Maker; Piece; Price ?

Could someone help me understand why this matters? However you choose to restrict your universe (in whatever order you apply the selection criteria), you end up with a number of knives that is still more than what you can afford (unless you are very wealthy). In other words, thinking of that as a system of math equations, none of those 2 functions are constricting enough.
 
Kevin Jones said:
No one can buy from every good maker no matter how diversified your collecting philosophy, however an encouraging word or public endorsement can go a long way in pushing a deserving maker's career along.
Click to expand...

Of course it helps. But if youre recommendation is ultimately underscored by the reality that said maker's knives are good enough for someone else's money, but not yours, it takes a bit of the wind out of the sales (intentional mis-spelling).

Roger
 
Les - your philosophy is probably adapted to the dealing business, but might not be appropriate for the collecting aspect. As a collector, I am perfectly happy having a small number of pieces in my collection that I overpaid for from a market perspective and would lose money on if I were to sell. That's the price I pay for having a collection that is meaningful to me.
 
RogerP said:
Of course it helps. But if youre recommendation is ultimately underscored by the reality that said maker's knives are good enough for someone else's money, but not yours, it takes a bit of the wind out of the sales (intentional mis-spelling).

Roger
Click to expand...

Roger, you are still missing my point; it's not about money.
 
Starkman1 said:
I think following a concrete rule or philosophy on buying/collecting is difficult for a new collector, but perhaps easier and maybe necessary as you gain experience and invest more money on your collection....or maybe that should be the other way around:confused:. As a new collector, I put a limit that I'll spend on hunters and bowies with the exception of a few particular makers, so does that make me put price first? There are some makers work I favor over others, and some I won't even consider, so am I a maker first person? However, regardless of price and maker, if I don't like it, I'm not going to buy it, so does that make me put piece first? I guess it all depends on the circumstances and mood I'm in at the time of purchase.

Consider this: when you commission a knife, you pick out a maker (among a group you're familiar with), discuss the piece and he quotes a price....maker, piece, price.

I like to be open minded about most things in life and knives are one of them. But hey, I'm new to all this and probably haven't learned too many hard lessons yet:D.
Bob
Click to expand...

There you go Bob. You are a very astute new collector and it seems maker/price works for you.

Where's STeven? I can't wait to take my beating from him. :eek: ;) :D :)
 
In 2005, went to the ABS Expo in Reno for the first time(this is the last year for Reno folks, San Antonio next year!) I was basically JUST going to see what was up, and meet with Don Fogg, and hang out with Matt Diskin, and get my ass roasted by Barry Gallagher...can't even remember what I purchased that year(Just kidding, I got a great Nick Wheeler damascus fighter).

On the last day of the show, was walking around and was stopped dead in my tracks by this set, by Burt Foster...the hamon, the shape, the sheath..everything:

Had never heard of Burt before...or if I had...it never registered...If I went by maker first, would not have ordered from him...and did...and continue to do so.

This was delivered at Reno last year, custom made to order:


Burt is an awesome person, funny and thoughtful....but FIRST and FOREMOST...he knocks out KILLER work, effortlessly, with panache(or at least appears to)...after Reno this year, will have more Burt Foster knives than any other maker in my collection(he is in the orphan section).

Had no introduction to Burt, nobody recommended him to me...and by Kevin's thought process, I should have just passed him by.....that would have been a tragic loss for both of us(maybe not so tragic for Burt, but whatever.:D)

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Kohai999 said:
Four years ago, went to the ABS Expo in Reno for the first time(this is the last year for Reno folks, El Paso next year!) I was basically JUST going to see what was up, and press flesh with Don Fogg...can't even remember what I purchased that year.

On the last day of the show, was walking around and was stopped dead in my tracks by this set, by Burt Foster...the hamon, the shape, the sheath..everything:

Had never heard of Burt before...or if I had...it never registered...If I went by maker first, would not have ordered from him...and did...and continue to do so.

This was delivered at Reno last year, custom made to order:


Burt is an awesome person, funny and thoughtful....but FIRST and FOREMOST...he knocks out KILLER work, effortlessly, with panache(or at least appears to)...after Reno this year, will have more Burt Foster knives than any other maker in my collection(he is in the orphan section).

Had no introduction to Burt, nobody recommended him to me...and by Kevin's thought process, I should have just passed him by.....that would have been a tragic loss for both of us(maybe not so tragic for Burt, but whatever.:D)

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
Click to expand...

Not true, as I'm not restricted as to including other makers in my collection. As a matter of fact, I plan on adding Burt's knives to my collection (if that's OK with Burt) and plan on visiting him this year.

Reno '09 is in San Antonio in August '09 I believe.
 
Kevin Jones said:
..... As a matter of fact, I plan on adding Burt's knives to my collection (if that's OK with Burt) and plan on visiting him this year.
Click to expand...

Come on, Kevin!!!!

Burt is a NAME now, and as safe as driving a Volvo;)...if people don't know who he is, they just crawled out from a rock...his work is fantastic, and $$$$, and even great value for price...sheaths for example...if you can't make a profit on his work...you are just not a good businessman.

Not a good example.....when is the last time that you purchased from a maker that NO ONE on the Forums had ever heard of, because the piece was GREAT?

PIECE....Maker....price....personified....all in one maker,in one package..

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
 
Kohai999 said:
Come on, Kevin!!!!

Burt is a NAME now, and as safe as driving a Volvo;)...if people don't know who he is, they just crawled out from a rock...his work is fantastic, and $$$$, and even great value for price...sheaths for example...if you can't make a profit on his work...you are just not a good businessman.

Not a good example.....when is the last time that you purchased from a maker that NO ONE on the Forums had ever heard of, because the piece was GREAT?

PIECE....Maker....price....personified....all in one maker,in one package..

Best Regards,

STeven Garsson
Click to expand...

Got me there. Probably the first couple knives I bought and I still have them (below).

I'm at risk and take chances every day in my job and on the stock market. I do this for FUN. ;) :) :) :thumbup:

I know some of you take pleasure in finding the New and Unknown makers and that's great. I just don't pursue that.

LARRYMENSCHStagDamascusHunter003.jpg


HERBDERRStagDamascusBowie002-1.jpg
 
Joss,

Collectors think one way and Investors think another way. By virtue of the anticipated outcome they have to have a different "tac" with regards to their purchases.

Obviously a collector can buy what they like as it doesn't matter if the knife holds it's value or even increases in value....as that is not the object of the exercise.

If you want your knives to hold their value or go up in value, then unfortunately you will have to incorporate some of the "investor" guidelines. Once that happens you have given up your "purist" collector status.

Your collection should be what you want it to be.

Remember, the collector who collects merely for the joy of collecting. When it comes time to sell or trade a knife gives up the right to complain if their knife doesn't hold its vale.

Same for the maker who "Makes what he Want". They give up the right to complain about not winning awards, not selling out, not getting articles, etc.


STeven,

In answer to your question (well actually it was a question to Kevin). Makers I have bought from that no one ever heard of on the forums before: (Staying with the ABS Maker Theme)

Sam Butler
Dan Farr
Craig Camerer
Brion Tomberlin
Lin Rhea
Mike Ruth
John White
Brett Gatlin
Jason Knight
Gordon Graham
Adam DesRosiers
Matt Lamey
Shawn McIntyre
Reggie Barker
Mike Olive
Shawn Ellis

Well you get the idea.

Makers I bought from after seeing their knives on the Forums

Phillip Patton

As I said earlier,

Knife First! Then Price, Then Maker.

My job is of course to promote these makers...after I buy knives from them. Quite frankly if I wasn't willing to spend my knives with these makers I would expect someone else to.

There are lots of exceptional makers out there who the masses or forums are not familiar with.

By focusing on the Name or the Price you have a chance to bypass these makers.

The beauty of a collection is that it is yours....and you can have whatever you like in it.

Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
RogerP said:
Bob - bottom line is that by "maker first", you ONLY buy knives from makers A, B,C, & D. The maker is the FIRST defining criterion for purchase decisions - the FIRST factor that narrows the field of potential purchases.
Roger
Click to expand...

Roger,
Thanks for clarification. If this works well for Kevin, then so be it. Roger your taste in knives appears more eclectic. I believe the industry needs both type of collectors (if you can make such a classification).

There are certainly advantages and disadvantages of every collection strategy. But ultimately the collector gains an area of expertise and from this, and we all benefit.

If I have a question concerning makers like Gann, Andrews, Foster, White and Hanson, I'm contacting Roger. Matter of fact, I've been placed on Burt's and Russ' wait list because of the work Roger posted.

I certainly hope to add a Fisk to my small collection, but If I have any questions I'm contacting Kevin.


I'm with Joss though. It really doesn't matter in the end. Obviously we're going to end up with all these knives that we really don't know what's going to happen to them.

Bob
 
RogerP said:
Bob - bottom line is that by "maker first", you ONLY buy knives from makers A, B,C, & D. The maker is the FIRST defining criterion for purchase decisions - the FIRST factor that narrows the field of potential purchases.

If he's not on the list of "your makers" (whomever they may be), then his knives simply are not considered for purchase. Period. You don't buy knives from that maker's table; you don't order knives from that maker and you don't make purchases of his work in the secondary market. Unless, of course, that maker is ultimately elevated (by arcane and mystical rituals :p) to the status of one of "your makers". THEN, and only then, does the piece itself and the price asked get factored in.
Roger
Click to expand...

Actually Roger, I do take my knife purchases pretty seriously but sorry to disappoint you as there are no rituals, usually as simple as just a phone call. :rolleyes:
 
The great thing about your collection is that it is your collection.

As such you pick the makers, materials, theme, etc.

All that matters is that you are happy with your choices.

CAUTION......

If you buy only what you like, you may not be happy with the result should you choose to sell or trade the knife. Limiting yourself by whatever criteria can decrease the odds that you will be able to break even or only take a minimal loss on the knife when you go to sell it. That factor increases exponentially as you pass it down to loved ones who do not share your intensity or choices for the knives in your collection.


Les Robertson
Custom Knife Entrepreneur..."I invest in every knife I sell...knowledge, time and money!"
www.robertsoncustomcutlery.com
 
I started into custom knives with a Price, Maker, Piece approach. It wasn't satisfying, but it was the obvious choice given the very limited bidget.
After I had a bit more money to put in knives, switched to Maker, Piece, Price. It was much better but still got some knives I didn't like so much after all.
Switched to Piece, Maker, Price and this is what works best for me. I see knives as either tools or toys: there are some I carry and use, some I play with. In both cases, it's with the Piece that you interact on regular basis.
 
Kevin Jones said:
Actually Roger, I do take my knife purchases pretty seriously but sorry to disappoint you as there are no rituals, usually as simple as just a phone call. :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

Bob - looks like we'll have to nix the arcane and mystical rituals after all. Too bad. :D

Kevin - you seriously didn't get that the rituals bit was tongue-in-cheek? Even with a :p smiley? Guess I better just stick to deviously twisting your words to suit my own purpose, then. :thumbup:;)

Roger
 
Kevin Jones said:
Any disadvantages?
Click to expand...
Potential Disadvantage 1:
If you continually tell everyone you only collect a few makers and/or only post pictures by a few makers, you may be perceived as a pimp or a shill for those makers.

The opinions you voice could be viewed from the perspective of:

- "How does this affect his collection?"

- "Will this increase the value of his collection?"

- "Is he trying to keep a maker down to increase the value of his collection?"

If this perception exists it could be a disadvantage.

Potential Disadvantage 2:
You could also lose credibility amongst other collectors because of a myopic collection.
 
RogerP said:
Bob - looks like we'll have to nix the arcane and mystical rituals after all. Too bad. :D

Kevin - you seriously didn't get that the rituals bit was tongue-in-cheek? Even with a :p smiley? Guess I better just stick to deviously twisting your words to suit my own purpose, then. :thumbup:;)

Roger
Click to expand...

That's what you are trained to do, why not use it? ;) :thumbup:
 
"Can't We All Just Get Along?"

Rodney King 1991


In September 2005 Rodney King was arrested on suspicion of threatening to kill one of his daughters and her mother after the two women argued with his then-girlfriend.

Apparently Not! :D

WWG
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top