m390 sebenza?

M390 is not necessary the be all end all. I look at Jim Allen of Three Sisters Forge. He went away from M390 because, from what I've heard, it is difficult to process and get the heat treat right. Big production companies have more people and machinery to get it right, whereas smaller companies don't have the workforce or time to work with something so difficult . I find very little fault with S35vn, and if you look at crk's past, they've specifically used steel that leans towards easy maintenance vs edge retention.

It's been what, 5 years since he switched from S30v? If a change in steel is made, it will be some time before it happens. My guess is that when it comes, it will be something like B75P or XHP. I say like because CRK has a long history with Crucible, and will likely use something they develop together.
 
K.O.D. ........... I hope you are right with your guess of B75P or XHP. I like both steels, and have various folders in XHP.
Howver... My Brad Southard AVO with B75P is THE folder that has relegated my Sebbie and Zaan back into the safe. It's not JUST the steel, of course, but the dimensions. Check these out...

my Southard AVO..:
grip thkness: 0.460" (within 0.003" of Sebbie and Zaan)
blade thkness: 0.140" (same as Seb 25 and Zaan_
0.024" behind the edge
3.33" blade (tip to grip) (~1/4" shorter than Seb or Zaan)
4.5" grip length (~1/4" shorter than Seb or Zaan)

Very comfy in my hand.. Rock-solid, no-stick goodness...This is NICE!

I have owned many Sebbies, small and large, and several Umnumzaan. A small Seb falls out of my hand. The large Seb or Zaan is a bit larger than I really want or need. The AVO really fits me perfectly. YES, me lad, it do have ze flipper, but it works so well and cleanly and smoothly that I was immediately pleased and am VERY comfortable with it.
IF...Chris ever made a "mid-sized" Sebenza...something I've asked for a long time ago...it would likely be much like my AVO.



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Here's another knife, the Spyderco Southard (this model in black) that Brad has collaborated on. Gorgeous knife...Smooth.
[URL=http://s246.photobucket.com/user/Sonnytoo/media/Brad%20Southard%20AVO/Brads3_zps1c15b392.jpg.html]
 
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M390 is ok, I'd much rather have a CPM-M4, or Cruwear Sebenza. It's a hard working knife, so it should have a steel that is meant to work just as hard. That's not to say that the S35VN being used isn't "hard working" though.

I really don't understand all this craze about hardness, the steel isn't butter, and the lower HRC makes it much easier to sharpen and way less prone to chipping. CRK's S35VN is perfect for "The Working Man" and that's what it was designed for...
 
S35Vn is one of the most balanced steels I've experienced; highly corrosion resistant, quite easy to sharpen (on diamond), tough, takes and holds a fantastic edge for a long time. I'm not sure a significant improvement would be made by changing to another steel.
 
Aren't there reports currently of Benchmade having issues with their M390? I thought of that when I read the above post about how difficult it is to HT. Also, most CRKs do not appeal to and are the ire of the flavor of the month crowd because his knives will never be such.
 
uofaengr said:
Aren't there reports currently of Benchmade having issues with their M390? I thought of that when I read the above post about how difficult it is to HT. Also, most CRKs do not appeal to and are the ire of the flavor of the month crowd because his knives will never be such.
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ZT as well. Their newest knives are now using S35VN. Same as I mentioned for TSF. M390 just doesn't appeal that much to me, though its roughly equivalent Carpenter CTS-204p interests me more. I'll take S90V, S110V and CTS-20cp over M390 if I wanted a high wear resistance steel. Personally, I prefer more balanced steel, like S35VN, Elmax and CTS-XHP.
 
Sonnydaze said:
K.O.D. ........... I hope you are right with your guess of B75P or XHP. I like both steels, and have various folders in XHP.
Howver... My Brad Southard AVO with B75P is THE folder that has relegated my Sebbie and Zaan back into the safe.
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I agree, out of the sebenzas and avos I've fondled, the avo is honestly as well made as the sebenza and is more comfortable for me. And I'm not a fan of flippers but that one is an exception.
 
unit said:
Do I understand corrrectly that you have not personally tried a CRK with S35Vn and have formulated your opinion based on the test of another?

I would urge caution here as there are numerous "tests" out there that are highly suspicious.

I am NO fan of any S##V series steel (S35Vn included) but I have a CRK in my collection and must say it is a fantastic performer. Depending on how you actually use a knife, I would STRONGLY suggest you try it yourself if the design appeals to you.

There is a LOT more to a knife's performance than steel/heat treat. Yup, it is very important, but I'd take a nearly perfectly designed and built knife with a steel I dont really care for over a poorly concieved knife with the greatest alloy/heat treat known to man. I hope this concept means something to whoever reads it, I really believe it has more merit than many give it.
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I'll take the other side of this argument.

Or, you could spend over $400 to get a knife that doesn't hold an edge as well as one of your $40 knives. Can you imagine how frustrating that would be? That was my one and only Sebenza, I soon got rid of it. All the fanciness in the world won't make up for a knife that doesn't cut well and won't hold an edge, at least for me.
 
I know that I would love a Sebenza in M390, but if you really want a superior steel to S35VN that is still eas to maintain, why not just do it in Vanax? Nearly impossible to rust, holds an edge better by a large margin, but no harder to sharpen.

Also takes a very fine edge from what I've see.
 
I would love it just for variety. After owning my large for several months, by and large I think that I could get along better or more often at least with the small. The M390 isn't a versus decision either, trying to poo poo S35V which is an awesome steel it and Elmax are my favorite steels in folders. The couple of M390's blades that I have were awesome too!

That said it would be really fun and ahem, dare I say from a knife nut standpoint to have a sprint run Sebenza although I suspect the aftermarket for them will be outrageous.
 
sodak said:
I'll take the other side of this argument.

Or, you could spend over $400 to get a knife that doesn't hold an edge as well as one of your $40 knives. Can you imagine how frustrating that would be? That was my one and only Sebenza, I soon got rid of it. All the fanciness in the world won't make up for a knife that doesn't cut well and won't hold an edge, at least for me.
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That is a totally valid point...and one not too different from one I made several years back.

There are options. I make no claims that any of CRK options are right for "EVERYONE", or even "anyone-ALL of the time". But I do claim that they are right for a LOT of people MOST of the time.

Im not sure this thread is the right place to compare and contrast CRKs to $40 knives, so I won't. I was however suggesting a bit of caution in adopting some of the laughable knife "tests" out there. It is pretty hard to deduce the perfect blade for a stanger on a forum, but it is REALLY EASY to scoff a design based on a VERY limited set of performance metrics that may or may not have ANYTHING to do with what the stranger on the forum will actually do with the knife.

There are countless examples of "better" steels (depending on who you ask). Your choice would likely be in a tiny majority in room full of contractors using disposable bladed utility knives or basic jabenzas that they can sharpen easily...but it doesn't make your choice wrong.

All that said, I see a lot of Sebenza's getting sold in the exchange for a small loss. I might sugggest that that small loss is a worthy price to pay for the KNOWLEDGE of how it performed for YOUR needs. Otherwise, you will either be forced to wonder if you are missing out on something, or you will just have to parrot potentially questionable information you saw on a video...
 
Having used both CRK's S35VN and S30V I don't see any performance problems with either steel. :thumbup:
 
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I have a fixed blade in M390, and all manner of hand sharpening would not affect the edge. Took it to a professional sharpener, and even on a powered wheel, he had a hell of a time even raising a burr. I don't see a necessity for a blade steel to be so hard as to discourage any sharpening attempts. If it can't be maintained by normal means, what good is that blade in the long run, except for internet bragging rights?

A Sebenza, by design, should have the ability to be maintained, and all these super-duper steels forbid that.
 
sodak said:
I'll take the other side of this argument.

Or, you could spend over $400 to get a knife that doesn't hold an edge as well as one of your $40 knives. Can you imagine how frustrating that would be? That was my one and only Sebenza, I soon got rid of it. All the fanciness in the world won't make up for a knife that doesn't cut well and won't hold an edge, at least for me.
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I appreciate and respect your opinion, and if it's not right for you, you know that best. But just deciding in favor of some $40 knife (whatever it may be) because of edge holding is like saying "I'm going to get rid of my work truck with long bed and load capacity and get a Corolla, because the Corolla can go longer between fillups." But that is just my opinion, so take it for what you will. No offense meant, I just wanted to point out edge holding wasn't the only aspect in the design.

Sam :thumbup:
 
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