Maybe this is why...

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If you're going to make claims and then brush off the inquiries about your claims, your argument has failed. The burden of proof is on you, not us.

Stop with the hostile attitude. The attitude of KAI IDF and Welk are the exact reason why I don't recommend KAI anymore to anyone.

As far as I'm concerned you're a child and until you act like an adult in this forum you'll be treated as such.
 
What exactly do you want proof of?

That there are tougher stainless steels than 154cm? Are you really debating that?

I thought it was pretty well known elmax is superior to 154cm in every way. Since you would like me to post the information I will. If you believe I'm a child I could careless. Don't like my opinion ? Cry
If you're going to make claims and then brush off the inquiries about your claims, your argument has failed. The burden of proof is on you, not us.

Stop with the hostile attitude. The attitude of KAI IDF and Welk are the exact reason why I don't recommend KAI anymore to anyone.

As far as I'm concerned you're a child and until you act like an adult in this forum you'll be treated as such.
 
This thread is a good start with charts showing charpy ratings for various steels. It has 154cm at 28j
http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php/1221841-Toughest-stainless


This data shows elmax can reach 45joules of impact toughness.
http://www.kau.se/sites/default/files/Dokument/subpage/2010/02/26_349_359_pdf_19432.pdf




Crucible shows in a chart on this PDF. That 154cm is less tough than s30v and cpm154

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...joPgDw&usg=AFQjCNGSUn984JWuq7inyXZC28ERjnC2Rw
 
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im just gonna stick with where I would send a product to fix any issues....benchmades go back to benchmade, spydercos to spyderco, and Emerson knives go to Emerson for warranty repair. I like to keep it simple...helps me sleep better at night. :D


as for the "this steel is better than that steel" argument, i'll steer clear of that one. im no expert, but I know what works for me, and as far as im concerned, that's all that counts.
 
I can understand and respect that.
im just gonna stick with where I would send a product to fix any issues....benchmades go back to benchmade, spydercos to spyderco, and Emerson knives go to Emerson for warranty repair. I like to keep it simple...helps me sleep better at night. :D


as for the "this steel is better than that steel" argument, i'll steer clear of that one. im no expert, but I know what works for me, and as far as im concerned, that's all that counts.
 
The design IS the knife... what is a knife without a design? Please oh please answer that..

No, you are still wrong, otherwise the knockoff's are Emerson's too in your logic. The design is the design, and has absolutely nothing to do with the execution of said design, know as manufacturing.
 
I disagree. Oh well.

Kai builds his knives to Ernie's specs. Ernie plays a role in execution of his knives. So your wrong.
No, you are still wrong, otherwise the knockoff's are Emerson's too in your logic. The design is the design, and has absolutely nothing to do with the execution of said design, know as manufacturing.
 
They are not his knives. They are his designs and they are not built to the same specifications that Emerson's own company or custom knives are built to. They don't use the same steel or heat treat. In ZT's case, the way the edge is ground is also different. In a discussion of the performance of the blade, these aspects are very important.
 
Wow... I really didn't expect to get to 4 pages with this thread. It really was just a thought that occurred to me when I read about the tip damage on that 620. I still think it was a valid point that maybe this is one of the reasons for Ernie's choice of materials. We all know that 154CM isn't the latest steel... it's not the toughest steel... it's not the hardest steel. But it's a pretty good balance of all the characteristics that make a dependable and flexible tool. And it's a known commodity by now. People who use Emersons know what to expect of them and they know how to maintain them. Every time you switch to something different there's a learning curve. So I will continue to buy and use Emersons because I like the materials he uses and the design philosophy he works from. And I will continue to consider them to be a better value for the money I spend on them than the other newer, fancier, more popular knives that I pass up in order to buy Emersons.

In the interest of saving storage space & giving the mods one less thread to watch, I think it's time to close up shop here. Thanks to all who contributed, and to all, a good night.
 
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