Okay who is crazy here?

Both and neither.

If you are looking at this in relation to a new/current knife, it is ridiculously expensive, but if you look at it in terms of it's collectors value.....

With details like....

Bob Loveless Big Bear Fighter - One of the first five Big Bears from Bob's Riverside Shop (silver soldered guard and all), Burgandy Micarta Scales inset with Loveless Bolts.
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Then it is worth it.
 
Beautiful knife. Historical, even. But is it worth that much?
 
What is the going rate on this makers other work? Is it anything like that price?
 
Concerning pricing: He who asks those prices is not crazy but who pays...

As a knife it is not worth that much but as a possible collectible item maybe.

TLM
 
Originally posted by Triton
Would you pay the money if you had it? If I was Bill Gates I would not spend that kind of money on this knife.
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Well, since I don't have that kind of money this is kind of a moot question. What I do know is this, Dave Ellis, knows the value of this knife and is certainly not crazy. The people who have the money and would consider buying this knife aren't crazy either. When you consider that most of the people on this planet would consider you nuts to spend more than $20 on any knife, who's to say what nuts is?

Of course it's good for you to look at this knife and question, "Why?" You should look at this as part of your education as to what the high end buyers are looking for and spending the Big Bucks on.

Now what do you think that knife sold for originally?
 
Good points PhilL. My main interest is really slightly longer knives which most people even on these forums think is kind of nuts. Also as they say I suppose a knife (like anything else) is worth what people are willing to pay for it.

However to me, that knife is certainly not worth the pricetag, it is not even unique, but is rather one of a limited number of production pieces. Still if Mr. Ellis can get someone to fork over the cash for it more power to him. If he will then send me their address so that I can go be adopted by them even more power to him.:)
 
Maybe 18,000, but it's certainly not in the 19k category:)

I saw a similar one this weekend for 16K
 
A few years ago, a knife similar to this Big Bear but with stag handles sold for close to $50,000. It was reported that when JW Denton bought Al Williams Loveless collection(which was featured in the book:Living On The Edge) a few years ago the price was over 1 million dollars.
These are high dollar collector's folks. Aren't there people in the world who pays tens of thousands for certain coins or stamps??? Obviously these people live in a different scope than we do but it's nothing new. Haven't you seen all the Scagel's that have sold in the last few years for $20,000-$25,000? Or the rare Randall's that sell for $5-9,000? None of this is new.
Is a Moran or Lake worth the prices they get in the aftermarket? Is Mark McGuire's 70th homerun ball worth 1 million dollars???

Only if you can afford it.

Dave
 
I certainly can not afford it (and Gus can not either), but what Dave and Phil said. :D.

There is no reason why the knife can not be celebrated, enjoyed and appreciated (at least the picture) by us common knife nuts.

BTW that is about what the knife is worth give or take a thou or two :). Might even bring more in Japan.
 
Wow. Well I certainly learned my thing for the day. I guess if it wouldn't sell they wouldn't be asking the price. Just proves that there are knife nuts out there that are more knife nuts (and better financed) then I am.
 
As Bastid said, his knives bring even more in Japan. He is like a national hero over there even though he is not Japanese.
Another thing, ask any of the people like Denton,Stidham,Russell,etc. who buy and sell Loveless's if they have ever lost money on one. I believe the answer will be no.
On the other hand there are people selling so-called using knives for like $900-$1500 that were good values when they were $5-600, that you see lingering for sale here or on ebay occassionally which will never bring the money they originally cost. They end up staying with the original owner because they refuse to lose money on them.
So which is the smarter buy?

Dave
 
I was at Jaquas in Ohio a couple of years ago, (it is a really nice gun store/trap shooting facility), and they sell quite a few different trap guns and rifles. I was looking at a Holland and Holland 700 Nitro Express Rifle and the price tag on it was (gulp) are you ready for this? $125,000 USD. Would I buy it if I had the money? Probably, but I don't and I know it will never happen, but it is nice to see those sorts of things. I have a very nice target rifle that I take to my pistol club and I had a guy ask me if my rifle was for sale and I said everything is for sale, its whether or not you want to pay the price. I still own the rifle. :D
 
To me it is. If i had that kind of money I would buy it in a second. I'd buy this one hideout
too. :D Bob Loveless and Bill Moran have done more for the popularity of handmade knives than everybody else combined. Loveless designed the knife that most people think of when they think of a hunting knife-the dropped hunter(close second is the semi-skinner). He designed one of the all time great fighting knives-the big bear. He also helped start the Knifemakers Guild. He will be remembered after 99.9% of other makers will be forgotten and I believe prices of his knives will only go up. If I could only afford them :(

btw. A rumor I heard is that the stag big bear that was on the cover of the Loveless How to make knives book was recently sold for more than $150,000.:eek:
 
So you saw that one too, huh James :).

Just wanted to add Dave is one of my knife heros. Here is a very successful business person who has also taken the time to become an A.B.S. Mastersmith (and we think we are knife nuts :))

He takes the time to mail me pics of his collection and inventory because he knows how much I enjoy them. He is always open, honest and his advice is some of the soundest I have heard. A couple of years ago he had a Moran Cinqueda (less than 10 made by Moran of this difficult to make dagger style). Just getting to handle the thing was an honor and a privledge.
 
If you think this is insane, you should see some of the mind-boggling prices going on in the vintage guitar market. Never has the disparity between what you pay for and what you get been greater. It's a good environment for snobs, and not much else.
 
What is the going rate on this makers other work? Is it anything like that price?
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Err...I don't mean this to sound insulting, but you do know who Bob Loveless is, right? The knife itself, as a piece of craftmanship, probably isn't worth 19K. I doubt Mr. Loveless himself would have sold it for that much twenty years ago. But its place in knife-history, and the collectors value imparted by its maker's name make it worth much more. Besides, there comes a point where one is no longer paying for the raw materials and the quality of craftmanship, but for a degree of artistry incorporated into the work. Van Gogh's paintings aren't the most realistic ones out there, and they're made of nothing more than a few dollars worth of paint and canvas, but people are still willing to lay down more than the price of a house for them. I guess it depends on what qualities (artistic value, workmanship, materials used) you appreciate, and how much disposable income you have.
 
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