Older Buck knives hold better edge?

300Bucks said:
Your model is much better than the one I have. I just use it with fine belts as a buffer and polisher. Never touch a blade with it. Yours looks great.
300
Click to expand...

You can get a buffer and polisher belt/attachment for it? I didn't realize that.
 
David,

Do you know if the blades from Camillus that Buck used in the first Buck produced knives had the Camillus long pull or were they before that was added.

Bert
 
I'm trying to reword this ^ in an understandable manner. Is this close? DM
'Do you know if the blades from Camillus that Buck used had the long pull?'
 
I'm trying to reword this ^ in an understandable manner. Is this close? DM
'Do you know if the blades from Camillus that Buck used had the long pull?'

Now that you have reworded it, what is your answer? Let me put this in very simple English so you don't get confused.
When Buck got the excess blades from Camillus, did they have the long nail pull?

Bert
 
Last edited:
Yes, that is what I thought you were asking. The first attempt was confusing.
I've called Mr. Bos to ask him this and we haven't yet connected.
As soon as I get your information I'll post it. DM
 
Nice old knives.

20170312_165451_zpskmhpwamj.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
20170312_165430_zpspoomc4f5.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
20170312_165415_zpsva87m1kv.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
20170312_165354_zpsc3q3fz58.jpg
[/URL][/IMG]
 
This thread has wandered around a piece, yes even with my help along the way. From discussion on edge retention, heat treatments, Paul Bos history and Sharpmakers. Not too bad a wander, acceptable in the broad world. Discussion in the details is good and I will attempt in the end to bring all the heat treatment statements with a pinch of creditability together in the sticky in one or two additional small paragraphs with the link to this thread also. Whenever that end occurs.

I recently explained to a couple of folks that I have given up collecting and trying not to write anything that sounds definitive on model 300 details. The more careful we study these or any other model the more questions that arise. We wish the universe was ordered and finite but it isn't. Older Buck knives are like many of your and mine's families history's, the more we dig the more 'odd' things we fine. I am not sure we will ever know details like "Did loose, leftover Camillus blades travel to Buck and get Bucks heat treatment." I have been wrong and am cautious now of saying "this is the way it was", because my facts are certainly second hand if not third or fourth. I think we all need to take statements with a grain of salt and write statements on the forum that are not to be carved in stone. And each of us tolerate the questioning of our knowledge. If Chuck Buck, or CJ or Joe Houser or Paul Bos says 'this is the way I REMEMBER it" then that is likely how it will be recorded in history.

I think I have come to a point that this electric media world (cell phones included) takes up too much of my time. I , at least, intend to see a sunrise or sunset every clear day and put my hands in the river water once a week, or in the dirt or on the bark of a tree every day. And with that, read and write in this forum as a more casual form of activity willing to accept my mistakes and everyone else's writings. But remember rule number one, no cussing (or making fun of bald people)...ha

300Bucks
 
kyhunt said:
You can get a buffer and polisher belt/attachment for it? I didn't realize that.
Click to expand...

Are you referring to the Ken Onion Worksharp? If yes, is it a belt or an attachment. There are three attachments total and to my knowledge they don't make an buffer or polishing belt. Maybe they have come out with a new attachment?
 
Mr. Boss does not recall doing 300 series blades with a long pull nail notch. For information on this contact Joe Houser. This research has been interesting and informative on my end. Thanks guys, DM
 
MICHAEL5135 said:
Are you referring to the Ken Onion Worksharp? If yes, is it a belt or an attachment. There are three attachments total and to my knowledge they don't make an buffer or polishing belt. Maybe they have come out with a new attachment?
Click to expand...


Thanks. I misread 300Bucks comments.
 
And I used the wrong terms, I have a large variety of belts some very high grit, which I stated as "buffing". There is no cotton wheel or cork belt, I can't remember the belts grits without going and looking in my messy shop but they were grit sized in the several thousands. Check the company website, or I may have found those on some other site. But, I have achieved a mirror polish with them. His model pictured has several improvements over the NON Ken Onion model. I have a hard time using mine and not getting a rounded blade edge next to the tang. I believe it is called the choil. It does work well by the use of free handing. I am cautious to recommend my model to someone beginning to get into sharpening, as the low grit belts can really take off a lot of metal. I have 'buffed' some internal pistol parts with it with ease. I have a one inch belt upright "sander" with 30 in length cork belts that I use with green and white compound. It was a garage sale item, and I found out why when I received a shock by touching the motor housing while it was running. IF I use it, I am very careful to not touch the base. It needs to be scrapped.... 300
 
Last edited:
Here is a video that shows two exactly the same knives. Both have the same grinds, edge geometry, and etc. The only difference is the steel. AUS8 is better than 420HC and you can see how it compares in edge holding to CTS-XHP. Steel does matter (and so does edge geometry).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkZQpBqLF4Q
 
DocT, just wondered if you saw this test and had any comments? Thanks, Preston

pinnah said:
This was just posted in the General Forum regarding the performance of Bos heat treated 420HC compared to generic 420HC.

[video=youtube;aIpIZ-YCtRk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIpIZ-YCtRk[/video]
Click to expand...
 
DocT said:
Here is a video that shows two exactly the same knives. Both have the same grinds, edge geometry, and etc. The only difference is the steel. AUS8 is better than 420HC and you can see how it compares in edge holding to CTS-XHP. Steel does matter (and so does edge geometry).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BkZQpBqLF4Q
Click to expand...


Yes.

I think 3 things are true concurrently.
(1) Steel matters and must be matched to the cutting task. Horses for courses.
(2) Testing should match usage. Rope cutting favors carbides, which is why 420HC < Aus8 < 440C < ... < Boye's Dendritic Cobalt. But, rope cutting alone doesn't predict performance for other tasks - like wood working - that favor a keen, non-toothy edge.
(3) Heat treatment is done by the knife maker, not the the steel manufacturer, so talking steel type alone is insufficient. Buck's 420HC is better than most other 420HC by a considerable margin, enough so that it might compete with steels with more carbides on tests like Aus8 (and yes, some of this might be due to Buck's edge profile, not the steel).

oh.. (4) ColdSteel videos make me mouth vomit just a bit. ;^)
 
OK, since I started this subject, I have seen many opinions and I want everyone to view the video by JDavis882 titled "Buck Vantage
Retention Test." I do not know how to link this. But if you go to youtube and search under JDavis882 videos you will find it.

He does a real rope test and concludes that the Buck 420HC equal to many high priced steels and may even beat 154CM.

He was known as a real world edge tester and preformed many, many test on different brands and steels including some $500 folders. His sharpening videos are superb. He later got into trouble when he tried to get into making knives. I would not buy a knife from him, but I (and hundreds of others) respect his knife testing and sharpening experience.

Many people talk about what they think a knife will do, but few actually use it and prove it.

Bryan
 
Here's the video, Bryan.

[video=youtube;g6j5e-xGIqM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6j5e-xGIqM[/video]
 
Since Mr. Davis knife making troubles, I believe he has quit posting videos. This is unfortunate because his sharpening and edge testing videos were some of the best on the web. Bryan
 
OklahomaBryan said:
Since Mr. Davis knife making troubles, I believe he has quit posting videos. This is unfortunate because his sharpening and edge testing videos were some of the best on the web. Bryan
Click to expand...

Rope cutting tests tell us very little about the overall performance of the blade. All they do is tell what blades do well at cutting rope. If you want to win (or get near the top) of a rope cutting contest, get a Boye's Dendritic Cobalt blade. The fact that Boye's Dendritic Cobalt is NOT universally recognized as being the world's best all around blade steel is an indication that there is more to blade performance than just cutting rope.

If you want to get a better understanding of what steel is best for a particular job, give professionals who do that work access to multiple otherwise identical knives with different steels and monitor which ones they gravitate to over time. Then do interviews with them to understand what performance characteristics made them have a preference. Only after this basic observational research is done can you construct meaningful bench tests to try to maximize (or balance) the desired performance characteristics.

The approach I've outlined is time consuming and expensive, which is why you don't see it on amateur YouTube videos. The fact that rope cutting is easy and inexpensive doesn't make it a suitable replacement for more in depth analysis.

There is no single best blade steel nor no single, definitive bench test for blade steels.
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top