More Tracker / WSK discussion - Hunted

blgoode said:
either way......I dont think He has permition to mass produce these
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Is the law actually different in the states if you make them high or low volume. It is ok for a custom maker to copy another design but a production company can't? I can see how you could make one yourself, but isn't there an issue if you sell it, even just once? Do all the custom versions of the tracker actually have permission from Brown or Beck?

-Cliff
 
Thats territory I am unfamiliar with. I know Tops has manufacturing rights of some kind.... I am not the fraud expert but it seems to me like he could be on thin ice? Maybe someone else will chime in that has a better background in this.

In his favor he did alter the handle shape so that may distinguish it from the Tops legally
 
Looks like Aaron is willing to let his knife have a review......

I was emailed by him and here is my reply so that there isnt any mud slinging.....I am just laying all my cards out on the table for those to see.

Here is my responce to his email.

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Hi Aaron,
Your not pissing in my backyard. I feel that your product is a rip off of the original simply to make a buck. Roger Linger makes his simply based off supply and demand in that his work speaks for itself and guys want it, so he makes it. Your marketing a run of 1000, at NOW $250 a pop, right off the bat..... You do the math. Its to make a buck my friend......not a good knife I am afraid.

Now - Lets move forward........I have said my peace.

I would like to see this knife in simple, regular camp knife duties against a less costly, ONTARIO RTAK SURVIVAL KNIFE, at $80 dollars a pop. What do you say?? LEt a 3rd part do the testing.........

This email will be posted so no one can say....."He said / SHe said" crap.

Brian

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So it looks like we need to stage a 3rd party to test this knife.

My personal thoughts will be kept to myself from here forward.....
 
blgoode said:
Thats territory I am unfamiliar with. I know Tops has manufacturing rights of some kind.... I am not the fraud expert but it seems to me like he could be on thin ice? Maybe someone else will chime in that has a better background in this.
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TOPS has a license to market its knife as the Tom Brown Tracker. The owner of that trademark (not copyright, not patent) is Tom Brown. And that's all he owns. The design is not his; it belongs to David Beck if it belongs to anyone, and my understanding is that he has opened up the design for public use upon his semi-retirement.

A patent would cover the design, if one existed, but it is impossible to file one now; there have been prior implementations on the market for way over a year now. Honor might require asking David Beck about it, but since he opened the design, it's anyone's to make.

Mark Terrell went through the process of asking around and double-checking himself before making his knife. I think he was more than careful about his honor. I'm not sure I would require a maker to go that far before I'd call him honorable, but often it's best to err on the side of caution.
 
blgoode said:
So it looks like we need to stage a 3rd party to test this knife.
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With Brian Jones permission, we can set up a separate thread to organize a weekend outing for this new knife. Do we have volunteers that are interested and willing to return the knife back to Aaron, NOT destroyed?

I'd first like to see the knifes sheath. That is the one deciding factor for me when I look at a knife. If it has a crappy sheath, for some reason I dont care for the knife as much.
 
I may have lost the thread, but aren't we talking about the Traker knife here? Or are we still off on that tangent about the other Beck Knife?

I thought the Tracker was Tom Brown's ideal survival knife. Seems hard to see how if someone expounds on a knife theory and teaches classes on how to make it (?), one could then turn around and say it is copyright/patent/ trademarked, whatever, as a knife. Sure nobody should steal any makers precise example of it, and one can protect any of the names associated with it. But it would seem like someone complaining about a person making an Ed Fowler knife after Ed has written hundreds of articles promoting his ideas to knife makers. Or, what would be the point of someone teaching survival shelter techniques and then saying "you can only use my version of this shelter from a designate supplier should you ever get into trouble". How is that going to work?

Anyway, I get the point that direct infringement is bad, but the Traker is a carefully layed out concept intended to be copied, as far as I can see.
 
were talking about a new product that was posted here. Taking the Tracker design and look but really didnt have specifics on RC hardness, etc.....
looked like a scam but might pan out to be a honest effort. Its up to him to organise a review at this point. I hope to see one just because I like seeing knives get good and dirty.
 
I have followed talk on the WSK and its reproductions pretty close. ONLY from what I have read in other threads, the name "tracker" is what the fuss is about. Tom Brown Jr. (again...only from what I have read) has legal rights to the tracker name, and that is why Dave Beck named his knife "WSK". Mr. Brown went to TOPS for the mass production. Also from what I have read, Beck was the one to bring the WSK to its final artisitc form.
So I guess changing the name of the knife to the "Predator" without any mention of the name "tracker" maybe could leave the knife in the clear of shark bites aka lawyers. Lastly, from what I understand by reading is that Both Tom and Mr. Beck are interested to see new variations of the knife.
Did any of that make sense?? LOL! Later guys -Damion
 
There is a pass around forum on Bladeforums dedicated to providing exactly that service to makers/manufacturers - user feedback.

-Cliff
 
"RED Scorpion Six Blades will be making it's first appearance at the INDY 1500 Gun & Knife Show on January 13, 14 & 15th."

Anyone see him there?
 
Thanks Brian. His knife is still listed on ebay, I don't know if I should post the number. If that is OK let me know. RS6_Blades added that the knife is made of 440C and tha scales are 57rh. He also added a second picture of the knife in a box. The box was exactly sized for the knife and had little plastic coated wires sticking uo through the back just like all the other boxes from... maybe China. While he added one customer's question he didin't add mine. The whole deal stinks. He still offers 1-2 day shipping!
 
I really dont think he has knives laying around....he isnt responding about letting the forum try one and he hasnt started a new thread. His site says he has these knife available in Dec 2005.....it aint 2005.....?:thumbdn:
 
blgoode said:
With Brian Jones permission, we can set up a separate thread to organize a weekend outing for this new knife.
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Brian, with all due respect, I can't see one good reason for any of us to waste energy on a bozo like this guy and his knockoff specials. I personally would rather not have the thread, but will not stop you guys if you want to do it and post. I WILL stop the thread if anyone steps even a tiny bit out of line on it though, and will not allow a new thread to be started in its place.

Sound fair?
 
blgoode said:
....he isnt responding about letting the forum try one and he hasnt started a new thread.
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Insult the guy, insult his product, and then ask for an evaluation piece - does that even seem reasonable, look at the comments made in this thread and others directed towards him and his product. It is hardly the case that it came off that this would be a good place for him to get unbiased feedback, most people have their minds made up already.

-Cliff
 
Wow Cliff, I can't believe you said that. Several other knife makers have said the same thing about their reviews here. I'm impressed!
 
The whole thing with Six Scorpion sounds odd. From what the guy says, I don't even think he knows his knives. What's so secretive about 440C steel? Predator? that's original!:rolleyes: and a stainless steel to that's gonna shatter when chopping. He raised the price overnight to $250 like ..... his knives are flying off the shelves and he just can't keep up with the demand. Give me a break.

Have a nice weekend you all.
 
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