New "designer line" of knives from Ganzo = Adimanti

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Again, I’m not here to debate this, I’ve read enough to form an opinion. I disagree fundamentally with the idea of intellectual property. It’s not the reason why I oppose cloners like Ganzo, but we do have that in common.

I'm getting the strong feeling that the sources you've "read" are of the "Feelings and my personal truth are more important than facts" variety. Good luck with that.

Glad you're in agreement on the Ganzo situation.
 
Again, I’m not here to debate this, I’ve read enough to form an opinion. I disagree fundamentally with the idea of intellectual property. It’s not the reason why I oppose cloners like Ganzo, but we do have that in common.

Uh huh...Right... :rolleyes:

P.S.

Ganzo sucks.
 
Alright, if a clone is a EXACT copy, then Ganzo is not guilty of counterfeiting or cloning. So what are they guilty of?

There is little doubt in my mind that they are a company with low business ethics. Especially if they are guilty of snapping prototype pictures after a request that they cease.

I am not saying that we should give Ganzo a pass on past actions but, rather question why other companies are given chances to improve and redeem themselves when Ganzo is not. Someone even thinks about Ganzo and forum members start reaching for their pitchforks.

I understand it as a counterfeit is an exact copy, stealing branding and trying to pass it off as the real deal. A clone is stealing the designs without stealing branding and passing it off as their own original design with their own branding or with no branding at all
 
I understand it as a counterfeit is an exact copy, stealing branding and trying to pass it off as the real deal. A clone is stealing the designs without stealing branding and passing it off as their own original design with their own branding or with no branding at all

Tomato, tomahtoe. I've seen the terms distinguished both as you mention and the person you quoted. In the end they're kissing cousins.
 
Playing the meta-game, there seems to be two discussions happening, one over the other. One is a black/white morality equation, and the other is a shades of grey legality one. Using one to argue the other really just adds pigeon turds to the chessboard.

As to the grey side of the argument, on one side "all art is theft", and on the other unlimited patent and copyright leads only to Disney. I don't want a Disney of knives, so that's why we have limits. The axis lock patent expiring is in general a good thing, it allows more innovation, and still provided for the profiting of the designer for a time. Ganzo used that patent without permission, and no plausible excuse. Other companies may have been inspired by it, and made changes to sneak around it, but that is how that system is supposed to work. Now the closest to the discussion at hand would be Hogue and the handle. Sure, it does look to be inspired by the Pardue design, but they changed it. So we can ask, did they change it enough? That is a "how long is a piece of string" question. Handles are the shape they are because they work. Culturally, knife people could start using wording like "it has a Pardue style grip" and maybe that's something that will happen. In that way it becomes a pattern along with words like stockman, folding hunter etc. In shooting you have "5.56 p-mag adapter". Its just a way of referencing the unimportant parts, to focus on it in a different way. Because if we do not allow any re-use of ideas, then the multi-blade slipjoint dies sometime back in Sheffield a very long time ago. The legal is an outgrowth of the culture, and right now the culture is okay with using ideas that have been around a certain length of time, but is not okay with using someone else's ideas right after they develop it, or in such a way as to ride on the other parties reputation. So to answer the question of why do some companies get a pass and others do not? "We" decide. Sometimes that sentiment takes time to swing, Hogue took some heat for a little bit, but it seems like its settled out. And Ganzo still sucks.

Anyone interested in the big river site and just how hard it is to pull fakes out circulation, thewirecutter.com has a series of articles looking into it, and some of the complexities. Suffice to say, if you think its simple, go ahead and read them, because the problem is far bigger than you think.
 
I can see there are some who are ok with those who would sneak in Grandma’s house, steal her recipes without her permission, and call them their own.

Read:

https://www.quota.com/Does-China-really-steal-other-countries-technology

My business was directly affected by this. I have a client who worked very hard developing several pedigrees of sunflowers that a company in China requested. The deal was made that he would produce parent stock after he spent the time and money in development.

Low and behold, after several seasons of work he finally dialed in the genetics and sent them their first batch of seed. They kept it, then cancelled all communication.

I have also had to chase “tourists” out of my farm’s fields after they had grabbed cultivars or seed from other crops.

Shady. I’m just not a fan of the practice
 
No. Simple as that.
:confused: To me this stance seems contradictory to the values many espouse against copying . So copying is very bad, but so is getting out of that business (not copying) ?

Maybe Ganzo is "simply" just more feared as too difficult to compete with as a legitimate designer focused company than as is ? o_O
 
:confused: To me this stance seems contradictory to the values many espouse against copying . So copying is very bad, but so is getting out of that business (not copying) ?

Maybe Ganzo is "simply" just more feared as too difficult to compete with as a legitimate designer focused company than as is ? o_O

What? No. It's the same reason why people dislike and distrust convicted serial murderers who act nice while they're in prison. Sure, they act civilized now, but they still killed a bunch of people. An extreme example to be sure, but the comparison is there: Ganzo is a trash company that made a lot of money off of the designs of others and there is literally no real reason to give them a pass on that history when they've never so much as apologized or given the wronged companies compensation. Also, we're talking about things that aren't a necessity for life nor are they the only provider of these items by far, so why should they be given a pass, or a second chance by people who know that past? In what way do they deserve it? It's insane to me that this even needs to be explained.
 
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For all the people stopping by to say "Ganzo sucks", "Ganzo is trash", etc., have you ever owned a Ganzo?

I know. You'd sooner lick the sharp lid of a Chef Boyardee can. I'm just curious if you've bought any knives that were made in China for another company. Unless you know for sure, they could be a Ganzo. Best not to take any chances.
 
I've bought one ganzo knife, it was a couple years ago when I was getting really into knives.

Had the "axis" lock and at that point I wasn't willing to drop almost$200 for a new benchmade.

Got it, realized I enjoyed the lock style,sold it and bought a real benchmade.

Now truthfully I believe the axis lock was still under patent at that point, but it really helped me make a jump to major brands.
 
For all the people stopping by to say "Ganzo sucks", "Ganzo is trash", etc., have you ever owned a Ganzo?

I know. You'd sooner lick the sharp lid of a Chef Boyardee can. I'm just curious if you've bought any knives that were made in China for another company. Unless you know for sure, they could be a Ganzo. Best not to take any chances.
Have you eaten dog crap off the ground? If you haven't how can you be sure it's not OK?

How can you be sure dog crap doesn't just taste like dog food? I would say you should take the chance and check it out. Don't forget to film yourself and post it in this thread.

This dog crap challenge is about par with buying a Ganzo knife. You'll have to excuse me if I chose not to participate.
 
:confused: To me this stance seems contradictory to the values many espouse against copying . So copying is very bad, but so is getting out of that business (not copying) ?

Maybe Ganzo is "simply" just more feared as too difficult to compete with as a legitimate designer focused company than as is ? o_O
Feared? It's still a long way till April fools.
 
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