Model 10 from R. W. Clark in Liquid Metal (LM1)

[Cliff Stamp]

R. W. :

Cliff, why are you compairing it to a steel knife?

Because that is the standard most will be familiar with.

If you had bothered to read ANY of my writings or interviews I have clearly stated that in most testing it does not compair to high quality steel blades.

Actually you have stated the opposite many times, for example that it clearly outperformed O1 in regards to edge retention on cardboard. You also support the idea that the durablity issues would also be expected with steel, implying there is no durabliity disadvantage to having a much lower charpy value and tensile strength.

your above quote :

Treat is as you would any other material ...

again pushes the idea that it can easily handle work a steel knife can.

Look how a Busse product outperformed another knife.

The amusing thing about this viewpoint is the irony regarding bias. Look at the above comments on the Model 10. For edge retention it was compared mainly to a SAK and a few other knives, no Busse*. It was compared to two Swamp Rats for other work, some of which it did significantly better than them, some of which it didn't, pretty much the same for any knife in any review.

[*I intend to use the Howling Rat for the carpet cutting and hemp rope eventually, it is just very boring after you have done it with a few knives]

How about sea spray testing, or acid exposure testing, or magnetic signature testing or any other number of aras that LM1 knives are designed to excell.

I don't think anyone is debating the point that it will excell in those areas. The high corrosion resistance is actually mentioned in the review. If you want to provide a list of some of this properties with some actual materials information I will include that in the review.

Why have we never seen photos of his tesing lab?

Because I am Jerry Busse - duh.

On testing and pictures, I have done this on occasion, and mainly don't for a couple of reasons, first off all there are space issues, but second pictures can often overpower words. If I say for example the knife broke off 1/4" of tip while digging in woods, or show a video of the knife breaking while digging in woods, the latter can often give a much worse impression than the numbers. This is why in retrospect I would not have shown some of the break pictures I had in the reviews as often that is all people end up taking from it. Videos would be even worse in this respect I would think.

I so think videos are very valuable in some respects, Dan for example does excellent work in this regard. Check out his posts in the HI forum. Videos would really help to clarify technique and give meaning to descriptions like dig aggressively, or use a baton with heavy force, even if the force of impacts is estimated, which isn't difficult, a video would be a lot more helpful than noting 50 ft.lbs or whatever.

Did you know that he was once quoted as saying that he could destroy any maker that he did not like?

Actually what I said was that I could *kill* any maker I like (I am a CIA trained assassin, my primary focus was the elimination of columbian drug lords, however my cover was blown and now I am in hiding, Cliff Stamp is a very clever alias for my true name [Dave "Crazy Weasal" O'Reily]) and take over their identity.

I have already done this with several makers, Busse for one. Ever wonder how he got such a lovely wife? That is because I am him and I am far more physically appealing, all the images you see are just heavily photo shopped, at live shows that is just me in a busse body suit [it gets hell for hot in there which is why all the beer drinking].

You should try to be accurate with your quotes R.W. especially when you are promoting "scientific" methods.

Roadrunner :

Maybe Cliff doesn't have any blades in those materials on hand...

I have tried many Cobalt variants, and no I don't have any now. This is one of the reasons I used the SAK as it was the most stainless blade I have. I think a real interesting comparison would be a 420HC blade with a quality heat treatment.

Wilson gets 54/55 HRC with 0.5% carbon, oil quench and deep cryogenics. This is a very corrosion resistant, and very tough stainless steel. That would be where I would go if I wanted high rust resistance in a using knife.

A number of makers have compared various Cobalt alloys to LM1. Carson, Simonich and Tichbourne have all made public statements. Based on what I have seen I would support them as being generally better. Talonite and Stellite 6K are a lot more ductile and not as fragile.

LM1 does seem to take an edge better than the Cobalt alloys, I remember burrs being a problem with them, however my sharpening skills have improved and I may just be seeing the influence of that.

Featherstone :

I will say this when I buy a knife I ask the maker on what he designed the knife to do and how it will function at certain task and what are its limits.

Clark is the one supporting this knife in writing as having no restrictions in use compared to a steel blade. He specifically claims that it can't be broken in hand, and can take aggressive digging in woods. He promotes the knife as as "one knife" only tool.

Back to the knife :

With the 22 degree fine ceramic edge bevel, the Model 10 was used to chop through a half a dozen pieces of 1x4 (there were not actually 1x4 just pieces of wood roughly that size). Most of the wood was clean, there were a couple of knots, one large and brittle. The wood was rather soft (no hard woods just stock lumber) so the pentration was high, about a half an inch or more. It easily chewed through the wood, however was as noted uncomfortable in a partial grip due to the slope of the end hook.

After the chopping the knife was used on some light vegetation, grasses and such it was still able to cut the heads off of individual stalks of grass (hay). When checked under magnification (x20) the chipping was evident as before but much reduced in magnitude, which you would expect given that the angle was increased. The chips were now mainly 1 mm to 1.5 mm at maximum in depth (so 0.05 to 0.075 mm not magnifiied). Based on this, I would estimate that with the origional microbevel of 22+ degrees you would need a better steroscope to even see them.

-Dave

 

[rdangerer]

Originally posted by FEATHERSTONE
...,I will say this when I buy a knife I ask the maker on what he designed the knife to do and how it will function at certain task and what are its limits.I will not go beyond its limits "just to see",because once you do that your useing the blade for what its NOT designed for.

Most people do in fact try to stay within the limits of the knives they buy, primarily because they have an investment in the tool and don't wish to degrade or destroy the tool and therefore the investment.

And therein lies the benefit for the open minded in what Cliff does. He's willing to expend a considerable amount of his time and money testing knives to their limits in a (heavily debated on this forum) manner that offers at least some baseline for comparison (relative baselines are few and far between in many posts). He exceeds limits near the end of the testing, so he can actually FIND those limits. And then publishes his learnings in a place for all to see (and then openly criticize, often in a non-constructive manner, with zero fear of a face-to-face confrontation). And sometimes he dispels overzealous claims.

I read, digest, think what applies to my needs, and I learn, and continue doing so. I learn from plenty of other people who post on BF also. I make better purchases for my needs, lowering the probability I'll find the limits of some of my hard use knives. The cost to me is only time. A bargain.

Originally posted by FEATHERSTONE
As for V-shrake,well I know him from another forum and have alot of respect for him and his knowledge,and when V rights up review's I learn alot from him,one of the things Ive learned from V is he can take nothing and make something very usefull,which can save your bacon if your out in the sticks and things go to hell in a hand basket.

Sounds familiar. And that is interesting to know. Personally, I could use some further education in wilderness survival techniques. Perhaps you could share info regarding the forum in which V-shrake posts so others can learn from him as well (if in a forum other than BF if different that this link):

http://oldjimbo.com/survival/

 

[wlifter123]

I'm curious Mr. Clark, how has Mr. Stamps "science" been called to the mat time and time again?

From what I read, his methods are designed to test specific properties of a knife and to limit as many variables as possible. All his tests appear to be repeatable. Are you stating that if I were to perform similar tests with a similar blade my results would vary?

 

[ColoradoDave]

Ron - just an observation, maybe you'll want to consider this a bit when you cool down....

Whenever someone becomes defensive in the face of perceived criticism, it gives the impression that they lack confidence in their product, service, or whatever it is that's being challenged. Even more so if they resort to name-calling and attacking the other party on a personal level.

Sure, emotion sometimes gets the better of us all. Yet it's amazing to me that someone who has worked as hard as you apparently have to earn a reputation in your field would risk damaging that reputation by reacting as you have here. And, unfortunately, those of us who are interested in reading a balanced, rational discussion of this blade's performance characteristics, both pro and con, will now apparently be denied that full benefit.

I also think you misperceive how other's view Cliff's tests and reviews. People read what Cliff posts because:

1) some of his tests do relate to everyday knife use in the real world, with results and findings that are helpful in optimizing knife selection and performance for the average person;

2) some of his tests are indicative of the kinds of extreme uses to which any of us might have to subject our knives in critical situations -- many of us would like to have at least some idea of what we could expect out of our knifes, under less-then-ideal conditions, if and when ours lives depended on it; and,

3) like him or not, Cliff is prolific, to the point that if someone's looking for independent knife reviews (excluding here reviews with a primarily martial, or self-defense, orientation) you've got Cliff, then Old Jimbo, maybe a few others, and really not much else.

I'm willing to assume that most people are intelligent enough to judge Cliff's work for themselves. I don't always agree with him, and I have no reason to believe that anyone does. If it sounds that way, well, maybe it's because you just don't find anyone else posting detailed reviews with such frequency for others to read and comment on.

Having followed these forums for some time, I've read posts by a number of knifemakers. Jerry Fisk and Bob Dozier, for example, convey politeness, good humor, and a kind of confidence in themselves, their knowledge and abilities, that's made all the more impressive because they never talk down to anyone, never lose their cool, and just seem like all-around great guys. I'd have a lot of confidence in ordering a knife from someone like that.

The flip side of that coin: I wouldn't have much confidence doing business with a knifemaker who can't even maintain his composure on an internet message board. How's he going to treat me as a customer? How will he react if I'm not satisfied with his product? I suspect a lot of folks really won't want to find out.

Nonetheless, Ron, I appreciate your on-topic comments and reply, as I do Cliff's. If LM1 is as good as you apparently believe, then I'm certain this will be born out with actual use, over time. It just seems unfortunate that characteristics of this interesting new material can't be discussed without people becoming inflamed, and personalities becoming the overriding issue.

 

[MC Chan]

Hi Ron,
I met you at the Oregon Knife Show..... we were at the Strider table.
I would have loved to ask you about your new knives, having followed the threads and being an extreme knife geek. You seemed extremely preocupied and perhaps even a little upset. I ended up checking out the Striders and leaving you to your thoughts.
I gather that is part of your personality. I can respect that. There is a lot going on in your life. I felt sad about your daughter for you.

Anyone taking the time to hang around here is keenly interested in the subject.
Cliff as an artifact of this world adds a lot. Always going too far, sometimes seeming to show some bias, but always a presence that adds something to a sometimes empty hall. Kinda makes you want to buy a camp tramp huh?

The people that read this forum are influential in a silly way. Advertisers call them "Early Adopters". It is the best slice of the market to influence.
And word of mouth is the absolute best advertising.
I look forward to meeting you and talking sometime.
By the way, I loved your initial review. It was the best review using photos of a cowboy chopping stuff up I ever saw.
I like your knives and I agree, you have the right to be as ornery as you want. We actually expect curmudgeonly behavior from knife makers, its endearing
Best of luck and happiness to you and your family.

 

[Cliff Stamp]

The stock work is designed to be so simple that it can be repeated with little difficulty it just requires a few basic tools and a lot of patience. There are some details which need to be considered, these are covered in the page on blade testing which is linked to in the review. Some are so mechanically simply they are very repeatable (push cuts through rope, slices through the pain can), others will vary will skill and physical strength (chopping, digging/prying) which is why other blades should be used as references.

This by the way is the current review, almost completed :

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/knives/clark_model_10.html

It isn't even clear from the above, that R.W. actually disagrees with the performance as described (most of it can be strongly inferred from the geometry and materials testing). He seems to be mainly arguing that the review is simply a promotional tool for Busse (specifically Swamp Rat knives).

The knife was indeed compared to two Swamp Rat blades, none from Busse Combat, a Japanese kitchen knife, a hatchet, a SAK (blade and saw), and three custom utility/hunting knives of various steels (a few others will be in the final review). All that R.W. saw was the Swamp Rat knives and further just the parts that they did better even though on several occasions the Model 10 had better performance.

Of course there are other quality carbon steel blades besides the Swamp Rats, those are just what was on hand. The CU/7 for example would have taken no damage on the pain can cutting, bone chopping, and also has a much more robust point than the Model 10. I gave that away so I can't readily do direct comparisons, but the details are in the reviews, only a very minor number by the way are of Busse knives.

As for the described performance, he clearly states (in contradiction to previous statements) "in most testing it [LM1] does not compair to high quality steel blades" . Which was basically what I described, along with some scope of work commentary and descriptions of the cutting ability which is mainly geometry based. This knife for example would cut alongside the TTKK that Joe designed, very similar profiles.

If you read the above, you will find that the statements I have made have been supported by people who don't even readily support me reviewing knives which makes a fairly strong statements about just how valid they are. Chad Englehart (Chad234,Eric_Draven,digger1), also told R.W. that the statements he made about angle cutting are not specific to LM1 but well known about steel knives. This is the same guy who constantly attacks my reviews regardless of what I write.

Note as well that several well respected custom makers have reported performance of LM1 in contradiction to Clark, of course he makes no such rants on them. I would also suggest that people interested start asking around to the other makers who have worked with it and see what you turn up. See how many you can find that will argue that the performance is better than a decent stainless steel (or carbon outside of corrosion resistance), or Stellite 6K or Talonite.

If Clark feels that this blade is defective, then I would gladly test another one, and yes I could easily videotape some of it. I would even be willing to drive to a local makers to have him witness some of the work. Hell you can even send the Model 10 to him so there is no possibility I can work my voodoo on it. Glen Parrell lives close to me, drop him a line if you are interested. He could probably take fifteen minutes or so to witness some cutting, chopping and bending.

As an aside, in general if any maker feels a review doesn't represent their product well, and does not trust the reviewer to do an honest review, the approach to negate the review is to make a clear statment about the performance such as :

"The commentary by Cliff Stamp describes several properties of my knife which I feel are not accurate. Specifically, I haved tested one of my Model 10's against a SAK and it had significantly much better edge retention on used carpet and hemp rope. The knife suffered less indendation and stayed sharper longer testing the aggression on paper and light cord.

Used for harder cutting the Model 10 also took at most the same amount of damage on bone and harder materials and can not be broken by leverage without a pipe. I guarantee that this is the performance you will see if you buy my knives. I am so confident in this that I will give you double your money back if my knives don't perform as I have described."

The problem with this however is that people can read the review and not see such a statement, BUT I will put such a statment by R.W. directly in the review, which is anyway linked to this thread. This has always been open to any maker who wishes to comment on work done on their knives. Which is why the "I CAN DESTROY ANY MAKER [insert evil laugh]" rumor is just really moronic.


-Cliff

 

[Cliff Stamp]

As an aside, several people, including me have argued that many of the properties that Clark is attributing to his LM1 knives are not specific to those knives but behaviour which can be seen in steels (the self-sharpening of coarse edges, angle cutting etc.). He is using this to promote his knives on the basis that this is somehow special to LM1 and thus is an advantage, when in fact they are common properties, well know for quite some time on the forums and published even.

Now compare this to the follwing quotes from R. W. :

There is a TV ad that is running (at least here in CA) currently. It is about bleach. You have the generic bleach bottles looking for their guarantee that they kill germs. The bleach points out the Clorox guarantees to kill germs, so why can't they. This leave the consumers with the impression that while Clorox kills germs the other brands don t. They never say that the others don't, they just imply it. Of course the truth is that all bleach will kill germs equally well. Clorox is just making it sound as if it is something special.

Cold Steel was the first that I can remember (I am sure it happened before them) to bring hype to an art form. They showed their knives doing what seemed to be outstanding things. Of course the truth was that any well made knife can do the same things. But since Cold Steel made such a big deal over it, it made them look as if they were something special. People bought into it left and right. And they still do.

Pot, kettle, black.

Ref :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=207550

The following is also interesting reading :

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=189995

In particular :

Cliff, would you be interested in giving one of these a once over? I think this is one time when a little science might be advisable.

-Cliff

 

[rdangerer]

Originally posted by MC Chan
The people that read this forum are influential in a silly way. Advertisers call them "Early Adopters". It is the best slice of the market to influence.

And word of mouth is the absolute best advertising.

I would certainly agree with those observations.

Originally posted by MC Chan
We actually expect curmudgeonly behavior from knife makers, its endearing

Just to offer one data point to indicate there is assuredly another viewpoint that does NOT appreciate such behavior:
* I do expect that some knife makers will act in curmudgeonly ways (from observation).
* However, I personally do not appreciate such behavior, i.e. I do not find it endearing, just annoying, and I suspect others feel the same way. A diversity.

Curmudgeonly implies hard-headedness, it implies hardening of the attitudes, and when I see that, I suspect there has been a suspension of interest in learning and improving as an adjunct to such behavior... so I begin to look for evidence of such. Curmudgeonly behavior doesn't have to follow age, but it tends to.

www.dictionary.com
cur·mudg·eon n.
An ill-tempered person full of resentment and stubborn notions.

\Cur*mudg"eon\, n. An avaricious, grasping fellow; a miser; a niggard; a churl.

n : a crusty irascible cantankerous old person full of stubborn ideas

 

[Gator97]

Originally posted by R.W.Clark

Cliff, why are you compairing it to a steel knife?
At least for those who never had LM1 or similar material comparison to steel is the most informative. E.g Talonoite is also compared to steel frequently, stating the properties in which it has advantages over steel, or disadvantages. I think it's absolutely fine.

Once again clear bias. Look how a Busse product outperformed another knife. Did it ever occur to you to compair it to a Stettile or Talonite knife? Of course not, Busse doesn't make any.
Actually in the review he never mentioned Busse, and comparison was with SAK?

I have had lots of meetings with leading knife companies over the past year and it never fails that Cliffs name comes up. When it does, eyes roll and everyone begins to laugh and snicker. It seems that everyone outside of BF knows what a giant goof this guy is. Here at BF he seems to have a following. That is one thing most of us will never figure out.
May be it's not strange at all? Here at BF whre Cliff posts the most, he has unbiased readers who think his testing methods are ok. And I doubt Cliff was on any meetings you mentioned, where he's considered a goof. May be that's the bias right there?

Originally posted by FEATHERSTONE

As for V-shrake,well I know him from another forum and have alot of respect for him and his knowledge
I think nobody here attacked his personality and knowledge. The point was that him and digger started participating in this thread with inflamatory messages and personal attacks.

 

[Ebbtide]

I'm still waiting for Cliff to make a knife.
I think it would do wonders for Cliff's credibility.
Then he can let the rest of us test it.

RW, you call 'em like you see them. That is to be commended.

And for everyone who has only read these latest threads, there is alot history here. I highly recommend a trip through the archives.
Maybe it will help you understand why the tempers can run a bit high.

 

[Gator97]

Originally posted by Ebbtide

I'm still waiting for Cliff to make a knife.
I think it would do wonders for Cliff's credibility.
It's ridiculous, I personally fail to see how it would do wonders to his cerdibility. Do woodsmen and trappers make knives? No, mostly they just use them, and I think they are more skilled in knife use than a lot of knife makers out there. So what?
It's the same if you asked a musician first to make an instrument and only then you'd agree to listen to his play. I doubt you'd find many.

 

[Ebbtide]

But Cliff isn't talking about Woodsbumming and trapping.
He it talking about how knives are made and how they perform.
Reads like knifemaking to me.

I'm not one of the rabid anti-cliffites.
When I first came to the forums I learned alot from Cliff.
He put words to things that I learned on my own.
For example edge geometry. I always knew that knife A cut some stuff way better than knife B. But B would be better on another medium. I knew what worked but not why.

But in all of my 47 years I've never had the need to cut a cinder block in half with my knife.

 

[A.R. Niemi]

Thats what I have allways liked about B.F. and other internet based groups.Any one can say anything!!And that don't make it gospel.Like this thread,it started out as a simple knife review and turnd into a pissen contest very quickly didn't it R.C.If you don't like Cliffs review of (YOUR LICQUID METAL) why don't you back up your opinions with hard facts and leave it at that!Why do you have to resort to personal attacks?Like a bad joke without a punch line?Are you the punch line? Some time ago I asked for B.F.members to give me the names of the reviewers they would trust most to review a new lock design (I) invented.Well cliff and Joe's name came up the most.I sent them both a finished knife.While they both gave factual reviews that I agread with they used totaly differant means.I told them both to do what they had to do to test the lock! Joe Talmadge still has the knife I gave him. Cliff payed to ship the broken knife back to me ,but he did what I wanted him to do (to test the lock).But he went further than that he tested parameters I didn't even think of and described how he broke the blade but found no falt with the lock.In short they both gave very positive reviews on the locks strength and reliability.And I was very happy to know that soon people would be buying my knives so I could cover the cost of development and maybe even make some mony working with my hands in my own shop.Well do you want how many knives I sold for all this expereance?Two!(2)ya thats right here is a totaly new lock design probably the strongest most reliable ever seen and I sold Two knives.And one of them was a direct result of Cliffs review!So don't blame Cliff if people are not warming up to (YOUR NEW METAL SUBSTITUTE)as fast as you think they should.We all have a story in life and I am very sorry yours includes a sick daughter (really ,I have a daughter)and I am glad to her yours is recovering.If there is one thing I have learnd with all this knife making buisness it's this.You may have the best thing since sliced bread but if the people don't want to here it there is nothing you can do about it.I dont mean any disrespect to Joe or Cliff but people make up there own minds and here as other places people don't allways jump on the band wagon the first time it comes around.If the stuff is good it will stand on its own merrits if not you can't sell it to anyone.
Good luck to us all.

 

[Cobalt]

Well, man, I got all exited about this liquid metal stuff only to find out it was not what I thought it was. I had visions of a blade that would grow from 3 inches to 15 inches and from 1/16 inch thickness to 3/8 inch thick with varying grinds from hollow to saber. Man what a let down.

Liquid metal sure didn't help this guy...

 

[Cougar Allen]

Cliff has made some knives, of an unusual alloy (mild steel), and he's even offered to sell them:

if there is interest I will offer a few models, the base price is $500 US - NO SHEATH. $550 with tactical black coating (marker), shipping is $50 outside of NL, expect one month for the dog team to reach the coast, at which time it is carried by seals to the mainland. 75$ for airmail (Pelicans).

http://www.bladeforums.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=261961 for more details....

 

[Ebbtide]

I forgot about that one.

 

[tique]

Interesting thread, lots of info and such... been following it for what seems like is too long.

I've read many(probably most) of Cliff's reviews and got some good, useful info out of them, but they usually go far beyond what I would do with a knife. Does that make them totally useful, don't think so. Does it make them totally useless, not at all. It's a knife review, read it, take the info you want, ignore or discard the rest.

I have several of R.W.'s knives, and will buy more. He makes good ****. period.

If I were heading out to the woods for a serious outing, one of his knives would be with me, as would several others, including at least one Busse. Sadly I haven't been able to do this for a while.

R.W.'s knives are made to cut, and do so quite well. Busse's knives are made to beat the **** out of, and do so quite well. If I had to pick only one knife to take into the woods for a survival deal with me, it probably wouldn't be one of R.W.'s(no offense to Ron). I would take one I could beat up, pry with, and still cut with.

I don't consider R.W.'s knives in the hard use category. I doubt seriously that I would ever chop with one, beat it with a baton, pry stuff out of wood with one, or any other such activity, as they are not really designed to do so. I don't consider testing with R.W.'s knives in the above activities to be terribly valid, as said above, they are not really designed to do so.

I like to think that the majority of the people on this forum are reasonable folks. We use knives for their intended purpose, to cut stuff. We know their limits within reason and don't push them beyond that. Why test them past said limits? It might be nice to know where said limits exist, I just can't find a valid reason to that. Pick a knife suited to your needs and go from there.

This thread has prety much prompted me to pick up a knife, probably one of R.W.'s in LM1 to test for myself and see how it fairs. I like what I've heard about LM1, and R.W. sounds very positive about it. I like his knives, so I value his opinion.

If we all were to listen to what a few people say about a steel, we probably would quit using all our knives... Some people don't like LM1, some people have had bad results with it. Some people have had bad results with and/or don't like every other blade material out there... that's why there are so many to choose from

As to the LM1 vs steel knives is not fair. Probably true, but it's also probably realistic. Comparing Talonite, Stellite, Titanium, etc. against steel probably isn't fair either. However we all use knives, and want to know how the cut... this makes steel vs LM1 valid as they are both knives and both cut stuff. Chances are most people on the forums have used steel knives a lot more and use it as a baseline, I know I do.

R.W. may sound a bit passonionate about his views, God knows I would if I was the one in his shoes. Maybe it's right, maybe it's wrong, maybe it is just fitting for the discussion at hand. I think no less about him for it, and hope others feel the same. Is Cliff pushing the material a bit too far, yep. But he pushes them all too far and that's what he does. We all get over it sooner or later.

Long post for a long topic. Take it at face value for what it cost you. Just posting some of my views. I look forward to the future of LM1, no matter what it brings. I'll most likely end up getting one to make my own decisions, and do some testing on it against the knives I own and carry to make said decisions. I urge others with questions to do the same. Only so much can be said with words, and I've never read a review that made as obvious points as taking knives out and testing myself.

 

[Trace Rinaldi]

Mr Angerer.. Yes I prefer the both eyes open shot much more!.. In CQB there is no time for taking out 50% of your field of view! No matter what Gat yer sporting... Glad to hear you didnt have the wife on the other end of the camera...
As for LM, I think there will be many new innovations with this type of material in the future, AND its already better than ceramics, or Titanium for many applications... We shall see what happens, for now lets just be glad there are new materials for us to argue about!!!

 

[mete]

Yes both eyes should be open and the head should not be tilted, bring the sights up to the eye. As I asked in the other LM post just exactly how do they make LM ? a proper metallurgical description please.

 

[Don M]

R W,

A few questions from a bystander in this fray.

I second Mete's request. I have not done a real search (don't have the time right now), but I did check out Liquid Metal's web site, and there is no information (that I saw) about what liquid metal actually is. Composition?

And a more important question. Given berylllium's very high toxicity (much more than any of the metals normally handled by a knifemaker), just how do you get the stuff to not be toxic, especially to someone who is grinding away at it? You say it is chemically reacted, not just a metal dissolved in the alloy. With what is it reacted? In order to not be toxic, it would have to form a very noble (stable) compound, or it would be susceptible to further or different chemical reactions, some of which could occur after breathing or ingestion. And yet, if it were reacted, it would in all likelihood contribute to brittleness.

You also say that there have been tests to show that it is acceptable for food applications and human implants. Where can one read these studies? Are they peer reviewed?

Forgive my skepticism, but my experience with beryllium, limited though it is, tells me that it is something to avoid. The toxicology of beryllium is well known.