My experience of Benchmade quality control

[Alann45]

One good thing about these threads: knifemakers pay attention. I don;t know if BM reps and company managers read every post, but I am confident they are watching. These kinds of comments found here make their way back to companies....that's how they remain in good standing - they pay attention.

Which is really the only reason I bother to post general negative comments about a brand. Hopeing the manufacturer may take note and make improvemnents. The other reason for posting a negative would be to help my follew buyers in avoiding an unsatifactory item.

I think you are correct that most manufactuers do pay attention to user comments. Some make it very clear they are listening (like Spyderco and Kershaw), others do it without much comment.

Honestly, I hope BM is also listening but I'm really not sure they care. The overall attitude of the company in the last couple of years makes me feel they believe they are now above having to pay attention to buyer complaints. I really hope I am totally wrong about that.

 

[StretchNM]

I am reasonably confident you're wrong in that assumption, Alann. Once again (this cannot be overstated), there are many more receiving flawless knives than there are receiving knives that are not quite sharp, or centered, or whatever. IF Benchmade is going through a phase of sending out a few more flawed knives than is normal, they will soon correct that. Management finds these things out and cracks down - it IS the way of the business world. No business....NONE....is immune to it. None. Not Bark River, not Dozier, not Kershaw, not Chris Reeve, not Benchmade. It doesn;t matter if it's a one-man shop or a 200-employee business.

Now, if they go out of business, then my theory only proves itself. If they don;t, again, the theory proves itself. Capitalism - it's our way here, despite the intrusion of government watering down the capitalism, it still works. ANd BM must abide by it or fail.

The fact that they willingly fix knives and handle complaints is the evidence we need to show that they care. If knife quality is slipping, eventually the number of complaints will bear that out and they'll fix it or, again, fail. They'll fix it.

 

[Myker]

ive owned nearly 15 or so benchmade's from early AFCK's to Griptillians. Yes, some of them were not as sharp as i would have liked i dont see it as a major issue. But i have had maybe three or so with loose pivots that rubbed the liner upon opening and closing the knife. Never felt the need to have them fixed the play was so small but im sure some guys will take issue with it. Need to remember as stated in another post, Benchmade makes alot of knives, there a production company. Want proper fit form and function? Then drop some real cash on a custom hand made knife.

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

I own several BM knives, and have never had any issues. Now, I grant you, most of those were purchased in a store after a personal inspection, but never had an issue with that, and the ones I purchased online were fine as well. That being said, they do not always come shaving sharp, but I think that's for the best. I don't understand the requirement that a knife come shaving sharp, as that's not ideal for every user. Those who, for some inexplicable reason, want their knife shaving sharp, probably should have the skill to sharpen it themselves. And shaving sharp isn't necessarily ideal for an EDC. Benchmade probably makes knives to satisfy the majority of customers. I have never seen a Benchmade knife that came dull, and as a general rule, the ones I have seen have been sharper than many of the other production knives that a first time customer might buy (Gerber comes to mind).

The other issues that get reported (blade play, for instance), often may appear post quality control and shipment to dealers. Certainly any production company will have its fair share of lemons, and as previously mentioned, I'd expect a BM Gold Class to be perfect. But it would be interesting to see what percentage of BM knives do experience minor issues, and how many of those issues occur before or after the knives leave the BM factories.

 

[taeku4]

As a relatively new knife user/collector, I'm suprised at how many people seem to be so concerned about seemingly minor stuff in production knives. I agree with the people who say that a custom knife, or gold class should come from the factory perfect for the amount of money you pay.

Benchmade though, is a production company, and like others have pointed out, they can't always produce perfect products. Also, if the knife will be used as a EDC, why does super perfect blade centering matter? Its going to get knocked around and beat up eventually, so complaining about having a perfectly centered blade won't change anything in the end.

Also, for the amount of money your paying for a new knife I'm pretty sure BM does just fine in terms of quality control even counting the "dull" blades they grind. I barely know how to sharpen my own knives but I've never had a situation where either my 940 or Barrage couldn't cut correctly. I don't need a super mirror finish in order to cut everyday stuff. Like the poster above me pointed out, a shaving sharp knife might not be something everyone would appreciate, especially people who don't know much about knives.

Finally, from personal experience, Benchmade seems to do a good job of making sure customer service helps you out. I called them about a slightly loose pivot on my 940 and they were helpful with what I should do. The fact that a production company is willing to help out and will actually answer your questions is a nice feeling. I guess that I just don't understand why some people would make such a big deal of some small problems that seem rather overstated in my opinion.

 

[Alann45]

Also, for the amount of money your paying for a new knife I'm pretty sure BM does just fine in terms of quality control even counting the "dull" blades they grind.

The amount of money you are spending for BM is toward the high end for production knives, and it seems reasonable that when the customer is paying a premium price he deserves a premium product.

I guess that I just don't understand why some people would make such a big deal of some small problems that seem rather overstated in my opinion.

In the case of this thread, the subject is QUALITY CONTROL not quality. As one poster stated correctly, quality is subjective. But quality control is not subective, it is quantitative and defined by the manufactuer.
The things that have given me concern with BM are issues that should be have been caught by any decent QC process.

Two example "problems" I had would definitely fall into the "picky" category and I was able to correct both myself.
But both should not have made it past QC. One was visually obvious to anyone bothering to look at the knife. The other was with an assisted opener and if anyone had opened the knife even once they would have realized something was not right.
Either their QC is so poor these things went unnoticed or they decided to let the customer or CS deal with it.

 

[flatlander88]

For the people that use their knives, do you really care if you knife is hair poping sharp vs hair shaving sharp. I need a knife that I can run a sharpener over in the field and have it cut meat, string, rope, scales, etc.

The truth is, there are many great knives out there and we are simply getting spoiled to the point where we are too picky. So picky that we lose all creditability behind our arguments.

Benchmade is a great knife, I own 25 and like them all. There are many other brands that I own and I like them too.

My best and favorite knife is the one in my hands when I need it.

 

[StretchNM]

I agree with you, Flatlander, but I can certainly understand a guy's desire to have a sharp! knife arrive on his doorstep. I really don;t think it's unreasonable to ask Benchmade, or any other maker, to deliver a razor sharp knife.

My experience, though, is that my Benchmades have arrived sharp!, except for maybe one (and even then it wasn't "dull"). I expect that and so far BM has delivered. The issue here is that occasionally a knife or three will slip by the QC department. When BM learns of a problem, the right thing to do will be to crack down on the QC personnel, whatever that entails.

 

[flatlander88]

I agree with you, Flatlander, but I can certainly understand a guy's desire to have a sharp! knife arrive on his doorstep. I really don;t think it's unreasonable to ask Benchmade, or any other maker, to deliver a razor sharp knife."

I absolutely see your point Stretch. I suppose I was picking up on some "too picky" undertones in some of the post.

 

[knivesandguns]

i never said that meaning kershaws were garbage or anything i probably own about 35+ kershaws and 50+ benchmades both are great BUT so are hondas and mercedes

hondas are mass produced have good quality control etc maybe at a good pricepoint for the public

mercedes are usually made to higher quality control better parts and sold to people who buy cars for more than transportation

translated kershaws are great knifes made for the public to enjoy and edc without worrying about ruining a 200$ knife etc

i would say benchmades are made more for knife collectors and law enforcement

Disagree. I've held many BM's--I've always found Kershaw and Spyderco to be sharper, more refined, and more robust than BM's.

Also, Kershaw has had many sprint runs in the sub $200 area, all with Ti framelocks and high-end steel. Can't say that BM has done that consistently.

 

[marthinus]

Interesting thread.

My most recent experience is with three Benchmade Bone collectors and I inspected all 5 that were in stock. All had off center blades with a cut out mark from the laser in the hole. Nor really a big concern for me, but it happened to that batch that was made, hopefully been corrected by now.

On a side note, retail for this knife is say $130 if you buy in the states. So minor flaws can still be expected once in a while IMO. Now paying $200 full retail in other countries with still flaws that can be easily seen....that is a bit of a bummer and for many people new to knives it will just pss them off because that is a lot of money for a knife with flaws.

 

[iandh]

Disagree. I've held many BM's--I've always found Kershaw and Spyderco to be sharper, more refined, and more robust than BM's.

Also, Kershaw has had many sprint runs in the sub $200 area, all with Ti framelocks and high-end steel. Can't say that BM has done that consistently.

I definitely appreciate Kershaws more than Benchmades at the moment... and it has nothing to do with price, intended market, or image. Only with the knives themselves.

I am constantly amazed with what Kershaw is able to offer in a USA made knife for the price... they are EXACTLY what the USA is all about IMO. I wish there were more companies like them around TBH. I understand that they aren't the end-all be-all, but it sure as hell is nice to carry a satisfyingly high quality knife in your pocket without worrying about losing a fortune just taking it out to open an envelope.

The things that made me love Benchmade in the past seem to be destabilizing, even though I think they are overall still there.

Spyderco was my first love in high end knives at least a good 15 years ago, and they still don't dissapoint to this day... now that's one hell of a knife company. You could call Kershaw my most recent fling, which is quickly turning into an affair. Benchmade is like my hot ex wife who turned out to be cheating on me.

 

[Slowstarter]

Hello there, it´s me who started this thread. I would never thought it would get so much attention. So I just want to make a little statement.
Benchmade is my favourite knife pusher. Their design really appeal to me. My future knifes will probably be from BM (if I can afford them). Even if I have to secure the pivot with teflon tape, or spend 10 minutes with my Sharpmaker to get them razor sharp. It´s very annoying but really no big deal.
Here is a (crappy) pic of my Benchmades (My Rant & Vex didn´t maket it to the pic).

 

[crimsonfalcon07]

I still would be curious to see how many people got the knives direct from Benchmade, and how many bought it from a dealer. If you're buying through an online dealer, you have no idea what happens between the time the knife leaves the BM factory, and when it arrives at your doorstep. Heck, if you're overseas, chances are the customs folks opened it up and played with your knife before repackaging it. Or if the knife is coming from BM's factory in Taiwan. I had a Leatherman that came to me with some serious bladeplay once; I thought it was an issue with Leatherman QC, but it turned out that the dealer had just repackaged the one he'd had out on the floor, and hadn't noticed that a customer had damaged it while looking at it. Had a fixed blade that came really blunt once (Buck Nighthawk), and that was because there were some people in the dealers warehouse who had been playing with my theoretically new knife before they shipped it. Unscrupulous, for sure, but absolutely not the fault of Buck.

I also have seen a composite rifle stock arrive snapped in half direct from the warehouse. It's amazing what can happen during shipping.

There are all kinds of opportunities for people to mess with your knife between when it leaves the factory and when it arrives in your hands, unless you're buying direct from the factory, or handpicking a knife from a store. Not all of those problems are NECESSARILY problems with BM QC. Many of them are, but then, it's also true that a large percentage of BM knives come perfect, and that's good for a production company.

I also don't think it makes sense for a production company to check EVERY knife. Sure some problems would be spotted if they checked every knife, but that's just not feasible, and it's not how QC generally works with a production company. Usually they check samples to make sure that the machinery appears to be working properly, but there's no way to have a qualified person checking every single knife that they produce. Some will slip through the cracks. The rest will probably be perfect. If you're looking to avoid minor picky errors that can be spotted on a quick inspection of a knife, and you want the company to have a 100% perfect record, you probably should be ordering custom, or from a smaller company that doesn't produce knives in the kind of quantity that BM does.

A fair comparison would be to compare BM QC to the QC of a similarly large production company. And honestly, if the customer service is good and they fix the problems, I think there's not really much room to complain.

(I really sound like a BM fanboy, and to be honest, I do love my BM knives. But hopefully this makes sense; I think QC complaints really need to be taken with a boulder of salt, because there's so many factors that usually aren't being taken into account).

 

[Alann45]

I also don't think it makes sense for a production company to check EVERY knife. Sure some problems would be spotted if they checked every knife, but that's just not feasible, and it's not how QC generally works with a production company. Usually they check samples to make sure that the machinery appears to be working properly, but there's no way to have a qualified person checking every single knife that they produce.

There are many variations of QC depending on desired results and what is being produced. In some cases QC are personnel seperate from the production staff, but there are other variations.

If you are making something like cereral or soft drinks, it is not logical to test and inspect every item. As you pointed out, in these almost fully automated productions they number the batch and test samples from the batch. Points in the operation that involve human involvement may have additional tests done at those points.

However, in something like knives or cars or anything requiring a lot of human participation in completeing the product, many companies include an emphasis on QC as part of each persons responsibility as they work on the item (Quality is Job One). Each employee is encouraged to check not only his work on the item, but the quality of the work that was done before it reached his stage in production. In this variation of QC, every item can be inspected by several people, resulting in a very high level of quality (with almost no additional cost) since every item is really inspected by many qualified people.

 

[spydusse]

The biggest problem I've had with all my BM 755, 111,790,760,grip and a bone collector lg walnut wood( with the exception of the 790 wich is Ao) is the detent , a million dollar company and they can't figure out how to make a knife with proper detent,

 

[Steven Andrews]

Um... Axis Locks knives don't have a detent. Actually, looking at the web's definitions of a detent, I suppose the Axis mechanism does function as a detent, but not in the common "ball sitting in a divot" sense.

 

[Sulaco]

I've owned several over the last 5 or 6 years or so and only had a problem with one of them. It was my original 556 Mini-grip. The blade was brittle and every time I used it, the edge would chip pretty bad. I emailed BM and they said to send it to them. They sent me a replacement and I've carried it everyday since. I am a HUGE (HUGE!!!!) fan of the AXIS lock and now won't even consider an EDC w/o one.

I haven't bought anything recently, but I wouldn't hesitate if I needed to. Oh yeah, both of my 556's came scary sharp and since the grinds are the same as what I prefer, it's easy for me to maintain them. The 154CM doesn't hold an edge as long as maybe some better steels out there, but it's super easy to get back in shape just using my jeans...

 

[mqqn]

Hi folks -

I have three Benchmade knives, a large grip, mini grip and an 890 Torrent.

All three came sharp, the 890 was the sharpest of the three.

All three were perfect, centered, and no issues that I could detect.

I have not had to work with the customer service end of Benchmade, so I cannot speak to that.

I am a happy customer, and rank Benchmade as one of the better manufacturers making knives today.

best regards -

mqqn

 

[Chris "Anagarika"]

One thing must be remembered. One person's experience with a brand will never represent it's Quality Control issue. However, if many gone through their experience and compare notes, the aggregated result will represent something more meanigful. This is why our forum serves as aggregator of people's experience, and thread like this is useful

Now, if a foreign (to US folks) company can have an aggregate that rates higher than a US company and offer the product at much lower price, does it say something?

Customer Service is there to take care of the issue, but there is a maximum limit where fixing defect will cost more than doing it right every time (read: almost right). No one is perfect, but blade rubbing liner or pivot that got losen up (no loctite?) is not meeting the standard commanded by the price level (50$ and up I guess). Returning product for warranty works means time & cost to both buyer & manufacturer, including 'hidden cost' which is the time & satisfaction of enjoying the knife.

Now on another thread, a foreign company in China as an example (from the numbers of buyer vs the lemon reported), is able to churn out many knives with more consistency (Do the always, centered? No. Do they rub the liners? No. Do they come sharp for slicing copier paper? Mostly. Do they come dull that it won't cut even the fold of paper? No. Are the screws loctited? Yes) than a US company, then it says the US company might not be taking QC issue serious enough, or simply gets complacent.

Statistically speaking, there is median, mean/average and standard deviation ... Excusing BM being a 'production company' and having lemon to such rate doesn't hold water, IMHO. Victorinox also produces 100,000 knives a day, but I have not seen any other production company have such tight tolerance level at same price range.

Please note that I don't hate BM. I used to have BM balisongs and keep watching BM for their Balisong lines.
The fact that such a thread not only exists, but runs 3 pages (up to now) says that BM has issue, but people are still paying attention, and not writing it off yet.
This thread, if anything, should serve as wake up call.

As someone mentioned, the market will decide the course.