives. I'd never offer 50% of the sellers asking price on a collectable or a rare knife because I have no plans to ever buy one.

Not trying to start an argument, I'm just amused that people would be insulted by someone making an offer on a used item that the seller wants to sell. If my offer, or any offer for your used knife is too low, turn it down and take a better one. Seems simple enough.

I used Strider as an example, whether or not you would buy one of his knives is a whole other debate.

So if I had a Spyderco PM2 that lightly used, and listed it for $100 and you were interested in it, you would offer me $50 ? I'm just trying to fully understand you here.

 

[Peter Hartwig]

I try to price my knives fairly from the get go & do not like to do a lot of negotiating. If you offer is way out of line with the asking price, there isn't going to be any negotiating. I am just going to say no. If you get in the general vicinity of my asking I may negotiate , I may not, but it will be concluded within a couple posts. We will either come to a number quickly or I will drop out. I use basically the same on the buy. If it is way off what I think is fair, I make no offer. Once it gets within reason I may make an offer to bring it in line with what I think is fair. Fair is all I look for. I consider these forums a gathering of friends(even if we don't know each other well)enjoying a common interest, and I don't try to beat my friends.

 

[neffarious]

The first offer for anything used is 50% of the asking price. Unless the asking price is already reasonable or the item is actually collectable. If that's too low, turn my offer down and make a counter-offer, I'll come up, you'll come down and we'll make a deal somewhere in the middle.

Getting angry over an offer to buy a used item without a known and generally accepted market price seems silly.

There is a generally accepted market price. Automatically offering 50% of whatever the person is asking seems silly to me, and indeed insulting. Would you prefer we just give you everything you want for free so we eat the loss instead of you having to actually pay a fair value on something?

 

[BBKoenigsegg]

The first offer for anything used is 50% of the asking price. Unless the asking price is already reasonable or the item is actually collectable. If that's too low, turn my offer down and make a counter-offer, I'll come up, you'll come down and we'll make a deal somewhere in the middle.

Getting angry over an offer to buy a used item without a known and generally accepted market price seems silly.

Without a known and generally accepted market price? 85% of the knives in the production forum have a known and generally accepted market price, just check previous sales. I would hope that most of my listed prices fall under the "unless the asking price is already reasonable" part of your post, because if you offered me 50% of my list price, I probably wouldn't even respond to you (mostly because I'd think you're a troll).

 

[knifehunt]

Without a known and generally accepted market price? 85% of the knives in the production forum have a known and generally accepted market price, just check previous sales. I would hope that most of my listed prices fall under the "unless the asking price is already reasonable" part of your post, because if you offered me 50% of my list price, I probably wouldn't even respond to you (mostly because I'd think you're a troll).

LOL.... I thought I was not comprehending what he was trying to relay, but you have interpreted it as I have. I have to agree with you that I would not respond either, and if I did, he would not be pleased, lol.

 

[Leftytwogunz]

It is clear that some people in this thread actually think 50% offers are legit...it makes me wonder what else they must cheap out on in life to score an extra low priced knife. Rounding the tip up to the next dollar at the steak House? Probably.

I guess the real takeaway here is the illustration on the wide variety of people that we will encounter on this forum. Some definitely are in the mindset of accumulating the highest amount the fastest way possible. The good thing is, that none of us have to make any deals that we are not comfortanle with. I am trying to train myself to not remain angry about other people's actions that they are often oblivious to.

I know that sounds like some real hippy sh!+ and is almost off topic, but why even argue with someone who doesn't see this type of behavior as wrong? It only makes us have more unhappy seconds, minutes, hours etc. While they are off pissing off their next mark.

Best of luck good guys, im out!

 

[AntCaps]

I think low ball offers are part of the deal, I was offered a lot less than I was asking recently.
I didn't get angry or even annoyed I said thanks but no thanks and that was it. I guess you can't blame people for trying if there is something they want and can't afford no one looses anything by throwing out an offer.
I personally try not to give low ball offers but if I see something I like but don't quite have enough I'll make an offer and see if it works.

 

[Bigfattyt]

I have given a low ball offer on knives a few times.

Though it was not in money, it was I trade. There was a custom knife I thought was the production version.

Offered up for trade and no mention of value.

I made an offer, and after, went and looked up the knife, finding that it was not the production version, but a custom made by the original design maker. I sent a pm apologizing.

The other time was on some pretty rough forged knives. I believe the eventually sold for what I offered or less.

 

[TsarBomba]

I usually reserve lowball offers for high ball sellers. There are plenty enough of both.

Aaaand </THREAD>

 

[RevDevil]

depends on the knife, depends on how long the knife has been posted, depends on all kinds of variables. I didn't even say thats how i conduct myself when i buy. Just that i don't consider an INITIAL offer of 20-25% insulting. A 20% off sale doesn't exactly turn my head walking through a mall. I don't think its an insulting start point of a potential negotiation. If someone had a $400 knife for sale and i offered $320, i don't consider that unreasonable for a first offer. 25% maybe a bit of a stretch on a higher value knife, i can see that though.

Rusty, some folks on the forums think the Exchange is the same as a swap meet/flea market and they treat sales as such. I agree that sometimes the people that want a 100% markup on a LE knife are out of their mind, but that is on them. I've sold a couple LE knives on here for less than I paid for them, and I saw the same guy on both occasions turn around and relist them here for a 50% markup. That same guy was later banned several times over for initially not delivering an item as described, and refusing a refund, then for sneaking back in a couple more times under a different name.
I know full well I cannot sell a knife that is brand new for what they sell for on the web, I can and usually do discount 10% max as my asking price. As a buyer that would be enough to make me buy the item if it was something I really wanted. By the same token, I've also been offered 4 knives for a single knife. That is an automatic "nope, nope, nope" in my mind.

SOme folks are desperate to get rid of items, they will take lowball offers immediately, because they hve a pressing need for cash. Other people aren't in a hurry and don't need to sell the knives right then and there. Getting a reputation as a person that is low baller is just as bad IMO as someone that types "I'LL TAKE IT!!!!" only to change their ind and never return an email. Essentially ruining someone's thread.

 

[Rusty_shackelford]

Rusty, some folks on the forums think the Exchange is the same as a swap meet/flea market and they treat sales as such. I agree that sometimes the people that want a 100% markup on a LE knife are out of their mind, but that is on them. I've sold a couple LE knives on here for less than I paid for them, and I saw the same guy on both occasions turn around and relist them here for a 50% markup. That same guy was later banned several times over for initially not delivering an item as described, and refusing a refund, then for sneaking back in a couple more times under a different name.
I know full well I cannot sell a knife that is brand new for what they sell for on the web, I can and usually do discount 10% max as my asking price. As a buyer that would be enough to make me buy the item if it was something I really wanted. By the same token, I've also been offered 4 knives for a single knife. That is an automatic "nope, nope, nope" in my mind.

SOme folks are desperate to get rid of items, they will take lowball offers immediately, because they hve a pressing need for cash. Other people aren't in a hurry and don't need to sell the knives right then and there. Getting a reputation as a person that is low baller is just as bad IMO as someone that types "I'LL TAKE IT!!!!" only to change their ind and never return an email. Essentially ruining someone's thread.

I can only imaging the shenanigans you're privy to that I'm not. more of a baby sitter/zoo keeper than moderator. Im only on here for a little hobby, and have had pretty much nothing but good experiences in my limited wheelings and dealings. I can see how a guy gets a little choked if he has a little sentimental attachment to a knife or if he over spend a bit and a guys turning the screws on him. Im sure you don't want to encourage anything that stirs the pot in anyway, cause you have to put the fire out. I assume every hobby i have is going to cost me money, and this one is no different. A guy trying for the lowest price he can get/ low balling doesn't even faze me. Ive yet to experience any of the things mentioned by other guys in this thread though. Guys have offered me a couple ridiculous trades too, but never a hassle after i replied no thanks. Ive offered prices/trades that guys passed on, done deal. Plus other than a couple of sebenzas, I'm usually playing in the sub $200 area. So less money, less problems i guess. I try to keep every interaction on here and in real life respectful and polite. I don't know if you're insinuating I've developed this reputation already, or if its just a warning for the future. The former would be news to me, the latter ill keep under my hat for future dealings.

 

[RevDevil]

No, I was not insinuating you have that reputation. I have not studied your dealings. I tend to be much more direct when it comes to calling something out when I see it. I simply see a whole lot of disorganized people scrambling in all directions, and on the other hand I see a lot of people have one home run transaction after another, over and over. Trying to teach people the best practice can be challenging, like herding cats. I tend to be polite to people that offer me a shoe box full of knives for a high dollar piece, but these days so many new people just jump in without even looking, studying, hard to say that they even like being here for the sake of the hobby. More like hipsters wanting a pricey knife because it's cool. I just ignore that kind of thing, not even worth getting upset over. As far as I am concerned, I just want folks to have good experiences, and make sure they cover their bases all around...if they learn something in the process that is a bonus.

 

[Rusty_shackelford]

No, I was not insinuating you have that reputation. I have not studied your dealings. I tend to be much more direct when it comes to calling something out when I see it. I simply see a whole lot of disorganized people scrambling in all directions, and on the other hand I see a lot of people have one home run transaction after another, over and over. Trying to teach people the best practice can be challenging, like herding cats. I tend to be polite to people that offer me a shoe box full of knives for a high dollar piece, but these days so many new people just jump in without even looking, studying, hard to say that they even like being here for the sake of the hobby. More like hipsters wanting a pricey knife because it's cool. I just ignore that kind of thing, not even worth getting upset over. As far as I am concerned, I just want folks to have good experiences, and make sure they cover their bases all around...if they learn something in the process that is a bonus.

F'n hipsters.

 

[JohnWE]

There is a generally accepted market price. Automatically offering 50% of whatever the person is asking seems silly to me, and indeed insulting. Would you prefer we just give you everything you want for free so we eat the loss instead of you having to actually pay a fair value on something?

How is making an offer on a used knife that the seller is free to accept, ignore or counter an insult?

Where did you see me ask to be given anything?

If you buy a new knife, use it and then try to resell it who exactly should "eat the loss"? You're paying for the usage and I'm offering to buy the remaining value for what I think it's worth. What's insulting about that?

I've purchased about a dozen or do knives directly from numerous makers that I found on these forums since I've joined. In some cases I've purchased several knives from the same person. In the majority of those purchases. I paid them within minutes of them accepting my offer, in one case for more than they were asking. The sellers are universally happy with the sales according to my feedback. I didn't insult anyone nor did I ask to be given anything. I'm amused at the armchair analysis of my spending habits and my tipping policy, all from people who've never done business with me.

 

[JohnWE]

I used Strider as an example, whether or not you would buy one of his knives is a whole other debate.

So if I had a Spyderco PM2 that lightly used, and listed it for $100 and you were interested in it, you would offer me $50 ? I'm just trying to fully understand you here.

Unless I found evidence that your asking price is close to what that knife sells for in the used market then yes, I'd offer you $50 with the expectation that you'd make a counter offer. Given that your idea of lightly used and mine might be different. If you ignored my offer or told me I was insulting you by making it, I'd move on and wish you well in your efforts. I don't see how a simple offer to buy your used knife could be considered an insult but you're free to feel it is I suppose. At the end of the day you want to sell and I might want to buy so I try not to assume people are insulting me when discussing business. I also don't feel insulted when people try and sell knives for more than they paid for them, I simply don't buy them.

 

[leghog]

I've always been amazed by so many Americans being loathe to negotiate. Negotiation is the way of the world. If those Americans did much traveling, especially in in central or eastern Asia, they'd allow themselves to get ripped to shreds in any and every deal where they wanted to buy nearly anything.

Rusty, some folks on the forums think the Exchange is the same as a swap meet/flea market and they treat sales as such.

Selling and buying and bartering is still selling and buying and bartering regardless of venue. If the seller will not negotiate, the seller should just state so up front and very clearly.

 

[Peter Hartwig]

The problem with this negotiating idea, is that the seller is giving you the one price non negotiating price , not a higher lets negotiate price and after we haggle we will land up in the vicinity of this non negotiating price. So 2 different forms of buying and selling don't mix real well.

 

[RevDevil]

I've always been amazed by so many Americans being loathe to negotiate. Negotiation is the way of the world. If those Americans did much traveling, especially in in central or eastern Asia, they'd allow themselves to get ripped to shreds in any and every deal where they wanted to buy nearly anything.

Selling and buying and bartering is still selling and buying and bartering regardless of venue. If the seller will not negotiate, the seller should just state so up front and very clearly.

I don't see a loathing of the art of negotiation, it's more that the majority just completely suck at it. They have no idea how to approach, communicate or how a strategy works. Negotiation maybe the way of the world, but being good at it is a completely different matter. I disagree, venue does matter. Some places like grocery stores refuse to barter. Last time I bought groceries, they refused to give me a discount or price match any items that were priced slightly lower at a different grocery store. Sometimes the price is what it is, and any bartering has been done at levels before we get to the item. Usually when things are bought in bulk, that is when most of the negotiation has been done, the rest may not amount to much.

 

[KELAMA]

I don't see a loathing of the art of negotiation, it's more that the majority just completely suck at it. They have no idea how to approach, communicate or how a strategy works. Negotiation maybe the way of the world, but being good at it is a completely different matter. I disagree, venue does matter. Some places like grocery stores refuse to barter. Last time I bought groceries, they refused to give me a discount or price match any items that were priced slightly lower at a different grocery store. Sometimes the price is what it is, and any bartering has been done at levels before we get to the item. Usually when things are bought in bulk, that is when most of the negotiation has been done, the rest may not amount to much.

^ I completely agree with this! :thumbup:

Unless I found evidence that your asking price is close to what that knife sells for in the used market then yes, I'd offer you $50 with the expectation that you'd make a counter offer. Given that your idea of lightly used and mine might be different. If you ignored my offer or told me I was insulting you by making it, I'd move on and wish you well in your efforts. I don't see how a simple offer to buy your used knife could be considered an insult but you're free to feel it is I suppose. At the end of the day you want to sell and I might want to buy so I try not to assume people are insulting me when discussing business. I also don't feel insulted when people try and sell knives for more than they paid for them, I simply don't buy them.

^ Counter offer on this logic? What counter offer- there would be no counter offer!

JohnWE- you seem like a nice guy, but with all due respect- I find that your 50% negotiating strategy (on used knives), an offer that most seller's here would find totally insulting.

Example: if I were selling my used PM 2 & had it listed for $95 (PP Goods & USPS shipping included), & you came along & offered me $47.50- I wouldn't even respond. In fact, I'd most likely add you to my never do business list. After shipping & PP fees, I would net approximately $39.00 for a PM 2 that I'd much rather give away to a friend, than sell to someone like you.

Like everyone here- you're entitled to your opinion. I just think that you need to look at this from a seller's perspective, & how you would feel, if someone offered you 50% of your asking price. I'm guessing, that you don't do a lot of selling here on the forums?

 

[JohnWE]

^ I completely agree with this! :thumbup:



^ Counter offer on this logic? What counter offer- there would be no counter offer!

JohnWE- you seem like a nice guy, but with all due respect- I find that your 50% negotiating strategy (on used knives), an offer that most seller's here would find totally insulting.

Example: if I were selling my used PM 2 & had it listed for $95 (PP Goods & USPS shipping included), & you came along & offered me $47.50- I wouldn't even respond. In fact, I'd most likely add you to my never do business list. After shipping & PP fees, I would net approximately $39.00 for a PM 2 that I'd much rather give away to a friend, than sell to someone like you.

Like everyone here- you're entitled to your opinion. I just think that you need to look at this from a seller's perspective, & how you would feel, if someone offered you 50% of your asking price. I'm guessing, that you don't do a lot of selling here on the forums?

Thanks, I like to think I'm a pretty nice guy too.

I simply fail to see how an offer to buy can be construed as insulting. It's an offer, not an accusation or an indictment of your character.

I save my righteous indignation for things that matter, like the pass interference that wasn't called against the Broncoes that cost me $20 last week. I tried to offer the guy $10 but he made me pay him the full $20...

You are right about one thing, I don't sell here. Primarily because I don't tend to sell things like knives, I buy working knives that I can use in my bush crafting/outdoors hobbies or to be given as gifts, if they don't perform I'm more likely to give one away or sell it locally than I would here.

But I guarantee that if or when I do sell a knife here I won't be insulted by an honest offer to buy it, I may reject the offer but I simply don't have the time of the inclination to walk around feeling insulted over such trivial things.

P.S. Some of you guys maligning my character and such would probably be pretty surprised if you actually witnessed me buying a used item from someone, I can't think of the last time where either party walked away feeling either insulted or cheated. And I buy a lot of used items, from knives to clothes to firearms. I enjoy the process a great deal and I've made several friends of people that started out as simply sellers.