"Made in Sheffield" 1830-1930, A golden age ?

[Jack Black]

Here's another of my oldies; old pic, has been cleaned up a bit since then.



Rich

Nice Horseman's Knife

I thought this thread would be of interest to you

Really small world! I was at High Storrs for 6th form so you were probably there then, although a few years younger.
I've got a couple of other knives to post up but I haven't taken pictures of them yet, so I'll do it sometime soon. Glad I joined the thread!

That's Sheffield! Everytime I'm there I get talking to someone, and it turns out I used to work with his brother, or live next door to his sister or whatever! Yes, I knew quite a lot of the sixth-formers who would have been your contemporaries, had one visiting just recently in fact Welcome to The Porch

Here's links to a few other Sheffield threads you might find of interest

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/christopher-johnson-sheffield-1928.1718187/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/two-unusual-sheffield-patterns.1483990/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/sheffield’s-old-factories-workshops-pic-heavy.1479108/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/stan-shaw-gets-his-first-penknife.1436014/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/sheffield-museum-knives.1363520/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/sheffield-spring-knife-patterns-of-1816.1345975/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/the-dairy-maids-of-porter-brook-part-1.1229530/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/with-the-parser-the-devil.1216819/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads...sheffield-cutlery-industry-1870-1914.1197257/

https://www.bladeforums.com/threads/under-five-sovereigns.1196058/

 

[DaveyGee]

Well this'll keep me entertained for a good while to come. Many thanks Jack, it's much appreciated. I'll post those extra pics soon too.

 

[Rich S]

Jack B -

Yes, from "Key to Sheffield Manufactories". Great reference for old Sheffield knives and tools. Thanks.
Another good reference - "Register of Trade Marks of the Cutlers' Company Sheffield". Not to mention all the Wostenholm books and Rodgers and Sons book; also great picture book "The Heritage of English Knives". Recommend all to those interested in English cutlery.
Rich

P.S. You don't want to get me started on SAKs

 

[Jack Black]

Well this'll keep me entertained for a good while to come. Many thanks Jack, it's much appreciated. I'll post those extra pics soon too.

You're welcome Davey, look forward to seeing your other pics

Jack B -

Yes, from "Key to Sheffield Manufactories". Great reference for old Sheffield knives and tools. Thanks.
Another good reference - "Register of Trade Marks of the Cutlers' Company Sheffield".
Rich

Yes indeed Rich, I was posting it in relation to the knife you posted the other day

 

[Will Power]

I've just discovered this thread and I've spent the last few days working my way through it... fascinating! What beautiful knives there are! I grew up in Sheffield in the 70s, so some time after the last of the old cutlers had disappeared, but the history was all around.
I wonder if members might have any more information or comments about this chunky old pocket knife I bought recently in Norfolk. It's a Sheffield knife, but the blades are stamped 'Crownshaw Liverpool', which was a retailer on Dale St until about 1925. Although the knife was made maybe 1880-1900? I believe the Liverpool retailer Crownshaw was William Joseph Crownshaw, which is also the name (I think) of the Crownshaw of the Sheffield firm 'Crownshaw Chapman and Co'. This firm amalgamated with Wright Brindley and Gell in 1899. Is this the same person? Did he move to Liverpool? I'm sure there are members on this thread who know far more about it than I do. Thanks for looking at my pics.

You say you got that recently in Norfolk? Very lucky you are as it looks like a very desirable example of a Sportsman's type knife. Fine precision tools, quite heavy duty too it appears, with that type of thin slab but quality Stag. Stag which has become a beautiful colour like fruit cake. I like that capping at the end, I hesitate to use the word bolster as it doesn't seem apt, there may be a proper technical term for it? Also, the condition of the knife is very likeable, it's been used carefully, not over cleaned and yet not some rust corpse either. From the obvious quality of construction, I'd go along with your estimate of its age.

Look forward to seeing more of your collection.

Regards, Will

 

[Campbellclanman]

Wow- Interesting and beautiful Knives being shared.

My friends, Jack and Herder - Thank you SO Much for shedding such revealing light onto that smaller Knife of mine- I am Rapt to know what it exactly is now - amazing and detailed information- followed up with awesome Catalogue pages, just fantastic information- Thank you once again kind Sirs!

 

[Jack Black]

Thought I'd throw in a few Sheffield Penknives

TEW (L), Ibberson (R).

J.H. Thompson (L), W & J.A. Baxter (R).

 

[Jack Black]

Couple of smaller TEW Penknives, one in Ivory, one in French Ivory.

 

[herder]

DaveyGee, welcome and nice showing with that Crownshaw sportsman model. It has very distinctive crown cap bolsters which I can only recall seeing on a few sportsman folders by Christopher Johnson.

Rich S, another nice example shared with that Nowill horseman model.

Jack, wonderful picture of Stan's files sitting on his workbench. Thanks for posting the links to those other related threads which I am going back over and thoroughly enjoying!!!
And a nice selection of pen blade folders as well my friend.

Here is a hefty single blade lock-back folder by Brookes and Crookes (6 inch handles). With nice old stag, It dates to around 150 years old.

View attachment 1432775

 

[Will Power]

That's more than impressive Stag there H herder Wonder if Stag in those times were actually a different species/breed since long popcorn slabs were the norm, rare these days?

Particularly beautiful bolster work too.

Who wouldn't be astounded to have a knife such as yours?

 

[Jack Black]

Jack, wonderful picture of Stan's files sitting on his workbench. Thanks for posting the links to those other related threads which I am going back over and thoroughly enjoying!!!
And a nice selection of pen blade folders as well my friend.

Here is a hefty single blade lock-back folder by Brookes and Crookes (6 inch handles). With nice old stag, It dates to around 150 years old.

View attachment 1432775

Thank you my friend, fabulous Brookes & Crookes, and in beautiful condition

 

[danno50]

Rich - thanks for the additional pictures of the I.R knife. It sure is in good shape for it's age! Interesting nail nick as well. That is also a great Nowill sportsman's knife.
herder - Thank you for clarifying the meaning of NON-XLL, pretty obvious in retrospect. The Brooks & Crookes is an excellent knife with lovely stag.
DaveyGee - beautifull Crownshaw sportsman's knife. I really like that style stag and, as mentioned by herder, the crown cap bolsters are distinctive and a very nice touch.
Jack - great picture of the files on Stan Shaw's workbench. I think you are very fortunate to have the opportunity to know and be friends with a great old time cutler like Stan. I always enjoy viewing your pen knives. I keep my copy Tweedale close at hand to look up any that I have not heard of before, which is quite a few of them. Thank you for the links to other appropriate threads, I am saving those for a rainy day.

 

[Jack Black]

Jack - great picture of the files on Stan Shaw's workbench. I think you are very fortunate to have the opportunity to know and be friends with a great old time cutler like Stan. I always enjoy viewing your pen knives. I keep my copy Tweedale close at hand to look up any that I have not heard of before, which is quite a few of them. Thank you for the links to other appropriate threads, I am saving those for a rainy day.

Thanks Dan, I gave Stan a few of those files, he uses them hard I have a few small ones for him here, but I haven't seen him this year, and need to give him a ring. I am glad you have a copy of Tweedale, I'm surprised more folks on The Porch don't have a copy. Geoff would like to make it available free online one day. He published a Directory of Sheffield Tool Makers last year, which is a companion volume to his cutlery directory

 

[DaveyGee]

Thanks for your comments Will, Herder and Jack. I’m happy you liked my knife and I’ll find out more about Christopher Johnson, Will.

Here’s another little pocket knife which I hope might be of interest. This turned up in the bottom of a drawer belonging to my grandfather, many years ago.

It’s a decent quality knife, with its milled brass liners and tortoiseshell, although its single blade is well tucked-in and is just a little fiddly to pull out. It seems unused and unsharpened. The tortoiseshell page cutter/letter-opener (if that’s its function) unfortunately has a little nibble out of it; it was never made to fold into the body of the knife so it’s been rather unprotected. It has a prominent silver decoration, which made me originally think it was a souvenir from some ancient trip to Spain. But the ricasso is stamped ‘J H Andrew & Co Ltd Sheffield.’ Toledo might be famous for its scimitars but they didn’t make this one.

Toledo Works was a Sheffield steelworks which made springs for railway carriages in Neepsend, and this may perhaps be an advertising gift or even a gift to workers (if they should ever be so generous)? My great-grandfather lived in Pitsmoor near to where the factory was, and he became an apprentice spring forger in 1881, so I think it may well have come from him. I’d be interested if anyone has any further information about the company. His father was a razor scale-presser. Almost everyone was involved in steel and knives back then.

The second knife is about the same age – 1880s I believe. It’s identical (I think) to the one posted by Mick (Wellington) on page 27 of this thread. It’s from the same Glasgow retailer on Argyle St and is Sheffield made. ‘Six-thick’ and all the tools open nicely and work very well. The scales are quite thin so you can just see the shadow of the inserted tweezers through the scale, but no cracks or damage. I’m not sure if the scales are ivory or bone – possibly ivory but with this I’m not sure. I can’t see the canals usually visible in bone. I don’t want to test it with a hot needle though. For all its many tools it’s actually quite a small knife and easily fits a pocket. I found it in a fair in Norwich.

I don’t have any others to post about unfortunately, but looking at the ones from other members and reading their opinions and insights is great. I’ll have to go hunting…

Davey

 

[danno50]

Very interesting Toledo Works knife and a great old ad to go with it.
Fantastic old H.Brown sportman's knife.

Thanks Dan, I gave Stan a few of those files, he uses them hard I have a few small ones for him here, but I haven't seen him this year, and need to give him a ring. I am glad you have a copy of Tweedale, I'm surprised more folks on The Porch don't have a copy. Geoff would like to make it available free online one day. He published a Directory of Sheffield Tool Makers last year, which is a companion volume to his cutlery directory

Tweedale is a great reference. Quite reasonably priced as well, in my opinion. I ordered a copy from a US seller of knife books. They emailed me back saying it was a "print on demand" book and gave me to a link to a Canadian publisher to order it from. This was considerably cheaper that it would have been to be shipped out of the US.

 

[Jack Black]

Thanks for your comments Will, Herder and Jack. I’m happy you liked my knife and I’ll find out more about Christopher Johnson, Will.

Here’s another little pocket knife which I hope might be of interest. This turned up in the bottom of a drawer belonging to my grandfather, many years ago.

It’s a decent quality knife, with its milled brass liners and tortoiseshell, although its single blade is well tucked-in and is just a little fiddly to pull out. It seems unused and unsharpened. The tortoiseshell page cutter/letter-opener (if that’s its function) unfortunately has a little nibble out of it; it was never made to fold into the body of the knife so it’s been rather unprotected. It has a prominent silver decoration, which made me originally think it was a souvenir from some ancient trip to Spain. But the ricasso is stamped ‘J H Andrew & Co Ltd Sheffield.’ Toledo might be famous for its scimitars but they didn’t make this one.

Toledo Works was a Sheffield steelworks which made springs for railway carriages in Neepsend, and this may perhaps be an advertising gift or even a gift to workers (if they should ever be so generous)? My great-grandfather lived in Pitsmoor near to where the factory was, and he became an apprentice spring forger in 1881, so I think it may well have come from him. I’d be interested if anyone has any further information about the company. His father was a razor scale-presser. Almost everyone was involved in steel and knives back then.

The second knife is about the same age – 1880s I believe. It’s identical (I think) to the one posted by Mick (Wellington) on page 27 of this thread. It’s from the same Glasgow retailer on Argyle St and is Sheffield made. ‘Six-thick’ and all the tools open nicely and work very well. The scales are quite thin so you can just see the shadow of the inserted tweezers through the scale, but no cracks or damage. I’m not sure if the scales are ivory or bone – possibly ivory but with this I’m not sure. I can’t see the canals usually visible in bone. I don’t want to test it with a hot needle though. For all its many tools it’s actually quite a small knife and easily fits a pocket. I found it in a fair in Norwich.

I don’t have any others to post about unfortunately, but looking at the ones from other members and reading their opinions and insights is great. I’ll have to go hunting…

Davey

Nice post Davey, and a lovely pair of knives. The first one is an interesting pattern, many years back, I posted a whole thread about these two knives made by Ibberson (obviously nowhere near as old as your own).

I still have one, and my friend Duncan Campbellclanman has the other. I've shown it to Stan Shaw, but he didn't know anything about the pattern, and said he'd never seen one before. With the Firth Stainless stamp though, it would pre-date his time at the firm. It has some unusual features.

My father, his parents, and his grand-parents all grew up in that area, and lived on one of the small cobbled streets (Hicks Road) off Penistone Road at Hillfoot, opposite Neepsend, and as a boy, I had free roam of the area, and the bombed-out old houses and factories, which are long gone now.

That's a beautiful little Sportsman's knife, with ivory covers A lot of folks think the 'Lobster' description comes from the appearance of the open blade, but in fact it comes from the appearance of the cut spring. Here's some of Stan's

Getting late here, and I'm afraid my brain is a bit numb, but I might post a little more on this tomorrow. Thanks for another great contribution to this thread

Tweedale is a great reference. Quite reasonably priced as well, in my opinion. I ordered a copy from a US seller of knife books. They emailed me back saying it was a "print on demand" book and gave me to a link to a Canadian publisher to order it from. This was considerably cheaper that it would have been to be shipped out of the US.

Yes indeed Dan, Geoff Tweedale did knife collectors an incalculable service with his sterling research, which was certainly a labour of love. I don't think many folks realise how inexpensive the POD second edition is

 

[herder]

Thanks, Will, Jack, and danno50.
Will, I don't know that stag was any different in the mid 1800s than from today, but it was certainly more plentiful. Enclosed is a picture of a stag warehouse from Joseph Rodgers.

DaveyGee, very cool and unique "Toledo" knife. Both the shield and colored paperwork are fantastic. The multi-blade sportsman model is also superb and not common to see a "Six-Thick" folder with six blades on the same side and end.

Jack, also very interesting Ibberson models with great markings. And what a great picture of Stan's bench with some beautiful horn and pearl shown along with those neat lobster springs.
Both Dan and Jack had stated what an incredible reference Geoff Tweedale's Sheffield book is, and I couldn't agree more!!!

LongBlade had posted a very nice knife and box by Fenton a few pages back, here is another Fenton from around the mid 1800s. Long graceful curves on the blades and pearl handle.

View attachment 1434622

View attachment 1434623

 

[Campbellclanman]

DaveyGee, welcome and nice showing with that Crownshaw sportsman model. It has very distinctive crown cap bolsters which I can only recall seeing on a few sportsman folders by Christopher Johnson.

Rich S, another nice example shared with that Nowill horseman model.

Jack, wonderful picture of Stan's files sitting on his workbench. Thanks for posting the links to those other related threads which I am going back over and thoroughly enjoying!!!
And a nice selection of pen blade folders as well my friend.

Here is a hefty single blade lock-back folder by Brookes and Crookes (6 inch handles). With nice old stag, It dates to around 150 years old.

View attachment 1432775

Wow- Herder- Thats a fantastic knife!
Amazing!!

That Fenton is spectacular, especially so when considering it's age!!

 

[Campbellclanman]

Thanks for your comments Will, Herder and Jack. I’m happy you liked my knife and I’ll find out more about Christopher Johnson, Will.

Here’s another little pocket knife which I hope might be of interest. This turned up in the bottom of a drawer belonging to my grandfather, many years ago.

It’s a decent quality knife, with its milled brass liners and tortoiseshell, although its single blade is well tucked-in and is just a little fiddly to pull out. It seems unused and unsharpened. The tortoiseshell page cutter/letter-opener (if that’s its function) unfortunately has a little nibble out of it; it was never made to fold into the body of the knife so it’s been rather unprotected. It has a prominent silver decoration, which made me originally think it was a souvenir from some ancient trip to Spain. But the ricasso is stamped ‘J H Andrew & Co Ltd Sheffield.’ Toledo might be famous for its scimitars but they didn’t make this one.

Toledo Works was a Sheffield steelworks which made springs for railway carriages in Neepsend, and this may perhaps be an advertising gift or even a gift to workers (if they should ever be so generous)? My great-grandfather lived in Pitsmoor near to where the factory was, and he became an apprentice spring forger in 1881, so I think it may well have come from him. I’d be interested if anyone has any further information about the company. His father was a razor scale-presser. Almost everyone was involved in steel and knives back then.

The second knife is about the same age – 1880s I believe. It’s identical (I think) to the one posted by Mick (Wellington) on page 27 of this thread. It’s from the same Glasgow retailer on Argyle St and is Sheffield made. ‘Six-thick’ and all the tools open nicely and work very well. The scales are quite thin so you can just see the shadow of the inserted tweezers through the scale, but no cracks or damage. I’m not sure if the scales are ivory or bone – possibly ivory but with this I’m not sure. I can’t see the canals usually visible in bone. I don’t want to test it with a hot needle though. For all its many tools it’s actually quite a small knife and easily fits a pocket. I found it in a fair in Norwich.

I don’t have any others to post about unfortunately, but looking at the ones from other members and reading their opinions and insights is great. I’ll have to go hunting…

Davey

Davey gee Thanks for coming in and sharing your beautiful Knives!

 

[ed_is_dead]

Spent the last couple wks reading through this thread when time allowed.
Great amount of info/pictures. With the exception of the now deleted britishblades site this has to be the best resource for vintage Sheffield folders I've found since.

Could I ask the collective regarding dates for the following?